Forums >Racing>2022 Advanced Racing Thread
RIP Milkman
Welcome to the 2022 Marathon Advanced RacingThread!
First, I must thank the previous thread leader, JTReeves, who ran a great thread even though he was in/out with injuries in the 2nd half of the year.
Second, I've changed the name to "advanced", as we are trying to welcome more runners. We've combined threads with the half marathon thread as there has been a lot of overlap this year!
Here are the general rules of what we are looking for:
For those using Strava here is a link to the weekly generator (thank you Flavio for making this!): Strava Weekly Generator
Very useful spreadsheet from Jack Daniels on race equivalence, training paces, etc.: https://www.electricblues.com/html/runpro.html
Notable Quotes:
Mikkey - That used to be the case until Keen arrived. We now embrace Z goal.
Mikkey - A possible 2:36? No chance, unless the guy who measures the course is Stevie Wonder and it ends up being 38km.
CommanderKeen - Things seem a bit spicy around here...
Mikkey - Congrats on the win! Leading a race with no competition is basically a TT….so in my book a 1:23 is very impressive and there’s no doubt you’d have been faster with a competitive field. I’m now pretty confident that you’ll go sub 4 in your next marathon.
CommanderKeen - This is the runner's equivalent to someone "new to finance" asking "Is $1.6 million in my discretionary fund pretty good?"
Running Problem - Hope you're around in 15 years to see it. I'd really like seeing you at the finish line in your wheelchair for a photo.
Fishyone - I teared up a little when I read your moose mug story......What are you trying to turn this into the Walton's thread. Lets get a good Junk miles, dead zone or "soft runner" argument going and spice it up around here!!!
Zebano - Just because the RD is being kind and letting you do your little jog on the same course as the 5k doesn't mean they have any obligation to watch out for you
Running Problem - If only this "common courtesy" was shared by the 5k runners closing down streets to raise awareness to those with a lack of stamina.
Cinnamon Girl - you know my opinion on Strava, Instafuck, Fuckface, and whatever else there is.
Ian5 - Mmmm Bop
5K: 16:37 (11/20) | 10K: 34:49 (10/19) | HM: 1:14:57 (5/22) | FM: 2:36:31 (12/19)
I'll kick off my bio. 35 years old (no longer the spring chicken on this thread!) living in NYC with my wife and 1 year old daughter. I first discovered I had some running talent like many of you: I was usually the fastest kid in my gym class when running the mile. I wasn't that great in HS though: I broke 19:00 in the 5K only once and was never good at any shorter distance either.
After some professional exams in my mid 20s, I decided to pick up running again. Ran a half marathon in 1:43 and almost passed out at the end of the race. I don't know why, but I decided to keep running.
I ran my first marathon in 2015 at NYC in 3:12. After telling myself I would run only one marathon in my life, I made a decision at the bar that night that I was going to run NYC again in 2017. I've stuck with the distance since then, although I haven't run a marathon since 2019 as my 2021 race didn't happen due to a stress reaction in my femur. I was able to get a half marathon PR this fall though, so I've continued my streak of PRs annually to 8 straight years.
I've also discovered that the marathon is my best distance. I seem to be able to convert times from shorter distances into comparable marathon times, which I know many struggle with. I have no idea why given my mileage is relatively low compared to strong marathoners, but just something in my genetics I guess.
2015 NYC: 3:12
2017 NYC: 2:54
2018 NYC: 2:46
2019 Boston: 2:44
2019 CIM: 2:36
My running mileage has been a bit all over the place with injuries though. This past year was my lowest since 2017. I'd love to set a new PR in mileage this year too!
I'm excited to give another PR a go in 2022! I have two races planned (Grandma's and NYC). My other biggest goal for 2022 is to remain healthy. I am relatively injury-proned and I need to stay focused on strengthening work to prevent another big injury before either of those marathons.
Hot Weather Complainer
Thank you JMac for starting another dictatorship. Out of respect for those who can't convert, I will attempt to post in both miles and km.
I'm Steve, 45 years old and live in Christchurch, New Zealand. I'm pretty settled here now after 5 years. Previously I lived in Melbourne, Australia for 10 years and shorter stints in Wellington, Dunedin and London.
I started running in 2001-02 and soon settled into the half as my preferred distance. The marathon was always something to be done in the future "after I get sub 1:30 in the half", "when I'm more settled in my career", "when I'm not distracted by playing cricket or soccer".
That time never seemed to come with injuries or moves or big life changes, like relationships ending, moving cities/countries or the loss or illness of family members. From 2014 I started working with a coach and since then my training has improved, increasing mileage and decreasing injuries albeit with the occasional issue. I first went sub 1:30 for the half in 2004 before finally doing it again in 2016 with a new PR. I've had 5-6 races very close to 1:30 since then before finally going sub 1:30 again in November 2021, missing a PR by 8 seconds.
Despite, or maybe because of, all the cancelled races in 2020-21, my mileage has hit the highest level ever. After a solid 2020 I took the plunge and planned for my first marathon in April 2021. Unfortunately I got a small knee niggle around Christmas 2020 and wasn't able to return to normal training for a few weeks. By then the race date was looming too quickly so I chose a new race in June 2021 in Wellington. My training went really well and I enjoyed the higher volume and lower intensity. My goal was sub 3:20 which is possibly conservative given my half times, but I don't think it's sandbagging when I've never done the distance.
For the first half of 2021 the pandemic issues were pretty quiet in New Zealand but 4 days out from the Wellington marathon a Covid positive person from Australia went through Wellington. There wasn't a single confirmed case but unfortunately the hysteria led to increased restrictions in Wellington which led to the postponement of the race. That was a bit of a blow coming pretty much out of the blue. On the positive side, I was dealing with some tricky family stuff at the time and the weather on race day was horrific - horrific in Wellington is torrential rain and hurricane strength winds so it's possible it was a blessing and prevented a tough first marathon experience. I decided to run the distance that weekend anyway, in Christchurch where the weather was perfect and only at easy pace. It was pretty comfortable and good to at least have that behind me. The rest of 2021 had 4 more race cancellations, but I was only training for the half after that, knowing the risk of cancellations. It's slightly easier to maintain half training and keep extending until you finally get a race.
So in 2022 I go again, targeting the Christchurch marathon on April 10 as my first. I'm coming off my 2 biggest mileage years ever. The peak of marathon training will also be at the peak of summer so it will be tougher than last year, training in Autumn, but hopefully it builds my race day resilience. A nice cool day for race day would be ideal too.
Mileage Totals
2021 3859km (2398 miles) Estimating the mileage on the last few days of the year
2020 3442.36km (2139 miles)
2019 2331.46km (1449 miles)
2018 2308.67km (1435 miles)
2017 2291.61km (1424 miles)
2016 2796.60km (1738 miles)
5km: 18:34 11/23 │ 10km: 39:10 8/23 │ HM: 1:26:48 9/23 │ M: 3:34:49 6/23
Upcoming Races:
Motorway Half Marathon February 25, 2024
Christchurch Marathon April 21, 2024
I think for Rule 6 you meant Bekele > Kipchoge in terms of the overall long distance GOAT. Except if you are talking specifically about the marathon, then it's the other way.
Anyway, mostly I frequent the sub-1:30 thread and just loiter around here for the banter, since I retired from marathons a year ago. Also to wind up JMac by using the far more logical metric system.
3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)
10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)
* Net downhill course
Last race: Omaha HM, 3 Dec, pushed the limits.
Up next: The Goat, 20 Jan, don't die.
"CONSISTENCY IS KING"
Welcome Steve. Let's hope all of our 2022s are better than what we dealt with in 2021 with COVID. It'll be interesting to track your training but I think sub 3:20 is a good number to start with. I didn't realize your mileage has increased as much as it has. You're really set up for success here with this cycle.
I added my two planned marathons. I have to go with a PR at Grandma's in June even though I just lost 2 months with this injury. Of course, that's assuming I can stay healthy in my build up this time around. I just finished PT today for the final time and things feel MUCH stronger than they did when I got there. I just need to keep up a good routine on a regular basis (paging Mr. Flavio to the marathon thread)
ETA: Nope, meant Kipchoge > Bekele as the all around GOAT, especially with Bekele looking terrible once again all year long. This has been decided as long as I am thread leader. There will be no further discussion until 2023.
Problem Child
Name: Running Problem/RP
Age: 37-38
Gender: yes I have one
Location: My own personal hell, or inside your head.
Running History: Adult onset runner. Started running when I was about 200 pounds (90.7 kg, 14.28 stones) (I'm 5'8" tall) when I learned about Tough Mudder. Did 3 of those and when the "season" ended I took up 5k and 10k running. Entered my first half marathon with a goal of sub 2 because I'd heard about a sub 4 marathon, and ran a 1:56-58 just destroyed. I've run 8 marathons (CIM x4, Reno x2, Chicago, and Revel Mt. Charleston) with 2 sub 3 marathons to my name and a PR of 2:56:07.
Goals for 2022: Obtain a NYC Marathon qualifying time
"favoUrite" races: California International Marathon.
Fun Fact #1: I told my wife I would quit running after I ran the Boston Marathon.
Fun Fact #2: I title all my runs on Strava "That time ____" because there is always something going on during a run
Fun Fact #3: I have been able to talk during every PR race I've run.
Fun Fact #4 I PR'd the half marathon twice while running a PR marathon. The half marathon PRs were back to back.
Other than these things, I have focused on the marathon when actually getting into the Boston marathon became a goal after CIM 2017. Times got faster, I absolutely used the discussions and knowledge here to improve, and have focused on the marathon since. I enjoy the 40-50 mile weeks with 90ish minute long runs, and it seems to be working for me so I keep doing it. I've paced Western States from Forresthill to the finish twice. I'm typically not capable of being serious, and go through bouts of depression, anger, and self doubt. I'm kind of incapable of understanding what it is I'm getting myself into when I commit to things, and I don't typically give myself the option to fail/quit because I view quitting as a disease. I'm also really blunt/direct/straightforward. I have this running problem where I have a problem running. If it isn't physical it is psychoanalytical.
Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.
VDOT 55.2
5k18:xx | Marathon 2:55:22
Looks like have the whole sub-90 thread coming over here
I'm Shawn, I ran really poorly in high school (20:04 5k) but have some great memories of our coach telling us easy days had to be so easy that we could sing a song so we ran around singing "Amish Paradise" by Wierd Al. I became an adult, got fat, my brother ran a marathon and lorded it over me so I started running. I lost some weight and got a bit faster and serious about this thing. I'm not sure I'm advanced in anything other than age as I'm about to turn 41 (especially compared to our dear leader, The Autumn Bantam) . I have a list of eventual running goals that I feel I'm running out of time on: Sub 20 5k ✅, sub 90 half, sub 40 10k, sub 5 mile and a sub 3 Marathon. Despite that, my favorite races are all trail races (non-ultra distances) I have 3 extremely uninspiring marathon results with various excuses that could be made but really I just wasn't ready.
p.s. I'm pissed because I just found out I cannot access any activity on strava earlier than 2015 hopefully that's a short term glitch
I've been running 40+mpw for a couple years so it's high time I take a crack at bringing that in line with my other PRs. As a way way too early goal I'm targeting 3:10. I'm targeting the Twin Cities Marathon so I can stay with my parents and make logistics easy while seeing a beautiful course. My goal for early in the year is to maintain 45mpw while constraining and doing 3 triathlon events: a sprint, and Olympic and best of all an xterra off road tri where I can swim, mountain bike and then trail run!!! In the summer I'll switch to higher mileage and marathon training.
the best laid plans...
1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 41:20 (2021), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Marathon - 3:37:17 (2018)
Will use RP's template as I like how he structured it (not how he responded though
Name: Oleg
Age: 56
Gender: male
Location: SF East Bay, originally from Russia
Running History: Don't know my high school's times as we didn't run anything longer than 100 meters. But we we skiing for very long distances and I was 1st-2nd on my school's team. Played soccer since I was in kindergarten till 22 yo. Then stopped doing any physical activities for the next 23 years. Started back when I was 45 yo, for no reason, but then somehow dragged myself into running 5K 3 months after I started running, then HM a month later and then FM in another 5 months. Somehow continued to run since then, improving my PB's right until 2015-2016. Then, in 2017 discovered there is an ageism in tech where I worked since forever and that's somehow took a huge toll on me. Since then I never been the same . Still, ran decent 2200 miles this year and hope to run even more next year as higher mileage seems to be working for me the best.
2021: Pretty disappointing, discouraging year. The only positive - decent yearly mileage that hopefully helps me into year 2022
Goals for 2022: back to sub 3 in my marathons
favorite races: used to be CIM, but this year organization kind of put a dent on my "like" for it and the pricing policy for 2022 makes it similar to hated by me SF marathon (that's why I never ran it while living next to it)
Also, year 2022 (or possibly 2023), I supposed to have face to face race to some Brit runner who for some reason all this time thought he is faster than me (to his credit my 2021 results make him more confident about it). But I will not give up without a fight. So, the plan is possibly run London marathon - for some reason I think it might be possible for non-Brit person like me.
So far I signed up for Oakland marathon that will occur on March 20th and Quicksilver 100K ultra on May 14th 2022. I am also thinking about running Napa Valley on March 6th and CIM on Dec 4th 2022. But I am not signed for the last two. As I mentioned, I have hopes to run London marathon in 2022. For all marathons the goal for now - sub 3. For Quicksilver 100K - just need to run faster than 16 hours to qualify for WSER 100 miles lottery.
paces PRs - 5K - 5:48 / 10K - 6:05 / HM - 6:14 / FM - 6:26 per mile
Zebano - welcome! I didn't know you were planning on running a marathon. We've had a lot of people come and go over the last few years, but you're probably the steadiest we've seen in the past 2 years, which is great. Happy to have you here. When is the race, and what is the goal? I like the sound of 3:10 with your 10K time, but maybe 3:15 is right
RP - is your next race Boston? I know you signed up but no mention in your post of running it.
Cal - you are a racing machine. I'll add the first 2 races. Think about NYC this fall! Registration for time qualifiers should start in January and as long as you sign up on day 1, you should be guaranteed entry.
Cal - have you considered that you're losing to the Brit because you do too many long distance races?
JMac - If this were a spring marathon I'd probably target 3:20 because my speed has never translated to the marathon well and the long runs tend to aggravate my old hamstring injury (fingers crossed because it didn't happen last year which is part of why I want to do this). All I can find is that Marathon weekend is Oct 1 & 2 so I have all year to build my fitness so I'll start with the aggressive goal of 3:10 which happens to also be a BQ time. I wont set any real goals until much closer to race day.
Wait... Who said I am losing to the Brit? At least I am not aware of any losses at the moment .
JMac - yeah, I should think fast. If I get to London and decide to run NYC, it will be London in October, NYC in November and CIM in December. The same burden of races I had this year. Unless I just wanna jog NYC .
I've decided to put off Boston until 2023 with my CIM 2021 time being an even better BQ. It would be really great for me to run Boston 2022 just to get an equal comparison for CIM and Boston at an equal physical fitness. I'll run 2023 with high hopes of an in person meeting, as well as a longer (child free) trip with the wife. I've wanted to see some of Boston's history for a while and if I ran in 2022 I would most likely fly there to run the race, then immediately home. Technically the only additional cost of bringing the wife is her plane ticket and now I'm signed up for at least one ultra marathon in 2022 (not quicksilver). I DID toss around the idea of running Oakland in March just to go after the sub 2:55 for a NYC qualifier and then winter happened, and I picked up a few other ideas. Plus I want to work on my Jeep axle swap. I literally put it off all of 2021 to focus on the marathon.
JMac - for Quicksilver 100K my goal is to finish under 16 hours to qualify for WSER 100 lottery - that's all. No racing, no chasing awards - I am not particularly good ultra runner anyway - will just try to enjoy the run and try to get back to the finish line in one piece .
Mmmm Bop
I’m already liking this new guy zebano. 👍
5k - 17:53 (4/19) 10k - 37:53 (11/18) Half - 1:23:18 (4/19) Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)
Cobra Commander Keen
I'll get in here on page 1 this time.
Kyle here. 37 years old from flyover country (Oklahoma) USA. Married (12 years in March) with 3 daughters (ages 4, 7, 10 - functionally 11 right now). I'm an adult-onset runner, starting in July 2015. I jumped in to running headfirst after doing a 5k with my wife's family and discovering I loved it and wondered just how fast I could end up getting at the distance.
I'm not signed up for any races as of yet, though I'm considering a 20k trail race at the end of January just for kicks. After that I'll probably target a 10k/HM cycle for spring, potentially rolling that into a marathon - perhaps Fargo or Grandma's.I do want to (finally!) win that blasted hilly/hot HM in Texas I go to every year. Remind me when it comes time: Don't go out harder than marathon effort!For time goals, I want a sub 18 5k and all the longer-distance race results that line up with it!
A fall marathon (CIM again?) is certainly on my to-do list, regardless of if I run one in the spring or not. I DESPERATELY need to get a solid marathon under my belt after the last three I've "run".
Despite a rather disastrous end to CIM for me, 2021 was a pretty good year. I started working with a coach in May, and I'm continuing that. Not only is it just super nice to have a workout schedule magically show up, but I responded pretty darn well to the training and set two 10k PRs (training through the races) and a 5k PR as well. I certainly would have set a new HM PR as well, but only ran one on what's very much a non PR course. Here's hoping to lower than PR soon!
Mileage/training time history:2015: 558 miles, 85:52:07 h:m:s (starting from July)2016: 1,912 miles, 252:01:07 h:m:s2017: 2,242 miles, 298:12:13 h:m:s2018: 2,931 miles, 388:49:29 h:m:s2019: 3,172 miles, 429:32:07 h:m:s2020: 3,353 miles, 463:06:50 h:m:s2021: 3,842.53 mi, 527:19:31 h:m:s
Eventually I'll run out of room in this "yearly increasing mileage" thing, I suppose, but hopefully not this (coming) year.
5k: 17:58 11/22 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:23:22 4/22 │ M: 2:56:05 12/22