Forums >Racing>2023 The Waltons: Racing & Training Thread
Good luck at the Honest 10! I always find that course tough - there is usually some kind of headwind to deal with!
I mean, this is Wellington, about the only place in the world where the wind can blow from both directions at once.
Fred - I have all three of those shoes and personally I find the Rebel to be the slower of the 3 (although I do love them). They're brilliantly comfortable but I use them as a long run shoe when I'm not trying to run particularly fast. I love the Speed 2's and use them for workouts and steady runs. I agree on the Endorphins, you have to work to get the best out of them. Having said that I tend to have very high cadence (like 195-200spm) so I suspect the plated shoes with that extra pop do make quite a difference for me.
MJ - you're far enough down the track now that I guess it's kinda just battle through it... fingers crossed it doesn't give you any issues.
James - the pace will come... especially if the body is starting to feel in good shape.
Me: Reasonable sort of week and felt like I was working back into decent form. Had to bring forward Sat/Sun runs to Fri/Sat which meant I didn't get my usual Fri rest day... so running a track session in the middle of the day on Friday was tough going in the heat (and wind) on tired legs. Horribly windy on Saturday which also meant a tough headwind coming up the long hill at the end of my long run so that was a fairly brutal end to the week, albeit it looks like that weather is gonna hang on for most of this week. One more big week then will start to reduce volume. Looking like there might be some seriously fast runners at Southern Lakes including Caden Shields who was at world marathon champs a couple years ago and may threaten the course record... hoping there's a few around my pace too that I can work with.
3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)
10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)
* Net downhill course
Last race: Xterra Waitawa, 21 May, didn't die
Up next: Xterra Hunua, 11 June, also aiming to not die
"CONSISTENCY IS KING"
Mark - That kind of makes sense given you're much faster than me, so you'll get more benefit from plated shoes than me (based on what I've read here and elsewhere about the performance curve of carbon shoes). For some reason, my cadence has dropped over the past year, which is contrary to what I've heard about runners shortening their strides and upping their cadence as they get older. Good to hear you feel like you're getting back into form.
5k 23:48.45 (3/22); 4M 31:26 (2/22); 5M 38:57 (11/22); 10k 49:24 (10/22); Half 1:48:32 (10/22)Upcoming race(s): Federal Twist 10k, 6/3; NYC Marathon, 11/6/23
Thanks for Hash for pointing out the Honest 10 had moved. I decided not to run it anyway as I'm still in Covid recovery mode. I have a bit of asthma still, which is getting better.
Mark - nice week.
I have the Endorphin Pro's, which I now use for my long road runs. They're quite nice and quick, although they are fairly hard.
First full week of training post Covid. Have kept it pretty light. Two strength sessions, plus what is below:
PRs: 5km 18:43 (Dec 2015), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:26:16 (Sep 2016), full 3:09:28 (Jun 2015)
40+ PRs: 5km 19:31 (Oct 2020), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:29:39 (Jun 2018), full 3:13:55 (Sep 2022)
My week:
Monday 20 minute easy spin workout plus upper body strength
Tuesday am 6 miles with 6 x 800 tempo-ish pace pm lower body strength training
Wednesday am 4.6 easy miles pm Upper body strength training
Thursday rest day
Friday am 5.8 miles with 10 x 2 minutes hard pm stregth training
Saturday 3.7 easy
Sunday 6.6 miles easy plus short strength training workout
Weather has been all over the place. I've run in long sleeves and tights and a tank and shorts this week. Typical spring in MD.
Mark, interesting about the wind coming from 2 different directions. I've seen wind shear mentioned here usually when talking about storms.
Fred, did you do the same mile course for the shoe experiement? I've been debating trying some New Balance. There are often really good deals on Joe's New Balance website. I really like their Impact shorts.
MJ, that seems like a good amount of time on your feet. Hopefully it just needs time to heal and running doesn;t make it any worse.
JamesD, running feeling easier is always a good thing.
Watson, nicce week for recovery mode. For the long runs with the Endorphon Pros, are you doing them at an easier pace or with quality mixed in?
Mother of Cats
Ditto for NoVA. And nice week!
Marky-Mark - I enjoyed the link on the weather. Interesting stuff.
Hashiritai - Congrats on a hard fought marathon! They are all adventures, but especially the first.
Watson - it looks like you are coming back from Covid sensibly.
Fred -I'm sure you do not want to buy another pair of shoes, but if you did...I would look and see if you could find a pair of New Balance RC Elite 2s (not the 1 and not the 3s). Since those are now discontinued, you may be able to find them at a discount. Based on what you are writing, I think you might like that shoe a lot as a racer.
MickJogger - I hope things continue to improve!
James - I also hope for continued improvement for you.
Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.
And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.
50 miles running, ~1000 yards swimming and 4.5 hours pool-running.
M: 90 minutes pool-running and upper body weights/core. T: 11 miles, including a track workout of 2x800, 2x1200, 2x800 in 3:15, 3:16, 5:01, 4:56, 3:13, 3:11. Recoveries between 2:2x and 2:4x Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming.W: 11 miles very easy (9:21) plus drills and hill sprints. Streaming yoga later. Th: 90 minutes pool-running and upper body weights/core. F: 1.5 miles (10:00), break to time team track workout, 9.5 miles very easy (9:27) plus drills and strides.Sa: 17 miles, with 4, 3, 2, 1 miles at marathon effort with 1 mile float in between. Averaged 7:31 pace for the 4 miles, 7:27 pace for the 3 miles, 7:24 pace for the 2 miles, and ran the last mile in 7:14 (too fast). Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 meters recovery swimming.Su: Streaming yoga and 90 minutes pool-running.
My paces got significantly faster this week, so that was nice. The weather is warming up, and the dystonia/neuro stuff seems much better when it's warmer. Tuesday's track workout was one of the fastest that I've done in some time.
Since I haven't done much (if anything) in the way of strength/marathoner workouts since Houston in January, I threw one in on Saturday. Since I'm not racing longer than a half-marathon until October, I don't think I need many of these workouts, but one or two doesn't hurt when training for half-marathons.
I was mostly happy with it. As the weather gods would have it, my first really big workout in a few months fell on the first really summer-ish day of the year. (Since this is the weather-whining thread - we started at 65 F with a DP of 63 and ended at 69 F with a DP of 64. Not awful, but I'm not acclimated yet.) I was a bit worried about how things would go, but they turned out fine - I was able to hit a nice rhythm for the four and three mile segments.
By the time I hit the two mile segment, I was starting to get a bit dehydrated (I had drained my water bottle), and so I panicked a little and sped up to get the workout over with. Thus the two mile was split as 7:30/7:18 and then I finished with a 7:14. Both the 7:18 and the 7:14 were too hard to be honest marathon effort, so that wasn't great. However, I don't think I dug a hole or anything, so I'll just mark it down as a mistake to avoid repeating.
Mark - Haha. Yup, it sure is a fun place to live! Mind you, Auckland sure seems to get its fair share of wild and changeable weather!
DW - Thanks. Loved almost everything about my first marathon, minus the really sore left leg in the last 10k that almost had me hobbling. However, given that I know at least five people that did not finish (including one guy from my club who was gunning for a podium finish but lasted less than 3.5km, and another from a rival club that was tripped by his club mate right at the start and his race lasted all of 9 secs) I'm really happy to have made it to that finish line.
My marathon run on Strava below, if anyone's interested in having a wee gander
50+ age-group PBs: Half Perish 1:28:11 (Sept '22 Off-Road Half) - 10km 37:52 (2022 Local Road Champs); - Track 5km 18:49 (Aug '22); Track Mile 5:32 (2021) - Perish Run 3:17:42
2023 Goals: Perish Run Sub 3:15 - Half Perish Sub 1:25 - Road/Track 10km Sub 37:30 - 5km Sub 18:20
It seems a lot DNF at Christchurch. I have three Strava friends who did the full - Hash is the only one who finished! Steve pulled out. And the other is a pretty good woman runner (probably 3:15 on a good day) who pulled out at the 32km mark.
Watson - Didn't realise that you knew Ange! Yeah, she's a good runner. Not quite sure what caused her to vomit, but sounds like she had a tough time of it. No matter what the training, a finish is definitely not guaranteed, eh?
Darkwave - Thanks for the tip on the shoes. Glad you didn't "dig a hole" with that workout. Nice week.
HCK - Yes it was the same mile for each pair of shoes. There's a nice 1-mile loop (well 0.98, but I extend it) that starts and ends at my house that made the shoe test easy. I know what you mean about the weather being quite variable right now.
Hash - congratulations on your first marathon.
Watson - Good week for coming back from illness. Yes, "hard" is a good word for the Endorphin Pros.
Mark - A big week indeed. Nice going and good luck with the taper next week.
Last week was the middle of three weeks between my last half and my next one. Sadly, the forecast suggests my next half may be just like the last one: raining, humid, and windy. For a moment, when I saw the latest forecast, "DNS" crossed my mind, but I shook off the feeling. 40.8 miles / 65.6km / 6:40:57 for the week.
I decided to do some shoe experimenting thanks to Fred. I got 2 pairs of Enorphin Pro 1s and 2 Vaporflies for under $100 and I've barely worn them. This morning I wore the Pros for a tempo-ish workout. One thing I really noticed is that it seems to shift work to my glutes. Usually I feel my quads more. The only thing I can think is these seem to have almost a rocker sole. About 10 years ago, that was the hot thing, mostly geared towards women, that if you got rocker bottom shoes, it would magically shape and tone your ass just from day to day walking around. I like firm shoes, so no issues on that front with the Pros.
HCK - Good luck with your shoe trial. I'm curious to hear how it goes for you.
With 4 days until my next half, there's a divergence of forecasts on the rain and wind. One says rain throughout with 20mph (32kph) gusting to 30 (48), while the other says rain ending during the race and wind at less than 10 (16). It will be what it will be.
What the forecasts agree on is it will be 60º (16C) and humid. That's a serious thing for me. I race best when it's 50º (10C) or cooler. I've never even broken 2 hours in a half when it's been 60º or warmer (I've gone sub-2 a total of 18 times in cooler weather). I'm seriously considering making my goal to go sub-2 in over 60º.
Glute Force
Mark are you racing this weekend - if so good luck to you!
hk - I remember the rocker shoes but I thought the Kardashians all had plastic bum surgery. Could it really have been that invention 10 years ago?
watson - how did the It project go and do you now have time for lunch bike rides?
steve - sorry about that race - I have both the endorphin pros as well as the speeds. I do my “long” runs in the speeds to adapt to the similar shoe. But I agree with watson in that those super shoes while being expwnsive - they are just a bit more expensive than the normal trainers. I did get injured on the long run the day after I had taken the super shoes for a threshold run. My goal however is far far far more modest than yours so I hope that it will be ok.
hash - great race result!
dwave - super week, as always! So consistent
fred- go for the show! Sub 120 or go home you can do it!
Hot Weather Complainer
Hash - Well done again. It did seem like a lot of carnage for no obvious reason. Apart from the wind (which wasn't that bad), the weather was good.
Fred - With that weather it may just have to be a rare day where you don't PR! Good plan making a more conservative goal.
Mick - Thanks, I appreciate it. I've bought a pair of Saucony Tempus at the recommendation of my coach. Similarities to the Endorphin Pro but no carbon plate. There is some research that suggests the carbon plate is only helping at > 16km/h. I've had success in shorter distances and I'm becoming more convinced that the shoe is the main source of my trouble in the marathon. As JMac said in the other thread, it makes no sense to feel cramp starting before halfway in a marathon at a pace 10 minutes slower than a half marathon in which I didn't cramp. I'll be using the Tempus in 8-10 workouts, including long runs, in the next 6 weeks. Then I'll try them in what is technically another marathon but one I'm going into with an experimental mindset. Pulling the pin in Christchurch gives me that opportunity.
My race report is on this page:
Christchurch Marathon
Hash - I'm now following "Italian guy" from my race report on Strava. It appears you may know him too. We ran together for about an hour. I wish it was longer.
5km: 18:53 12/22 │ 10km: 40:49 2/22 │ HM: 1:27:32* 5/22 │ M: 3:35:02 10/22
*Net Downhill. Flat course PR: 1:29:25 6/16
Upcoming Races:
Selwyn Marathon June 4, 2023
Hagley Park Run July 1 and August 12, 2023 (threshold Check ins)
Canterbury Road Running Champs 10km August 26, 2023
Run Prix Half Marathon (Melbourne) September 24, 2023
JamesD
Steve - Sorry about your frustrating Christchurch experience. Your plan for Selwyn seems like a good one.
Fred - Good luck in your half! I hope we both can get 60+ PRs this year, though not of the same kind.
I mentioned a couple of weeks ago that I had bought some pickle juice to drink before swimming, as I was occasionally getting foot & leg cramps. So far I haven’t had any cramps after drinking it, but I do find that after about 30-40 minutes I want to bring the pickle juice back up (but don’t). This week was mostly positive for me, with my two longest runs of the year (which says more about how the year has gone so far) and generally feeling pretty good. I did tweak my left hamstring on Friday when I tried some slightly faster running to see if I even want to tempo the 5K in Omaha in two weeks, but it feels ok today.
Sun - 12.4 miles PM in park @ 8:25
Mon - 7.5 miles very slow treadmill (90:25) + 0:40 walk breaks/6:00
Tues - 31 minutes swimming
Weds - 12.7 miles AM in park @ 8:33, L Achilles sore after
Thurs - 7.5 miles very slow TM (90:25) + 0:40 walk breaks/6:00, L hamstring sore late
Fri - 7.3 miles AM in park incl. strides, 1.6 @ 7:41, L hamstring sore
Sat - 44 minutes swimming
Total - 47.4 miles
YTD Average - 34.9 mpw
Post-1987 PRs: Half 1:30:14 (2019); 10K 39:35 (2019); 5K 19:12 (2017); Mile 5:37.3 (2020)
'23 Goals: health; consistency; age-graded PRs; half < 1:30