Forums >Health and Nutrition>The COVID-19 Wild West Thread
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Feeling the growl again
This is great stuff, thank you! Please keep us up to date as the vaccine news progresses, you seem to be RA's resident expert on this
Moderna just released additional results showing that their mRNA vaccine results in neutralizing antibody levels which are at the high end of what is observed in patients recovering from COVID-19. Significantly, results were similar across the three age groups people were separated into. So the vaccine looks to be as effective at generating antibodies in the high-risk >65 age group as in younger patients.
Antibody levels are encouraging but not a "hard" endpoints. The Phase III study underway will tell us if fewer people on the vaccine vs. placebo arm actually contract COVID.
"If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does. There's your pep talk for today. Go Run." -- Slo_Hand
I am spaniel - Crusher of Treadmills
One day at a time
Moderna just released additional results showing that their mRNA vaccine results in neutralizing antibody levels which are at the high end of what is observed in patients recovering from COVID-19. Significantly, results were similar across the three age groups people were separated into. So the vaccine looks to be as effective at generating antibodies in the high-risk >65 age group as in younger patients. Antibody levels are encouraging but not a "hard" endpoints. The Phase III study underway will tell us if fewer people on the vaccine vs. placebo arm actually contract COVID.
Thanks for the update. It really is helpful to hear from someone knowledgeable about all this. I feel overwhelmed trying to separate valid info from garbage.
Good Bad & The Monkey
I got this vaccine last week. It packed a wallop. This is hopeful news, thanks Spaniel. Do you have the link?
I'm running somewhere tomorrow. It's going to be beautiful. I can't wait.
Poor baby
RIP Milkman
1) What does packing a wallop mean in terms of side effects?
2) Spaniel - thank you so much for the update. Do you think these companies will feel pressured to get the vaccine out quickly, or do you think they will operate on an "honest" timeline?
5K: 16:37 (11/20) | 10K: 34:49 (10/19) | HM: 1:14:57 (5/22) | FM: 2:36:31 (12/19)
What does packing a wallop mean in terms of side effects?
Thursday - got the shot ~10am. Shoulder was aching by that afternoon, outright hurting that evening.
Friday - soooooo tired. I slept 14+ hours. Shoulder ached far worse, like I had been punched very hard. The slightest headache. Did I mention, I was tired? Maybe some mild body aches too.
Saturday - had a 50k on the books. I could barely run. So I walked. 30+ miles of walking. At one point, the study nurse texted to check in. When I told her I was doing a 50k and had decided to walk the whole thing because I could not remotely run, she responded that she would just try again another time. Still some shoulder pain. Some slight headache. I also got some pretty good back and neck aches by that evening, not what I would expect from the 50k.
Sunday - slight shoulder pain, still weak and tired, and achy in places that should not ache from the 50k. Maybe a bit perkier. Boy did I sleep well.
Monday - shoulder pain is almost gone. Still achy. Boy did I sleep well.
Tuesday - pretty much all better.
Booster shot coming in about 3 weeks.
Do you think these companies will feel pressured to get the vaccine out quickly, or do you think they will operate on an "honest" timeline?
To my understanding, this is not up to the company but rather up to the FDA. The FDA may feel pressured to get the vaccine out quickly, especially by the executive branch, but it would require a policy and procedure change to how Phase III trials are done. The Moderna trial is currently set as a 24 month (I believe) trial, which would only shorten if there is interim data showing: 1) a strong effect versus placebo, 2) an inadequate effect versus placebo, or 3) unacceptable side effects. At this point it would be unethical to continue the trial or to continue to randomize people to placebo.
Sounds even worse than the shingles shots. I felt like somebody was punching my arms for days. My husband had flu-like symptoms. But we didn't have both issues at once!
Sleeping all the time sounds like my dream vaccine. Sign me up. Although for my flu shot last year, the nurse who administered completely botched it and put it into my shoulder ligament, which I didn't realize until it was still hurting a week later. Took three months for that pain to go away. It was so bad the first 4 weeks I needed help putting on and taking off shirts. So this can't be worse than that!
Oh, don't get me wrong. I was delighted to sleep so well so long.
Sleeping all the time sounds like my dream vaccine.
Mother of Cats
Sounds like this is NOT a vaccine to get while in the middle of marathon training....
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Your T-cells were angry and ready to fight. Sounds like a bit of cytokine storm.
Note they did discontinue a higher dose due to side effects. Poking the immune system has consequences.
I don't know whether this link is active without a subscription but give it a try. Complete with a nice little graph.
https://endpts.com/moderna-takes-one-more-step-along-the-high-wire-act-of-covid-19-vaccine-work-offering-markers-of-success-for-the-most-vulnerable-age-group/
1) What does packing a wallop mean in terms of side effects? 2) Spaniel - thank you so much for the update. Do you think these companies will feel pressured to get the vaccine out quickly, or do you think they will operate on an "honest" timeline?
Everybody feels pressure to get things out quickly. But The FDA in the US and EMA in the EU control approvals. The companies don't get a say.
While the trials may be set to run 24 months there are typically interim data readouts built in which would allow submission to the FDA quicker if....IF...robust efficacy is evident. Interim readouts typically lack the full statistical power designed into the trial so the effect must be stronger than what would need to be seen at the end to call it a positive result. Given the comments made about news yet this year, I expect there is some sort of interim readout. But I haven't definitively seen it in the description of the trial.
I do not know the dose I received.
Interestingly I had CV HKU1 confirmed in March, and there is some speculation (without any emphatic research to support it...yet) that the minor coronaviridae may offer some protection against CV19. That could also explain my T-cell / immune system reactivity.
Your T-cells were angry and ready to fight. Sounds like a bit of cytokine storm. Note they did discontinue a higher dose due to side effects. Poking the immune system has consequences.
not bad for mile 25
Followup question: Might they feel pressure to provide a stronger dose than ultimately proves necessary, simply because they don't have the data to determine the most appropriate dose?