2024 Advanced Training and Racing Thread (still competitive jerks) (Read 276 times)

Mikkey


Mmmm Bop

    Hey everyone.  As most of you know from Strava, I did the Wellington marathon yesterday.  I deliberately stayed quiet about it to keep it low key.  The plan was just run it as a steady long run, 4:50/km with a kick down from 32km.  The longest steady long run I did in training was 32km on a hot day in January which was tough but I got through it so this should be fine right?  I'll paste below what I sent to my coach.  He suggested this within 30 mins of my DNF and I said no way.  24 hours later I was on board.

     

    He did note my training block started in December then got extended after I downgraded ChCh in April due to Covid then extended 3 more weeks after the Selwyn shocker, and that I'm probably quite overtrained physically and mentally now.

     

    Definitely more went right this time. I felt okay early on although as early as 15-18km I felt the usual niggle on my inner quad and started to worry about it. At the 22km turnaround to head back out I wondered if it was a good idea because of how hard it would be to get back.

    Met another runner Kate in the first 5km. She was just behind me, then someone on the sideline said something funny and we laughed and started chatting. Ran together for maybe 17km and it was great, the time went fast during that tricky mentally early part. At 22km I noticed we'd been closer to 4:40 than 4:50 for a few km so I said I better try and stick to my plan since it was kind of an experiment. She never got more than about 30 metres ahead until the cramp and I was just about to pass her at that point as I increased the tempo.

    With each km that got ticked off, especially after 27km I felt better about the quad but knew it may come back. I was feeling good and was holding out for the last turnaround although from about 29km the half runners started to become a problem with a few narrow paths and high volume of people, heaps who were oblivious and/or wearing headphones. So much weaving. It was nice passing people but very annoying when it wasn't an easy pass. At 24km I had my third drink waiting but I had felt it was tricky to get the second one down and decided not to get that drink. There were 4 drinks with gels attached, and I carried 3 gels, one which I had at the start. The plan was every 6km although I pushed it out slightly after the second one because it felt harder to get them down. I had another bottle at Evans Bay at 29km but forgot that I'd marked it for 34km and also forgot the tables for the 29 and 34km stations were in slightly different places. It wasn't possible to get the bottle at 29km. From 31-34km I felt good and picking up the pace felt comfortable, but I wanted that gel. As I approached, 2 half runners cut in front of me and I had to pull up and weave. The cramp came on strong within a minute. I knew once it was gone I may have some respite so downed the gel while I stretched. Slowed the pace once I got moving and knew I just had to manage it to the finish. Reminded myself my energy levels were good and that the gel would kick in fast. This part around the harbour was better with wider roads, still some weaving but much less.

     

    I knew my last bottle was at 24km which was also about 39km. Also knew which table it was on so made a beeline for it, ripped the gel off and tossed the bottle. Got the gel down as fast as possible. The course heads off the road and goes around the harbour with a few narrow footbridges. A lady maybe doing the 10km was in front on one and there was a gap for me on the right, with a right turn at the end of the bridge. I said out loud "please don't cut me off" about 3 times. She cuts me off and I need to pull up and go wide. Next lot of cramp comes on within 50 metres, this one is worse and a few nice people check on me. I get going again and know I can't afford another one or the time is really starting to blow out. I had lots of energy so my brain was working well enough to help me manage it. Up the last ramp and then the last 500 metres I decided to just risk it and easily dropped down to 4:20/km pace to at least beat the clock to 3:30. I don't really know how to feel about it, kind of out of ideas on how to beat the cramp. The weaving was a factor but I was worried about the inner quad well before that started. The fact is, it doesn't happen in training on much harder runs than that. Lots of time to plan the next one though and for now I'll enjoy a break then some faster running. Maybe I should focus on what I'm better at? Or maybe I need a race like Buller with some hills.

     

    Official time 3:29:54

     

    Weekly for period: From: 17/06/2024 To 23/06/2024

    Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
    in m
    17/06 Warm up 0.34 0.54 00:03:06 09:07 05:44 0
    17/06 Easy 40 5.01 8.07 00:42:12 08:25 05:14 19
    19/06 Warm up 0.34 0.55 00:03:05 09:04 05:36 1
    19/06 3 x 6 mins HMP 7.48 12.03 00:57:51 07:44 04:49 23
    20/06 Warm up 0.33 0.53 00:03:05 09:21 05:49 0
    20/06 Easy 40 5.01 8.07 00:42:18 08:27 05:14 19
    22/06 Warm up 0.34 0.54 00:03:11 09:22 05:54 0
    22/06 4 x 150 metres strides 3.81 6.13 00:31:33 08:17 05:09 11
    23/06 Warm up 0.54 0.87 00:05:07 09:29 05:53 0
    23/06 Wellington Marathon 26.60 42.80 03:29:56 07:54 04:54 36

    Totals: Time: 06:41:24 - πŸ¦…Imperial: 49.80 mi - Metric: 80.12 km

     

    Steve you running a sub 3:30 marathon is the most exciting I’ve seen on this thread so far.

     

    Will there be anyone capable of running a Moose Mug time this year? 

    Standards have dropped drastically since the originally MM/ competitive jerk thread formed back in Runnersworld when it was 2:45 folk.

     

    Fucking hell. 🀦🏻

    5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

      Think we’re all struggling with our marathon demons. Good to have something to achieve in life, I guess πŸ˜‚

       

      Will there be anyone capable of running a Moose Mug time this year? 

      Standards have dropped drastically since the originally MM/ competitive jerk thread formed back in Runnersworld when it was 2:45 folk.

       

      Fucking hell. 🀦🏻

      50+ age-group PBs:  Half Perish 1:24:24 (June '23 Road Race) - 10km 37:52 (2022 Local Road Champs) - Track 5km 18:49 (Aug '22) - Perish Run 3:17:42

      2024 Goals: Road/Track 10km Sub 38:00 - 5km Sub 18:30

       

       

      Mikkey


      Mmmm Bop

        Think we’re all struggling with our marathon demons. Good to have something to achieve in life, I guess πŸ˜‚

         

        A lot of the marathon over achievers stopped posting on here because they didn’t want to mix with random people on here with limited running ability?

        5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

          You’d have to ask them. But I’m sure that’s exactly it. That and them having to read posts from people not actually doing any running

           

           

          A lot of the marathon over achievers stopped posting on here because they didn’t want to mix with random people on here with limited running ability?

          50+ age-group PBs:  Half Perish 1:24:24 (June '23 Road Race) - 10km 37:52 (2022 Local Road Champs) - Track 5km 18:49 (Aug '22) - Perish Run 3:17:42

          2024 Goals: Road/Track 10km Sub 38:00 - 5km Sub 18:30

           

           

          SteveChCh


          Hot Weather Complainer

            Sorry mikkey, yes I've dropped the standards drastically since moving up to the marathon but don't worry, the only way is up.  To be fair though, you criticised a 2:41 marathon so I'm not sure I'll ever quite reach your standards 

            5km: 18:34 11/23 β”‚ 10km: 39:10 8/23 β”‚ HM: 1:26:48 9/23 β”‚ M: 3:29:54 6/24

             

            2024 Races:

            Motorway Half Marathon February 25, 2024 1:29:55

            Christchurch Half-Marathon April 21, 2024 1:27:34

            Selwyn Marathon June 2, 2024 DNF

            Wellington Marathon June 23, 2024 3:29:54

            Hagley Park Run July 20, 2024

            Dunedin Half Marathon September 15, 2024

            Timaru Ten October 26, 2024

            Marky_Mark_17


               

              A lot of the marathon over achievers stopped posting on here because they didn’t want to mix with random people on here with limited running ability?

               

              Or maybe they just got tired of people who aren't actually running coming in here and starting pointless fights and insulting others.

              3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)  

              10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

              * Net downhill course

              Last race: Runway5 / National 5k Champs, 16:22, National Masters AG Champ!

              Up next: Still working on that...

              "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

              darkwave


              Mother of Cats

                So I'm very late (because I ran a race this weekend (slowly due to lack of specific training)) and was holding off until I finished my own report.  But Steve, FWIW, though this wasn't the performance you wanted, you at least moved the needle.  Once you figure out how to move the needle, you've got a path towards where you want to go.   If you want to continue to go that way.  There are no wrong choices here.

                 

                Mikkey - I'm targeting a goose mug this fall Smile  Within 20 minutes of my PR.

                Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                 

                And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                mmerkle


                   

                  A lot of the marathon over achievers stopped posting on here because they didn’t want to mix with random people on here with limited running ability?

                   

                  Why not instead give good advice to those with the limited ability while also still chatting with the more advanced folk? A MM won't happen this year but a 2:45 is a real possibility for me I think. I might need 100 mile weeks to do it because of my limited ability lol.

                   

                  Heat related TQ: Does anyone else ever develop a weird heaviness and stiffness in one or more muscle group when consistently running in the heat? It seems like every summer when I consistently run in the afternoon, I develop this stiffness in my quads that lingers for days. Naive guess is dehydration.

                  dktrotter


                  Dorothea

                    HI folks. Been lurking a bit, because: time. Also because I'm currently doing the bare minimum of running to keep my team stats in the green. Now that classes are over and most of the house and yard work is done (for context, my folks have an apartment in Berlin and a bungalow at the Baltic, and both, while super awesome to take advantange of, include work), I hope to pick up the miles a bit, because I do want to be at regular 50 miles weeks by the start of the fall semester. I've been motivating myself to get speed in, too, with a few track workouts and 5k solo race efforts.

                    Just wanted to catch up on a few things I saw. First, wcrunner, congrats on the 12-hour! I was glad to see you finally felt like you had a good race. I suppose running around flat in climate-controlled conditions helped! Your report went too quickly for me. As someone headed towards a 12-hour track race myself, I have many questions, like does running around the same way around those curves cause any surprise pains? We'll be switching directions every 4 hours, but that still means 8 hours going in one direction. Also, were there points where the sheer repetitiveness gets to you? That's one thing I'm really worried about.

                    Steve, congrats on marathon! I agree with darkwave and others above. It's got to at least feel good to move the needle in the right direction, and you can definitely keep trial and erroring it (that cramp thing is really annoying and too consistent for you to not be able to have one answer, it seems, you just need to find it) or you can say you've been there, done that, and move on. There's a reason elites have specialized distances.

                    flavio, I have been wearing my transition glasses on every run now, and they're so darn practical for the changeable German skies. But I am glad you found a pair for high noon, when you truly do want as dark as possible! Also, yes, the bread here is the best! The beer as well. 

                    merkle, my experience has been that it's a lack of electrolytes, and what you're feeling may be something like heat cramps. Make sure you're getting more than usual since you're likely also drinking more water than usual.

                    Qualifications: I like to run. In Florida. In the summer. At noon.  

                    Last race: June 29, Hasenheide Parkrun, 22:19. A bit disappointing time, but it was still a fun event. 

                    Mikkey


                    Mmmm Bop

                      Sorry mikkey, yes I've dropped the standards drastically since moving up to the marathon but don't worry, the only way is up.  To be fair though, you criticised a 2:41 marathon so I'm not sure I'll ever quite reach your standards 

                       

                      The 2:41 guy never won a Moose Mug and never will because he gave up on marathons. It took him months to recover from the last one…poor guy. 

                      5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

                        He’s a hard man to please, that Mikkey!

                        50+ age-group PBs:  Half Perish 1:24:24 (June '23 Road Race) - 10km 37:52 (2022 Local Road Champs) - Track 5km 18:49 (Aug '22) - Perish Run 3:17:42

                        2024 Goals: Road/Track 10km Sub 38:00 - 5km Sub 18:30

                         

                         

                        Mikkey


                        Mmmm Bop

                          He’s a hard man to please, that Mikkey!

                           

                          5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

                          Marky_Mark_17


                             

                            The 2:41 guy never won a Moose Mug and never will because he gave up on marathons. It took him months to recover from the last one…poor guy. 

                             

                            This seems ironic coming from the guy that can’t even make it to the start line.

                            3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)  

                            10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

                            * Net downhill course

                            Last race: Runway5 / National 5k Champs, 16:22, National Masters AG Champ!

                            Up next: Still working on that...

                            "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

                            flavio80


                               

                              The 2:41 guy never won a Moose Mug and never will because he gave up on marathons. It took him months to recover from the last one…poor guy. 

                               

                              You sure talk a lot about running for a golfer 

                              PRs: 800m 2:31.7 Aug 2019 | 1500m 4:54.1 Sep 2019 | 5K 17:53 Mar 2023

                              Mikkey


                              Mmmm Bop

                                 

                                This seems ironic coming from the guy that can’t even make it to the start line.

                                 

                                42 marathons verses the guy who gave up after 2 marathons. 

                                5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)