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Distance runner, lifting curious (Read 130 times)


Interval Junkie --Nobby

    I'm looking to add some light strength training into my running routine.  I'm not enthusiastic about it, but recognize it could be healthy. (and JoannY and Abe looked mighty fine, last time I saw them)

     

    Hoping you folks could point me in the direction of a simple routine to add to my runs.  For runs I'm doing about 5x10miles of easy.  So far I've tried lifting for 10-30mins before heading out for 10miles.  There isn't much regiment to the lifting; it's usually whatever I can muster the will for before lacing up.  That said, it's pretty confused.

     

    (Sorry, I don't know the official names for anything -- and I only have dumbells)

     

    Monday: Upper-day

    3x10x10lbs straight arm lifts

    3x10x10lbs wings

    3x10x30lbs double curls

    3x10x30lbs double overhead press

    3x10x30lbs bench press

    3x10x45lbs single arm bent-over pull

    3x10x40lbs behind the head to over the head triangles

    10miles

     

    Tuesday: Composite

    3x10x45lbs squat Ra (goblet squat, to lifting the goblet straight over your head: RAH!)

    one of the exercises above that I wasn't able to do on Monday

    15 squat thrusts

    10miles

    Wed: rest

     

    Thursday: HIIT

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIHy-ZnSndA  however long I can last in this workout.  7mins -12mins?

    15 squat thrusts

    10miles

     

    Friday:

    3x10x30lbs double curls

    3x10x30lbs double overhead press

    3x10x30lbs bench press

    3x10x10lbs straight arm lifts

    10miles

     

    Saturday:

    60 inclined pushups. (easy-mode)

    3x8 squat thrusts

    Hang from the chin-up bar 3x as long as possible (which isn't long)

    10miles

     

    Sunday: Rest

     

    As you can see, it's a bit all over the board.  I could use some help with structure.

     

    Almost 50.  Only goal is functional strength and health.  Only have dumbells and a small 10x8 room to use them in.  Might be getting a kettlebell soon (on the fence).

     

    Suggestions?

    2021 Goals: 50mpw 'cause there's nothing else to do

    Joann Y


      The very basics would be to incorporate a push, a pull, a squat, and a deadlift. That's your template. From there you can do whatever you like. Push can mean bench press, pushups, overhead press etc. Pull can mean pullups, bent over rows etc. Squat can mean barbells squats, dumbbell squats, goblet squats, split squats, forward lunges, reverse lunges etc. Deadlift can be done with dumbbells, kettlebell, barbell, hexbar, etc and there a few different ways of doing these like romanian, etc. Just keep your basic template in mind and do that 2-3 times a week. Anything else is frosting, gravy, or whatever.

       

      I can't help but mention one of my favorite podcasts called "The Dumbbells", a couple of comedians doing a fitness podcast. I find it pretty fun and funny (sometimes crude) and I've learned a few things. Mostly I listen for laughs though. For purely practical information, Achieve Fitness based out of Boston has some really fantastic youtube videos and a great instagram feed that demonstrate great form. They also have a podcast that they recently cheesily renamed "Sweat Out; Happiness In!"

       

      Thanks for the compliment by the way. I wasn't looking so great when I got home and started yacking up all of the drinks and dinner that you so kindly provided for us!

       

       

      MTA: Here's the link to the youtube channel I mentioned and links to a couple of other workouts I do often:

      https://www.youtube.com/user/AchieveFitnessBoston/videos

       

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1E0kl_KUJ0

       

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYsWzRu_0Yc

       

      Oh, and by the way, I would do lifting after running not before. And if you are doing any kind of legs routine, do that on the same day you are doing a workout or long run so that you can truly recover on your other days. That's it.

       

       

      MMTA: Damn, you're old.


      Interval Junkie --Nobby

        Bah, I've lost 12lbs since that night and put on some muscle . . . just because of your visual reminders.  Also, exactly one beer a night is a good rule.  I look forward to it.  And I'm done after it.  (of course, it is an Imperial Stout, but let's not get too picky).

         

        Why the suggestion to lift after running?  Here's why I do before:

        1) I'm tired after my run -- so I don't have the gumption to do something I don't really like anyway (lifting).

        2) I'm cold after my run, this time of year.  And in the summer, I'll be soaked after my run.

         

        At this point I'm trying to make it as easy as possible to trick myself into doing weights.  Kinda like people who hate running, if you can just get them to lace up, you're 90% there.

         

        Thanks for the suggestions on the basics.  Do you do each (Pull, Push, etc) 2-3 times a week?  (same muscles)? And do you do all those things each day?

         

        Looks like I have some youtubing to do.

        2021 Goals: 50mpw 'cause there's nothing else to do

        Half Crazy K 2.0


          Bah, I've lost 12lbs since that night and put on some muscle . . . just because of your visual reminders.  Also, exactly one beer a night is a good rule.  I look forward to it.  And I'm done after it.  (of course, it is an Imperial Stout, but let's not get too picky).

           

          Why the suggestion to lift after running?  Here's why I do before:

          1) I'm tired after my run -- so I don't have the gumption to do something I don't really like anyway (lifting).

          2) I'm cold after my run, this time of year.  And in the summer, I'll be soaked after my run.

           

          At this point I'm trying to make it as easy as possible to trick myself into doing weights.  Kinda like people who hate running, if you can just get them to lace up, you're 90% there.

           

          Thanks for the suggestions on the basics.  Do you do each (Pull, Push, etc) 2-3 times a week?  (same muscles)? And do you do all those things each day?

           

          Looks like I have some youtubing to do.

          I've been regulary doing strength training for about 15 years. I prefer videos (Cathe Friedrich's stuff is great, but definitely more geared towards women). I've seen this dumbbell ony workout plan mentioned. To save time, you could skip the bicep & tricep exercises since you also work those when you do chest & back.

           

          As far as timing, are your training for anything specific running wise right now? If no, just do whatever makes it easier. If your focus is running, you want to do that first so workouts don't suffer. I tend to do lower body stuff on speedwork days. It's been far easier working from home--I run in the morning and do strength training after work.

          Joann Y


            Yes, one beer  a night (and ice cream) is also what I follow until I go to someone's house and all rules are out the door. I like a strong beer but lately it's really wearing me out so I'll have a SoLo or LaCroix some nights.

             

            I do what my coach has on my schedule which is usually some kind of general strength (core type boring stuff) twice a week and legs twice a week. I've been adding in the 18 min marathon lifting routine on my own (that I linked to) on my leg days to get that push and pull in there (my poor arms have disappeared since I have entered my dotage). Leg strength after running because running is my priority. You should just do whatever works for you (kind of like whatever gets you out the door idea) especially if you aren't specifically training for racing right now. I'm going to start adding more upper body stuff like biceps as "extras", you know, 'cause biceps.

             

            I like the template because then when I am looking at some complicated routine or program or even just what my coach gives me, I know what the basics are and it makes more sense, what can be added and what can be taken away. If I have gobs of time, it would be awesome to do what you are doing, but if I am in a hurry or just don't want to do it, I know there are 4 basic elements to cover for a full body strength routine.

             

            I see you have a good amount of back and shoulders and biceps stuff, that's all extra. You have a lot of "pushing" exercises. If you like your routine, I would add deadlifts a couple of days a week and maybe more pulling exercises. I would do at least all 4 elements 2-3 times a week but it doesn't have to be the same push exercise or the same pull exercise etc each time. You can pick and choose what you are in the mood for. Use the Achieve Fitness youtube page as a menu of exercises to choose from for the 4 basics.


            Interval Junkie --Nobby

               

              As far as timing, are your training for anything specific running wise right now?

               

              My only "goal" right now is to get up to around 60mpw of just easy/long runs.  4x10, 1x15, 1x6.  The will is there, but my bod is not.  Think I'm carrying around a bit too much which is causing shin-splints.  Probably need to drop another 15lbs.

               

              The only time I do a "hard" workout is when I slip in behind someone doing a temp that I think I can handle -- and then just for the joy of being pulled along.

               

              I like the idea of simplifying things.  I've always found that running is easiest when there's nothing to decide.  So, if I can figure out a template, like JoannY suggests, then I'll just go on automatic pilot.  Right now, there's just too much of "okay, what exercise should I do now."  More research and then just lock it in.

               

              As far as my current "routine" it's just a jumble of things I thought of, rather than anything coherent.  Probably need to re-look at this with the pull/push templates in mind.

              2021 Goals: 50mpw 'cause there's nothing else to do

              Art in AZ


                I can't really add much else to what has all ready been said. Like mentioned, it's what works for you.

                 

                I added more strength training to work the core and upper body. The vast majority is done in the morning. Though the routine depends on what I feel like doing. Sometimes weights before I run, sometimes after I run and sometimes during my run. Before or after I do several of the weight exercises you do.

                 

                There is a park a mile from the house that has 8 exercise stations. So I get that first mile in, then a set of pull-ups, run to halfway point and a set of push-ups, back to park and a set of chin-ups and a set of push-ups again. Except my hand position changes. One time normal spacing, the next fingers touching.

                 

                You may not want to do it right now, but if you're like me, it gets easier to do and add to your routine. Plus when your body starts shaping up some that serves as an incentive also. And I'm 68.

                Art in AZ

                Mesa, AZ


                MoBramExam

                  You're smart to recognize and address this as you move into and through your 50s. Trust me.

                   

                  To add a little and emphasize what's been said before:

                   

                  * For lower body, prioritize single leg movements. Trent Nessler and Jay Dicharry put out some great stuff on this subject. When running, we are never on both legs at the same time. Makes sense to incorporate strength training that supports this. Functional strength (and balance).

                   

                  * Also, whatever upper body weight movements you settle on, make sure the majority are performed standing up. We don't run laying on our backs or sitting down. Again, the added functional component.

                   

                  * Don't discount the benefits of the body weight movements. Push ups, pull ups, chins, hanging leg raises, etc.

                   

                  * As to the before or after question, my opinion is that after is preferred. However, as with any habit, whenever you will do it works best. I've evolved into incorporating most of my strength work into my post-run static stretching. Some is done with pre-run dynamic stretching. Both is done using the stretching as "rest intervals" between strength sets. Find what works.

                   

                  * As you age or when you increase volume or intensity of your running, keep in mind the effects of the additional strength training activity when allowing overall recovery time.

                   



                  Tchuck


                  Train SMART

                    "* For lower body, prioritize single leg movements. Trent Nessler and Jay Dicharry put out some great stuff on this subject. When running, we are never on both legs at the same time. Makes sense to incorporate strength training that supports this. Functional strength (and balance).

                    * Also, whatever upper body weight movements you settle on, make sure the majority are performed standing up. We don't run laying on our backs or sitting down. Again, the added functional component."

                     

                     

                    ☝️

                     

                    +1. This is golden and the philosophy I preach.

                    Creator of SMART Approach. Get Faster By Running Slower and Recovering Better


                    Interval Junkie --Nobby

                      Really wish I could give myself this piece of advice before starting out:

                       

                      Not all your muscles are up to the same weight.  So, while your arm/shoulder might be fine with a pair of 30lbs dumbells reaching to the sky, your core might not quite be up to supporting that.

                       

                      Nursing a strain at the moment.

                      2021 Goals: 50mpw 'cause there's nothing else to do

                      Joann Y


                        Nursing a strain at the moment.

                         

                        Rats. I was going to add that as an old person you are not the same person you used to be so always start with the most ridiculous lowest weight possible and see what happens and then increase from there if nothing bad comes of it. For anything shoulder I start with 1 pound. Stoopid but worth it. Sorry about the strain.


                        Interval Junkie --Nobby

                          It was an interesting reality check.  You know, when you grow up, you have a certain conception of what you're good at, and what you're not.  Core was my freakish super-power.  120 sit-ups in two minutes during middle-school gym class.  Chin-ups: 1 with a jumping start.

                           

                          So, to find my core not up to something is a good old-man wake-up call.

                           

                          Probably can't do a split anymore, either.

                          2021 Goals: 50mpw 'cause there's nothing else to do

                          Half Crazy K 2.0


                             

                            Probably can't do a split anymore, either.

                             

                            I don't recommend trying.  Based on experience

                              and JoannY and Abe looked mighty fine

                                

                              agreed

                              "Famous last words"  ~Bhearn

                                As to lifting:

                                 

                                Prior to the shut down in March, I was strength training twice a week. Anymore than that and I tend to bulk up with muscle I would rather not carry through a marathon or ultra.

                                 

                                Whichever the exercise, the sweet spot for me was 3 x 12 reps at xx weight.

                                This was for free weights (dumb bells) or machines.

                                Other than leg lifts (machines) and single leg squats I wasn't doing much lower body work.

                                 

                                When you get into your rhythm, you may want to consider "The Grind" which is mixing walking, jump rope or running into your routine.

                                For example:

                                Run 5 miles

                                During recovery between your reps / sets, jump rope, walk or run.

                                I would typically jog for 2 minutes, then do a set of reps, jog for 2 minutes, etc.

                                Finish up with a 5 mile run

                                 

                                That activity in the middle keeps your heart rate elevated and if jogging between reps / sets, the mileage starts to add up.

                                You can increase your miles at the front and back end when you plateau

                                "Famous last words"  ~Bhearn

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