2020 Marathon Training and relevant COVID 19 discussion echo chamber (Read 700 times)

dpschumacher


3 months til Masters

    Kramrunner-I work with people experiencing homelessness and people about to become homeless, so my desire for a shower at work is two fold.  I love working with the people I do, but the number of times I've fallen in mud in an encampment or in an apartment with bed bugs is too many.

     

    Nice week and way to work back after the ankle issues.

    2023 Goals

    Marathon Sub 2:37 (CIM) 2:41:18

    10k Sub 35:00 (Victory 10k 34:19)

    5k Sub 16:00 (Hot Dash 5k in March (16:48), Brian Kraft in May (16:20), Twilight 5000 in July and August (16:20/16:25 Both heat index 102-103F)

    Sub 1:16 Half Marathon  City of Lakes Half Marathon 1:15:47)

    Sub 56:30 in 10 mile (Twin Cities 10 mile, Canceled due to weather, 56:35 as a workout)

     

    2024 Goals

    Sub 2:37 Marathon

    Sub 1:15 Half

    Sub 34 10k

    Sub 16 5k

     

     

    Cyberic


       

      Narrow-ish but I wouldn't say ultra narrow.  I used to run a 13 in the Kinvara 10 and Freedom ISO 2 since they don't stock 12.5's at any of the sites I use locally.  13 is a touch big for me, but the 12 was definitely too narrow.  Then I tried a 12.5 off Amazon in the Kinvara 10 and it's perfect.  I run 12.5's in the Next%, which are definitely snug, but actually perfect.  They feel a little snug around the forefoot when I first put them on but I've generally totally forgotten about it within a couple minutes and it's never been an issue when running or racing.

       

      For reference when I used to run in ASICS and Mizuno I was always a 12, so the Next%'s definitely run narrow relative to some other brands.

       

      Ok, thanks. I wear size 13 in Sauconys and they're perfect. I don't think half sizes exist above 13 but maybe I could try on size 13 Nikes performance shoes. I always assumed they'd be too narrow in the forefoot, because most shoes are, but maybe I should give them a shot and get a free 4% on my next race :-)

      cinnamon girl


        Cyberic: yeah it happens. I used to have this fantasy that runners were different. But we're not. Same issues.

         

        Kram: what's up with the ankle? Tendon?

         

        DPS: homelessness in Minnesota in winter .. you have an important job! Not sure I would say A-hole, but thanks for the support.

         

        I've run commute in the past - worked well to get the miles in when I would work graveyard shifts and lived 6-7 mi from work. Showers not necessary working Night shift especially when all you need to do is throw on some scrubs.  New situation commute is only a mile. Sweet.

         

         

         

         

        Fishyone


          Recovery week.  No workouts but miles were still on pace.  I'll try a couple of workouts this week.

           

          I'm trying out a run commute to get in some extra miles.  Last week worked well so I'm going to try to do 2 this week.

           

          Morning runs are not my favorite.  I'm never sure if I should try to get some calories or just stick to coffee.

           

           

              total pace  
          WEEK 7 Mon 7.0 9:36 Tempo 6@7:10
          Mon 7.0 8:55 Miles
          Tue 7.5 8:30 Recovery
          Wed 15.0 8:47 Mid Long
          Thu 11.3 8:50 Recovery
          Fri 7.5 9:01 GA 11 
          Sat 18.3 9:00 MP long run 12 @ MP
          Sun 7.5 9:00 Recovery
              81.0    

          5K 18:36 (2023), 10K 39:40 (2022), 1/2 1:24:37 (2023), full 2:58:36 (2015) 

          CommanderKeen


          Cobra Commander Keen

            Cyberic - Good week.


            OMR - Thanks for the RR. Looking forward to getting through it.


            Kram - Nice that your ankle is still improving - good week considering it, too. Hopefully the healing continues.


            Fishy - Impressive volume in a recovery week!


            DWave - With our races on the same weekend it has been interesting to see the similarities and differences between our tapers.


            Had a couple health-related taper scares over the weekend. DD1 woke up Saturday and was moving pretty slowly, then said her stomach was bothering her. No temperature. She threw up a bit later and immediately went back to feeling like herself, so I'm not at all sure what caused it. For a bit I was quite worried I'd have another sick girl to take care of.
            Then Sunday I was 1/4mi out from my house when I glanced over to my right when someone opened their garage door and something happened to my back. On my right side, from the middle of my back all the way up to my neck immediately stiffened up. No pop, no pain, but I haven't been able to properly move my head since so clearly something's out of whack. Ice seems to help some, but I'm likely heading to the chiropractor for the first time in a couple years.
            If I can get this lined out I should otherwise be feeling pretty good for race day. My hamstrings are feeling better (likely thanks to some strides, Epsom salt bath, and a bit of stretching/rolling of the legs).

             

            5k: 17:58 11/22 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:23:22 4/22 │ M: 2:56:05 12/22

             

            Upcoming Races:

             

             

            JMac11


            RIP Milkman

              OMR - loved the report, thank you for writing it! Although I've sworn off ultras, your beautiful pictures did at least warm me up to doing more trail runs. Although, your stories of the previous year terrify me.

               

              Dave - nice week.

               

              JT - I definitely think racing more frequently would be good for you, I feel like you race the least out of this entire forum!

               

              Cinnamon - glad to see you back! I agree regarding the tension in the thread. Not very welcoming for newcomers.

               

              Cyberic - that's a lot of mileage for someone not running a marathon!

               

              kram - good progress with the injury. Sounds like you're being smart.

               

              Fishy - we had pretty similar weeks it looks like, right down to the mileage and 12@MP. Run commuting is awesome, no idea how I didn't do it in the past.

               

              Me - I think I'm finally in shape! Had a great workout on Wednesday night. I was absolutely fried after it though, and my Thursday and Friday were the slowest I've run recovery/easy days mid cycle in years. Part of that may be because I ran my first double on Thursday in 16 years, but even the AM run was really slow (9:00 min miles). I worry sometimes that I just lock into an easy pace and don't let my body really dictate it, but those 3 runs demonstrated that I actually do run by effort.

               

              My Saturday run at marathon pace was a huge confidence booster this early. Was able to run my current Marathon PR pace, which is not something I expected (was shooting for more like 6:05 average). I did run in an older pair of VFs, so that probably gave me a few seconds per mile compared to the Zoom Fly I usually train in, but still, really pumped about where I'm at. I do think I might retire that older pair of VF to just training now. It seems like a lot of people like to do that once they've put in a good 100+ miles in them, and it seems to make sense rather than purchasing Zoom Flys.

               

              This week will be my final dreaded Vo2 max workout of the cycle on Tuesday.  I also will have run 4 straight Quality days on only 2 days rest (vs. the usual 2 day followed by 3 day rest over a 7 day period), so I'm going through probably the toughest patch of training here but it's almost over!

               

               

              Day Miles Description
                   
              Mon 7.0 Recovery
              Tue 11.5 EZ + Strides
              Wed 16.0 8E + 2x3T (5:43) + 2E
              Thu 12.0 5 AM, 7 PM
              Fri 11.0 EZ (no strides, legs fried)
              Sat 16.0 2E + 12M (5:58) + 2E
              Sun 7.0 Recovery
                   
              Total 80.5  

              5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:14:57 (5/22)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

               

               

              Cyberic


                Fishyone I'm a morning runner, and I have a coffee, and eat just a bit, something that sits well in my stomach, that I've been eating before running forever and doesn't weigh me down. I run, and then I eat for real. I've tried not eating at all, and eating a full breakfast before my runs, but find just putting something in there works best for me.

                 

                JMac Cool that you have better than expected fitness at this point.

                 

                As for me training this much when not marathon training, I actually am marathon training. It's just that my goal marathon is in October. I like to take my time 

                Running Problem


                Problem Child

                   

                  I've been thinking about strategy for this attempt the last few days, and that's what I decided on: cross the 26.2 mat and immediately slow down to something that's hopefully sustainable for another 4.8 miles so I can avoid walking if at all possible.

                   

                  Chicken. It won't take as long if you just keep running 6:50/mi pace.

                  Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                  VDOT 53.37 

                  5k18:xx | Marathon 2:55:22

                  Running Problem


                  Problem Child

                    Ah keen sorry I can't read the calendar. I've spent too much time with the Kiwis over in sub 1:30.

                    Good thing the high desert hasn't had much snow this year and I haven't lost my tan.

                     

                     

                    See the source image

                    Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                    VDOT 53.37 

                    5k18:xx | Marathon 2:55:22

                    Running Problem


                    Problem Child

                      Brew:  Yeah, admittedly the shock tart/Coors light combo doesn't sound all that good, but I'll take your word for it.  I enjoyed max's WS blog, and his recounting of the last 40 miles with you.

                       

                      WHAT?!?!?!?!?!  i haven't even read Dragon's Back. Since he doesn't show up and tell me when he finished it I have to check it out. He didn't even ask for photos this time...I'll have to see how he talks about trying to sabatoge my pacing strategy by pointing out celebrities to get photos with instead of eating and drinking at aid stations. Such an epic adventure. It's like Blues Brothers....

                       

                      "its night, I have my sunglasses on, I've no experience with this trail or distance, and you're three hours behind your goal." We're on a mission from GAWD.

                       

                      Where is the link to your report? I must have missed it.

                       

                      JMac I've considered buying the Alphas just because they are the newest tech. I'm sure I'll look stupid wearing them in 10th place at my local races, or for a charity even. As someone who never bought the 4% hype, then never wanted to spend $250 on the shoes I'll probably buy a pair and keep them for marathon races such as Boston and maybe a NYM qualifier at CIM IF I RUN 2020 CIM. I'm probably close to my potential for the marathon and I enjoy the sport of racing enough to try new things. Yeah they can be considered a waste of money and so can race fees, gels, etc. I figure they last close to 10 marathons and at $25/race for gels in marathons they're going to cost as much as the nutrition so it's a wash. I'm more concerned about the local running shop not wanting to let me test them out like they say they do for other shoes. 1 week of running in them for a good marathon paced workout literally might wear them to a point someone else doesn't want to buy them, and they can't be returned to Nike. I never liked Nike growing up either, or the people who wore it in school.

                       

                      Dave I think doing some longer runs with a group faster than I wanted helped push me from 3:30. I was in a comfort zone at that point and just a few years of running faster than I thought was acceptable kind of helped me kick it up a notch. Glad you're feeling good 10 weeks out.

                       

                       

                      Me:

                      1 workout (6x5 min hard) that didn't feel like it worked the system I expected (cruise intervals/threshold running) to work the lactate threshold.

                      51 miles of easy running. 1 or 2 trail runs because I want to keep them up for the 50 miler. Great weather means I can run outside and the lawn I just had installed in December probably needs to be watered. The sprinklers were winterized.

                      Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                      VDOT 53.37 

                      5k18:xx | Marathon 2:55:22

                      Fishyone


                        Fishyone I'm a morning runner, and I have a coffee, and eat just a bit, something that sits well in my stomach, that I've been eating before running forever and doesn't weigh me down. I run, and then I eat for real. I've tried not eating at all, and eating a full breakfast before my runs, but find just putting something in there works best for me.

                         

                         

                        Thanks I'll try that on my next morning.  I was absolutely Famished after my morning "commute" today.

                         

                        It was really fun running past the cars stuck in traffic  I absolutely made better time than them.

                         

                        JMac- Thanks.  Now to get my paces down.

                         

                        Keen miles I can do........speed not so much......

                         

                        Looking for advice on a track workout for this week.  In the past I've stuck mainly to 800s.  Any advice?  I really need to develop some speed.

                        5K 18:36 (2023), 10K 39:40 (2022), 1/2 1:24:37 (2023), full 2:58:36 (2015) 

                        cinnamon girl


                          JMAC - Very nice presentation   And finally in shape?! I think you've been in shape for quite some time. Looking good!

                           

                          Fishyone - where are you at in what kind of cycle?

                           

                           

                           

                           

                          minmalS


                          Stotan Disciple

                            Kram - Nice week I was going to say why repeat the same workout the next day but  I did the same thing the same day lol. Hope foot feels better.

                             

                            Cinnamon - Glad you're back and all is well. So now with all the job changes are you cleared for Berlin? As for the tension, it makes the air unpalatable but some runners are jealous degenerate stalkers. Apparently I'm being stalked too someone obviously going over my CIM picture to call me curly haired lady man. Funny thing is I have no interest in their results or CIM pics.

                            Back to running those were some ripping 2ks what kind of effort would you say that was. I want to go out there one day and time trial my 2Ks too. In the past (aughts) I would rip 15-20 seconds faster than my current best but I can't seem to go much faster these days I do them at critical pace vs 3k/5k race pace. Good stuff looks like you're still in sub 3 shape.

                             

                            JT - Nice week and great job in the race. 6:20 was a great pace for your run. Have you decided on a spring race.

                             

                            DP - As Darkwave once said to me your code is showing lol. Nice job on schedule. I would shorten the description as it misaligns  the layout if you're too wordy. Great week by the way. Keep doing the good work in your city the plight of the homeless is something easily solved but which no one wants to pay for. I swear 5% of the military budget would end homelessness in America.

                             

                            JMAC, that's a great week, with two top notch workouts. I'm excited for you what 6 weeks left of training and one for taper?

                             

                            As for the tension I am part to blame and own up to my part. I initially had no issues with him, when he lost his job right before Boston one year, several of us on the old forum offered to pool up his hotel cost so he wouldn't have to skip the trip. I recalled he declined our assistance. I even recall meeting him after the race but after that trip he always harped on me so that I left the old forum RWOL. Not to get into stupid back and forths. When I came back to RA he wasn't really around someone must have told him of my dramatic pot stirring entrance and he shortly there after came back picked up where he left off.  I don't know if its racism, jealousy or what but ever since he met me he's been harping on me with his little passive aggressive trolling ways. Now I am one who dishes and stir the pot on what I call "stupid training" which I won't get into as its been the source of many useless pages of attacks and piling on. I watch some of you train there is a million ways to train but if you really want a goal think about it  first don't just do. I always say that its not as hard as we think. We put more effort into training than thought. Anyway most people tend to take offense to what is said than to ever really think about I'm trying to convey.

                             

                            Anyway I had blocked him on RWOL so I didn't see anything he says. Yes my attack on ultra runners was really a call out on him specifically, I still feel like he got what he deserved. I'm ready to move on then last week Mikkey who I have always considered a forum friend starts to come after me on his behalf like he cant fight his own battles.  I'm not one of them so since this is their playground I'm going to bounce after London. My comments usually aren't an attack on anyone personally just on what I call stupid training that's my opinion you don't have to agree. It doesn't apply to all. I think I've wasted two paragraphs, we saw how Kobe lost his life tragically you would think that would really be a turning point to say life is short lets focus on really important  things and ignore the minuscule bullshit. I'm done with those two they can attack all they want I'm going to ignore them going forward. Not worth the energy they can focus on my tiny ego all they want. You'll get no more tension from me.

                             

                            My week was great I did a double workout Tuesday which left me exhausted rest of the week. I raced another OSR unsactioned Race @1:00 AM that was hard. You have to think about the route and race through streets not often accompanied I got beat by everyone I hit one of the points twice got a lot more miles than the best route. But it was so much fun the first mile was a straight shot down the Williamsburg talk about ripping fast. Oh what fun.

                             

                            Date ▼ Activity Course Type Distance Duration Pace Actions
                            2/23/2020 Run Easy 8 with Vic  & Baby Girl Easy 8.25 mi 1:24:32 10:15  
                            2/23/2020 Run Runner's edge Fun Run Easy 7.13 mi 1:03:14 8:43  
                            2/23/2020 Run  OSR BreadRace Wall Street Bull\Tea Race 5.6 mi 33:54 6:06
                            2/22/2020 Run  10 Miles Easy with my Baby Girl Easy 10.0 mi 1:36:05 9:36
                            2/21/2020 Run

                            8 Miles easy on bike path w/ Bobby

                            Easy 8.5 mi 1:18:04 9:11
                            2/20/2020 Run

                            5 Miles easy on FHS Track

                            Easy 5.3 mi 48:44 9:15
                            2/20/2020 Run

                            Mona Peacock Cuddle Fartlek 🦚

                            Fartlek 9.3 mi 1:25:21 9:11
                            2/19/2020 Run

                            10 Miles easy on bike path w/ Oscar

                            Easy 10.1 mi 1:29:00 8:52
                            2/18/2020 Run

                            Evening 5x2k @7:10, 6:58, 6:52, 6:46, 6:33

                            Interval 10.3 mi 1:21:14 7:53
                            2/18/2020 Run

                            5x 2ks 8:08 7:55, 8:03, 7:50, 7:58 w/ Ali

                            Interval 11.5 mi 1:38:39 8:34
                            2/17/2020 Run

                            8 Miles easy on bike path

                            Easy 8.7 mi 1:14:11 8:32
                            2/17/2020 Run

                            Missing 4.5 miles

                            Easy 4.7 mi 37:48 8:03
                               

                            Total

                              99.4 14:30:46    

                            Thinking should be done first, before training begins.

                            Fishyone


                               

                              Fishyone - where are you at in what kind of cycle?

                               

                              Marathon cycle with a goal race Providence May 2nd (unless its warm then Sugarloaf ME may 17).  About 10 weeks out.

                               

                              So far I've done only tempo, MP and strides.  In the past Ive loosely followed Pfitz, but this time I'm kinda winging it.

                              5K 18:36 (2023), 10K 39:40 (2022), 1/2 1:24:37 (2023), full 2:58:36 (2015) 

                              Cyberic


                                 

                                 

                                My week was great I did a double workout Tuesday which left me exhausted rest of the week. I raced another OSR unsactioned Race @1:00 AM that was hard. You have to think about the route and race through streets not often accompanied I got beat by everyone I hit one of the points twice got a lot more miles than the best route. But it was so much fun the first mile was a straight shot down the Williamsburg talk about ripping fast. Oh what fun.

                                 

                                Date ▼ Activity Course Type Distance Duration Pace Actions
                                2/23/2020 Run Easy 8 with Vic  & Baby Girl Easy 8.25 mi 1:24:32 10:15  
                                2/23/2020 Run Runner's edge Fun Run Easy 7.13 mi 1:03:14 8:43  
                                2/23/2020 Run  OSR BreadRace Wall Street Bull\Tea Race 5.6 mi 33:54 6:06
                                2/22/2020 Run  10 Miles Easy with my Baby Girl Easy 10.0 mi 1:36:05 9:36
                                2/21/2020 Run

                                8 Miles easy on bike path w/ Bobby

                                Easy 8.5 mi 1:18:04 9:11
                                2/20/2020 Run

                                5 Miles easy on FHS Track

                                Easy 5.3 mi 48:44 9:15
                                2/20/2020 Run

                                Mona Peacock Cuddle Fartlek 🦚

                                Fartlek 9.3 mi 1:25:21 9:11
                                2/19/2020 Run

                                10 Miles easy on bike path w/ Oscar

                                Easy 10.1 mi 1:29:00 8:52
                                2/18/2020 Run

                                Evening 5x2k @7:10, 6:58, 6:52, 6:46, 6:33

                                Interval 10.3 mi 1:21:14 7:53
                                2/18/2020 Run

                                5x 2ks 8:08 7:55, 8:03, 7:50, 7:58 w/ Ali

                                Interval 11.5 mi 1:38:39 8:34
                                2/17/2020 Run

                                8 Miles easy on bike path

                                Easy 8.7 mi 1:14:11 8:32
                                2/17/2020 Run

                                Missing 4.5 miles

                                Easy 4.7 mi 37:48 8:03
                                   

                                Total

                                  99.4 14:30:46    

                                 

                                That is quite a week, again. You really took that 2K Tuesday thing seriously