2022 Advanced Racing Thread (Read 426 times)

Marky_Mark_17


     

    1:19 half - 2:57 full

    1:10 half - 2:41 full.

     

    If you ever decide to run another marathon again…fire your coach. 👍

     

    "Hey coach"

    "Yes?"

    "You're fired"

    "Why?"

    "Some guy on the internet who trolls a lot said so".

     

    Hmm.

     

    Anyways, 9 minute improvement in HM / 16 minute improvement in FM.  That doesn't seem that out of whack considering those were my first and second marathons respectively.

     

    I'd be happy to grab a beer with you anytime you visit! Maybe after a 10K where'd you smoke me by a couple minutes and you can talk some shit back.

     

    Didn't you used to run your easy runs at like 630 to 645 while running like 1:20? If it's just how you feel, why did you slow down so much over the past few years? Even when you weren't doing high mileage, you have still slowed it down a lot even as you've gotten a lot faster

     

    Haha when I said don't be an asshole I didn't mean you needed to be a suck-up!  When I first joined the forums I was on here for advice.  Now my main motivation is trying to help others and just talk running.  I don't tend to go in for the shit-talking much because that sort of thing turns off potential new joiners but if someone has a crack then I'll defend myself.

     

    Anyways you are right that my easy pace has slowed a lot.  5 years or so ago I was probably running easy pace at around the 6:30-6:45 you mention.  It's something around 4:30/km / 7:15/mile +/- now.  I suspect it's because back then I was often running only 4 or sometimes 5 days a week, now it's typically 6, and weekly mileage has probably increased around 50%.  Everything feels a lot fresher when you've got 2 or 3 rest days a week.

    3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)  

    10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

    * Net downhill course

    Last race: National 10km Road Champs, 4 Sept, 34:13

    Up next: Nelson Half Marathon, 6 Nov

    "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

    Mikkey


    Elite Jogger

       

      "Hey coach"

      "Yes?"

      "You're fired"

      "Why?"

       

       

       

      Because I suck at the marathon.

      5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

      Marky_Mark_17


         

        Because I suck at the marathon.

         

        Sorry to hear you think that way of your performances, I'm not sure that's true, but it's not really a reason for me to fire my coach.

        3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)  

        10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

        * Net downhill course

        Last race: National 10km Road Champs, 4 Sept, 34:13

        Up next: Nelson Half Marathon, 6 Nov

        "CONSISTENCY IS KING"


        Speed Surplus

          RE: Trash talk: Trash-talking is a big part of basketball but I never really took part. At least, not in the overt way that some people do. I'm from the old-school line of thought that the coldest thing you can do to someone on the basketball court (or in any sport, really) is act like you've been there before. Splash a three in their face and just jog back down the court.

           

          I am psychotically competitive, though, which is part of the reason that I ultimately quit bball. Too close to getting into fights and too many injuries. But maaaaan, did I love playing in competitive games!

           

          The great thing about running is that you can be psychotically competitive and the only person you're going to hurt is yourself 😂

          5:27 / 18:49 / 40:32 / 88:12 / 3:12

          Mikkey


          Elite Jogger

            I got lucky that day.

             

            5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

            Mikkey


            Elite Jogger


              Absolutely beautiful.

               

               

              5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

              SteveChCh


              Hot Weather Complainer

                Settle down Coach Mikkey. Only a Pom could get so much satisfaction out of a match they didn’t win 

                 

                Can’t you just troll me on my marathon training?

                Net Downhill PB Southern Lakes Half Marathon 2022 1:27:32, Flat Course PB Christchurch 2016 1:29.25

                Recent Races:   Southern Lakes Half Marathon 1:27:32 May 7, 2022, Motorway 10km 40:49 February 27, 2022, Selwyn Running Festival Half-Marathon 1:29:32  November 7, 2021

                Race plan:  Melbourne Marathon October 2, 2022.  Queenstown Half Marathon November 19, 2022

                Mikkey


                Elite Jogger

                   

                  Can’t you just troll me on my marathon training?

                   

                  Yeah, but you don’t take the bait so easily. 

                  Listen to Coach Milkman and you can’t go wrong. 👍

                  5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

                  JMac11


                  I spilled the milk

                    So I'll go down the HRM path, although I find it ironic that giving a big range for easy paces to run is being a slave to a watch, yet dissecting HR numbers is not, but here it goes anyway:

                     

                    Steve I don't use heart rate, but I saw your heart rate at upper 140s for your easy run. Is that where it's supposed to be? That seemed high to me for someone in his 40s? I was looking at some Daniels calculators and if I throw in a max heart rate of 190 and resting of 45 (which I think is probably a conservative view since I imagine your max is lower), that says easy runs in the 130s. I looked through some other people's Stravas and that seemed to be where most people run their easy runs, at least for the first 2/3 of the run.

                    5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:14:57 (5/22)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

                     

                    Next Race: Jersey Shore Half Marathon (10/2)

                    darkwave


                    Mother of Cats

                      So I'll go down the HRM path, although I find it ironic that giving a big range for easy paces to run is being a slave to a watch, yet dissecting HR numbers is not, but here it goes anyway:

                       

                      I'd argue that the distinction is that people use paces as targets (or even floors, subconciously) while they use HR as a ceiling.   Additionally, there's an emotion to one's running pace that doesn't attach to one's heart rate.

                       

                      Steve I don't use heart rate, but I saw your heart rate at upper 140s for your easy run. Is that where it's supposed to be? That seemed high to me for someone in his 40s? I was looking at some Daniels calculators and if I throw in a max heart rate of 190 and resting of 45 (which I think is probably a conservative view since I imagine your max is lower), that says easy runs in the 130s. I looked through some other people's Stravas and that seemed to be where most people run their easy runs, at least for the first 2/3 of the run.

                       

                      Just chiming in with the old chestnut - HR is very individual.  I'm a bit older than Steve, and 145 and under is is my easy pace HR (right now I can't keep my HR out of the mid-150s no matter how slow I jog, but that's because I have issues).  My resting HR is low 40s, and my max HR is about 190.

                       

                      130s is something I only see when pool-running or shuffling carefully down a steep hill, or possibly on the very coldest days when my HR seems locked in a low #.

                      Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                       

                      And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                      CommanderKeen


                      Aspiring Hobby Jogger

                        JMac - It's all part of the build to CIM and (hopefully) a massive marathon PR. I'd have a race on the schedule, but it's REALLY slim pickings around here for unknown reasons. To get a decent 5k anytime soon I'll probably have to drive an hour or more away while trying to cherry pick weather and only getting a couple days worth of taper prior.
                        I am getting out of town for a little getaway with DW this coming week and will have a few days of very minimal running and am looking forward to that cutback.

                        5k: 18:05 8/22 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:23:22 4/22 │ M: 3:04:13 11/18

                         

                        Upcoming Races:

                         

                        Wurst Race Half - 10/8

                        Toyota Music Factory Half - 11/13

                        CIM - 12/4

                          Just chiming in with the old chestnut - HR is very individual.  I'm a bit older than Steve, and 145 and under is is my easy pace HR (right now I can't keep my HR out of the mid-150s no matter how slow I jog, but that's because I have issues).  My resting HR is low 40s, and my max HR is about 190.

                           

                          130s is something I only see when pool-running or shuffling carefully down a steep hill, or possibly on the very coldest days when my HR seems locked in a low #.

                           

                           

                          Like Darkwave, another female I follow on strava has an easy run HR in the upper 140s, often over 150. But like Darkwave, she is small. I've noticed that general trend for smaller runners versus larger ones: HR skews a bit higher for smaller folks. But the data set for this observation is quite small (no pun intended).

                          2:52:16 (2018)

                          JMac11


                          I spilled the milk

                            That's very interesting on the size and HR. Steve - if you admit you are a small woman, then you're all good 

                             

                            In all seriousness, darkwave I'm not sure I understand your initial distinction. Aren't we both saying there is a range, with a cap in how high your HR should be / how fast your easy pace should be? Nobody on this page would argue easy pace is a target number. That's a big mistake.

                             

                            I'd also say you'd have to test the easy pace, right? If Steve went all the way down to 9:00 for example and still was mid 140s, that would answer that this is indeed his easy pace. Pretty good test.

                            5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:14:57 (5/22)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

                             

                            Next Race: Jersey Shore Half Marathon (10/2)

                            CalBears


                              "Hey coach"

                              "Yes?"

                              "You're fired"

                              "Why?"

                              "Some guy on the internet who trolls a lot said so".

                               

                              Hmm.

                               

                              Anyways, 9 minute improvement in HM / 16 minute improvement in FM.  That doesn't seem that out of whack considering those were my first and second marathons respectively.

                               

                               

                              In all seriousness I am with Mikkey on this - 2 x HM + 19 mins and 2 x HM + 21 mins? Anything beyond 10 mins after FM training cycle is just plain and simple bad training or as he said - "suck in marathon". No trolling - pure fact. That doesn't cancel the fact that you are really really good in HM and shorter distances.

                              paces PRs - 5K - 5:48  /  10K - 6:05  /  HM - 6:14  /  FM - 6:26 per mile

                              flavio1980


                              Intl. correspondent

                                 

                                 

                                Like Darkwave, another female I follow on strava has an easy run HR in the upper 140s, often over 150. But like Darkwave, she is small. I've noticed that general trend for smaller runners versus larger ones: HR skews a bit higher for smaller folks. But the data set for this observation is quite small (no pun intended).

                                 

                                The heart rate monitors also don't work as well for many females because they've got small wrists.

                                That happens to my wife, who's also small, and the HRM reads high.

                                Regardless of why that happens, those are the numbers DW has to work with, like she said, you've got to use your own numbers, captured from using the HRM multiple times, not from formulas based on other people.

                                My max HR is around 179 which is hilarious as it coincides with the 220 - age thing 😁

                                My easy runs average around 125.

                                PRs: 1500 4:54.1 2019 - 5K 17:56 2021 HM 1:21:59 2021

                                Up next: 10K Family race

                                Tool to generate Strava weekly