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Half Marathon Pace and Tempo pace (Read 281 times)

    If I want to run my half marathon in 1:30, that is, 6:52/mi pace in two weeks, shall I run my Tempo at 6:30 - 6:46, which is McMillan calculator's suggestion. I know I am supposed to train on my current fitness level, not the goal level. My question really is: can I use the tempo pace to gauge my HMP? If I couldn't hit 6:30/mi for 4 miles, I shouldn't think to run 6:52/mi in the race. Is it the right reasoning?

     

    By the way, during last Sunday 11-mile run I tested my fitness and ran 6:52/mi for 8 miles. The last mile was rather difficult, but the next day my legs were good (only slighly sore).

    5k - 20:56 (09/12), 7k - 28:40 (11/12), 10k trial - 43:08  (03/13), 42:05 (05/13), FM - 3:09:28 (05/13), HM - 1:28:20 (05/14), Failed 10K trial - 6:10/mi for 4mi (08/14), FM - 3:03 (09/14)


    an amazing likeness

      By the way, during last Sunday 11-mile run I tested my fitness and ran 6:52/mi for 8 miles. The last mile was rather difficult, but the next day my legs were good (only slighly sore).

       

      Doubt there's a hard & fast rule on tempo pace relating directly race pace -- tempo is (should be?) an effort level rather than a pace. You're a pretty experienced runner and can tell if that 6:50 for 8 will translate through the 13 miles...I'd suspect it will. Except for the section coming up cable hill.

      Acceptable at a dance, invaluable in a shipwreck.

        can I use the tempo pace to gauge my HMP? If I couldn't hit 6:30/mi for 4 miles, I shouldn't think to run 6:52/mi in the race. Is it the right reasoning?

         

        It doesn't really work like that.

         

        I could NEVER run a 4 mile tempo at a pace 20 seconds faster than HMP. Never. No way. There are plenty of days when a 4 mile tempo AT HMP feels like an epic struggle. This past winter when I was getting ready to race a half marathon, I did a lot of "cruise intervals" at HMP with the longest being 4 x 2 miles right at HMP. The longest sustained tempo I did was a 5 mile tempo at HMP.

         

        If you can run 8 miles at 6:52 in training, I would say you can easily run that pace for a half marathon. I have never done an 8-mile tempo at half marathon pace. Just thinking about that makes me want to throw up.

        Runners run

          I've been running and coaching for a long time. Assuming you are in 1:30 shape your 20 min tempo should be closer to 6:42, and I'd say in the range of 6:45 to 6:40, running as a progression. As for 8 miles at goal pace, that is too fast for a workout. Try half marathon pace plus 10 sec per mile. I got that tip from a former American record holder. Also see Daniels, he has a table showing paces for long tempos.

            Thanks guys. All three answers above are very helpful for me. This morning I ran my scheduled 4-mile tempo. Considering the 110 feet elevation on the first 2 miles, it wasn't too bad, average at 7:06.

             

            milktruck You are right, the course isn't flat. So my strategy is to run @6:40 on flat, and @7:00 - 7:15 on hill. Among the 8 miles, 4-mile downhill paces were @6:30.

             

            mikeymike Thanks for sharing your experience. It really gives me the confidence to execute my plan. I rarely race, so I wanted to run 8 miles  for a race simulation to build some confidence and to remind myself the race pain and how to cope with it. :-)

             

            A Trackrat I have one more speed and one more tempo to run next week. I am going to take a little easier. I don't think a couple speed and tempo contribute that much to my training on this stage. I shouldn't stress myself too much.

            5k - 20:56 (09/12), 7k - 28:40 (11/12), 10k trial - 43:08  (03/13), 42:05 (05/13), FM - 3:09:28 (05/13), HM - 1:28:20 (05/14), Failed 10K trial - 6:10/mi for 4mi (08/14), FM - 3:03 (09/14)

            AmoresPerros


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              I could NEVER run a 4 mile tempo at a pace 20 seconds faster than HMP. Never. No way. There are plenty of days when a 4 mile tempo AT HMP feels like an epic struggle.

               

              Same for me.

              It's a 5k. It hurt like hell...then I tried to pick it up. The end.

                 I could NEVER run a 4 mile tempo at a pace 20 seconds faster than HMP. Never. No way. There are plenty of days when a 4 mile tempo AT HMP feels like an epic struggle. 

                 

                +1 to that. When I was training hard at the start of 2013 my tempo runs were mostly ~10 seconds slower than what ended up being my HMP and they still felt like death. You're a different person when you have a bib on your chest than when you're slogging it out alone.

                AmoresPerros


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                  +1 to that. When I was training hard at the start of 2013 my tempo runs were mostly ~10 seconds slower than what ended up being my HMP and they still felt like death. You're a different person when you have a bib on your chest than when you're slogging it out alone.

                   

                  Also when you're at the end of a taper instead of in the middle of a training cycle.

                  It's a 5k. It hurt like hell...then I tried to pick it up. The end.

                  bhearn


                    I have never done an 8-mile tempo at half marathon pace. Just thinking about that makes me want to throw up.

                     

                    +1. Pfitzinger has you going up to 7, at HM pace or *slightly faster*, and that is a killer workout.

                      This is my first half. Maybe I could run faster then.

                      5k - 20:56 (09/12), 7k - 28:40 (11/12), 10k trial - 43:08  (03/13), 42:05 (05/13), FM - 3:09:28 (05/13), HM - 1:28:20 (05/14), Failed 10K trial - 6:10/mi for 4mi (08/14), FM - 3:03 (09/14)

                        I did it in 1:28:20. The average pace was 6:45/mi. The elevation was 1033 ft in total. It was hard at the end, particularly the last 2 miles, It felt like just hill after hill. My first 10k was 41 minutes.

                        5k - 20:56 (09/12), 7k - 28:40 (11/12), 10k trial - 43:08  (03/13), 42:05 (05/13), FM - 3:09:28 (05/13), HM - 1:28:20 (05/14), Failed 10K trial - 6:10/mi for 4mi (08/14), FM - 3:03 (09/14)

                        Julia1971


                          Just curious...  Are you training for something?  I remember you had a great debut marathon.

                            Just curious...  Are you training for something?  I remember you had a great debut marathon.

                             

                            I was training for this half marathon. The time I decided to enter the race, there was only 7 weeks left. I didn't have enough time to train for a full, so I entered the half. Prior to that, I only ran 10 miles a week since the first marathon in last May, so I didn't have the base to tackle a full this time. I ramp up very fast, from 10  miles per week to 45 miles in 5 weeks. Luckily I didn't get injured this time.

                             

                            I don't have a plan at the moment. I may think to run a marathon in fall to qualify for the Boston.

                            5k - 20:56 (09/12), 7k - 28:40 (11/12), 10k trial - 43:08  (03/13), 42:05 (05/13), FM - 3:09:28 (05/13), HM - 1:28:20 (05/14), Failed 10K trial - 6:10/mi for 4mi (08/14), FM - 3:03 (09/14)

                              Congrats! I was pretty sure would be under 1:30.

                              Runners run

                              bap


                                I did one tempo run all year before my big HM PR in September 2010.

                                 

                                However, I did run 12 x 4 mile races that you, which averaged out at about the HM pace.

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