Forums >Racing>Competitive Jerks Racing and Training - 2023
Nice racing Marky & Flavio!
Dave
This thread is running HOT.
Mark Nice win. I like that you walked us through your thoughts.
Flavio I'm very glad you managed that despite your recent issues. I'm starting to think DW is onto something with not checking the watch during races. The current pace reading does nothing but anger and/or discourage me. During the HM I just did, it said my mile splits were 6:50-7:05 pace lol!
I guess I won't give every detail of my week to help the thread cool. In a nutshell:
6 days of running, one double, 60 miles, 96.6 kilometers, 7:50:50
2 Quality Sessions: 1.Treadmill 15 X (45 seconds 10% incline 8-8.5 mph w/ 2 min recovery), easier than expected. 2. 16 mile long run today in 1:56:57 outside in beautiful weather. The run felt great, pretty much no fatigue in my legs it seemed. Lately I've been increasing both my mileage and my strength training, so my legs have been feeling dead a lot.
Dorothea The trend continues lol, last night 4 cervezas, today a successful LR where I felt full of energy the whole time. Also I have the same issue with sleep, I aim for 7-8 hours but get 6 most nights during the week. I try to make up for it on weekends.
Mikkey Lol, as always.
Love all of the racing lately!
Flavio- Hell's Yeah! 10K PR is awesome. Can't wait to see what the 5k brings.
Mark- Great race under some tough conditions, the most impressive being to run through the heat.
Merk- Think I already gave you a thumbs up for your race but I'll give you another here.
5K 18:36 (2023), 10K 39:40 (2022), 1/2 1:29:07 (2015), full 2:58:36 (2015)
Mother of Cats
I'm starting to think DW is onto something with not checking the watch during races. The current pace reading does nothing but anger and/or discourage me.
That's one of the reasons I hate looking at it. Knowing my splits sends me to a negative place (either they're too slow and I'm angry, or they're too fast and I'm worried I'm going to blow up, or they're just right but I feel like I'm working too hard for them). I know some people feel that looking at a watch helps them dig deeper, but for me the incentive of finishing the race and getting to stop running is all I need to dig deep.
As for Saturday night, perhaps the Cervezas were carb-loading?
Flavio - fantastic race and race report! I'm so happy you snagged that PR. Shame about the wine, but the wine would have been gone soon, and PRs are lifelong. Congratulations to your wife as well!
DKTrotter - that was a hard week. Very hard. The Michigan workout AND a 10K very hard in the same week? I'm hoping you get some recovery time next week to absorb all of your hard work. Also, I'm confused - did you end up running the 10K at 10K effort? So essentially a 10K time trial on tired legs?
Mikkey - I'd seen the photo before, but hadn't heard the backstory. Love it!
MarkyMark - I already commented on your awesome race, so I'll just go with CONGRATS here. And yeah, hot half-marathons suck. I'm not sure I want to know, but...why does Okahu Bay smell bad? Flooding and sewage?
Steve - my fingers are crossed that you get some decent weather for your race.
Andy - I agree with everything you've already read. An accidental 10K PR during training is a very good sign.
Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.
And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.
My week:
52 miles running, 3 hours pool-running, and ~1500 yards swimming.
M: 90 minutes pool-running. T: 10 miles, including a track workout of 400, 800, 2x1200, 800, 3x400 in 1:43, 3:31, 5:10, 5:10, 3:22, 1:37, 1:38, 1:39. Recoveries between 1 and 1:3x for the 400s; recoveries between 2:0x and 3:1x after the 800s and 1200s. Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming. W: 10 miles very easy (9:34) on treadmill plus upper body weights/core. Th: 90 minutes pool-running and streaming yoga. F: 10 miles, including a 6400m tempo on the track in 28:54 (7:22/7:13/7:09/7:10); followed with 4x30 second hill repeats, leg strengthwork, and 500 yards recovery swimming. Sa: 10 miles easy (9:34) on treadmill plus upper body weights/core. Su: 12 miles, including 8 Iwo Jima hills (2:00 powerful up a 3% incline, then 90 second jog; 40 second downhill stride and then 60 second jog to bottom). Odd hill repeats (1,3,5,7) focused on knee lift and bouncy stride; even hill repeats focused on stride extension. Followed with drills and two strides, injury prevention work, and 500 meters recovery swimming.
First full week of track workouts after the Houston Marathon. My gait is feeling smoother and more stable, and running in the dark on a crowded track is much easier than it used to be, though still not easy. Not 100%, but 85% of where I want to be. I do feel like I've lost fitness, and so some of my work will be regaining that.
Some great running going on around here!
I neglected to post last week’s summary. I’m now 12 weeks out from Eugene; I’ve decided to do a parkrun 5k next weekend to see where things are at, going into full-fledged marathon training. So the last couple weeks I’ve been getting in some VO2max track work. Targeting 5k pace range of 6:20 (ideal) to 6:30 (adequate).
Last week was 6x800m. Never looked at my watch till hitting lap, splits were 3:16, 3:15, 3:14, 3:13...I was thinking how cool it would be if I kept dropping 1 second per rep. Instead I went for the hammer-the-next-to-last-rep approach, and finished with 3:08 & 3:07. I was happy with where that ended.
This week was 4x1200m. A bit rough to start with paces of 6:36 & 6:33, then hammered the last two with both at 6:15. Those two certainly felt hard.
For my LR this week I planned 16 steady, but the thing with my running group is someone will be doing an interesting workout and I’ll get lured in. Like last week’s MP miles. This week I ended up doing 18 with progression: 8 @ 9:00, 4 @ 8:20, 2 @ 8:00, 1 @ 7:30, 1 @ 7:00, 2 cooldown. More fun than just a steady paced LR anyway.
Finished the week with 63 miles, for 6 straight at 60+.
Weekly for period: From: 01/30/2023 To 02/05/2023
My week was one of those up and down weeks. Wanted to be in the mid-70s but Friday happened
Had one of my worst runs in months Tuesday AM. Just no energy, heartburn and that "mouthfull of spit" feeling. All at a 9 minute pace?? By the PM commute I was fine and had a really nice run. Who knows....
Wednesday's cruise interval run was excellent but one minute rest between the miles is agonizingly short
Friday was a work inspired "rest day" just no way to fit in a run.
Cobra Commander Keen
Flavio - Congratulations on the shiny new PR.
Mark - Excellent job in that summer HM. Also: bearded lamas would, of course, be imperial.
Andy - Unintentional PR? Awesome! You'll definitely be able to lower that a lot more in a proper race.
Dorothea - I'm glad you're feeling better, and well done snagging a CR in that banger of a workout.
DWave - I'm glad you're continuing to progress back. Nice week.
I finally logged a decent week! Miles are getting longer, which I love. On Thursday I was really looking forward to the higher mileage over the next couple days. I also killed my treadmill on Wednesday trying to do a workout in the morning. The thing literally just shut off, no warning. Hopefully I can fix the thing (luckily I purchased a multimeter the week before because it was a smokin' deal and on the off chance I might need it some day) rather than needing to replace it.
5k: 17:58 11/22 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:23:22 4/22 │ M: 2:56:05 12/22
Upcoming Races:
Heartland 50 - May 6
Pain is my friend
Mark- Awesome job on the 1:17 half marathon. One day I will get back under 1:20.
Mikkey- I would love to run the Edinburgh marathon. I was in Scottland a month to late last year.
I am still getting back in to the swing of things and building miles back up. Had 2 good workouts last week. 8 mile easy progressive and a 18 trail run with 2k vert.
I am done with winter. Anyone else?
ATY 24 141.445 2019 1st
Bear 100 22:08 2021
Jackpot 100 Feb 14:59 - 5th
St George marathon Oct 1st 2:58
ATY 24 130.969 2022 2nd
Pulse endurance 12 hour 76.22 1ST CR
June 24 hour Six days in the Dome
July Backyard ultra
Sept Bear 100
So, I used to look at my watch quite a lot in races and in my HM on the weekend I really didn't look very much. I looked at the km splits early on just to confirm that I wasn't going too hard, and checked the HR a few times just to confirm that it wasn't getting out of kilter with the effort level. But around 45 minutes in I realised I'd barely looked at my watch and was reminded of your approach! I'm not sure I could ever cover it off entirely the way you do, but it was a good reminder to just use the watch as a piece of feedback alongside everything the body is saying, and not rely too heavily on it.
3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)
10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)
* Net downhill course
Last race: Clevedon Country Half Marathon, 5 Feb, 1:17:50, 1st overall
Up next: Waterfront Half Marathon, 2 Apr
"CONSISTENCY IS KING"
Flavio - well done on the PB! I know totally what you mean about doing that mental arithmetic when you know a PB might be on. Sounds like a hilly course too... those splits might have made for a bit of a mental challenge but it sounds like you actually managed the effort (not pace) very evenly which was probably the key to you hitting that good result.
Dave - there are few things more satisfying than managing to progressively up the pace on repeats like that! Very nice.
Darkwave - can't imagine weaving in the dark on a crowded track would be a lot of fun even without balance perception coming into the equation. And yes... Okahu Bay smelt bad due to wastewater overflowing and pooling in the middle of a reserve. It smelt less bad this morning, 1 full week later (but still bad). There are some VERY nice houses overlooking the beach but I cannot imagine they are particularly enjoyable to be living in right now.
mmerkle - weirdly I used to hit a lot of really good workouts after having a few drinks the night before. Obviously not so many that I'd end up with a hangover though.
Fishy - weird on that one morning run where you felt off, but at least it disappeared quickly.
Keen - your treadmill clearly cannot keep up with your crazy mileage. It's not just us humans that get tired thinking about that.
Dorothea - may the weather gods smile upon you for that PR attempt. 190 seems high for HR... IDK maybe more of a faulty reading issue? If it's just a one-off I wouldn't read too much into it.
Krash - I'd really love me some winter right now if you've got some going. Impressive climbing on that trail run.
And thanks very much all for the support. I've got some work to do on the fitness after a pretty up and down end to last year, but it feels like things are tracking in the right direction and with 2-3 months before the big goal races, it feels like I've got enough time to build to where I'd like to be.
Hot Weather Complainer
Mark - Really enjoyed the race report. Sounds like you've executed that almost perfectly in those conditions on that course.
Flavio - Great work on the PR! I wonder how much energy is used with all the stressing in the race. It's also amazing how much harder basic maths gets the more tired you get, along with forgetting that your watch isn't the official course measurer. I did the same in my 5km, thinking I was cruising at times then remembering the extra 80 metres. The great news is you clearly have capacity to improve further on a flat course with light winds.
I agree on adjusting the goal, but if it is that hot I actually think I'm better off not racing with a bigger goal on the horizon. I think I'm more likely to get cooler and windier conditions though.
Krash - Crazy climbing week (for mortals)! I'm feeling a bit done with summer, although I'm lucky that I haven't had any hard workouts fall on the hottest days.
Keen - I think the treadmill dying is a perfect metaphor for your mileage.
Fishy - Why only one minute recoveries? I used to stick to that too but my new coach is a big believer in getting the heart rate right back down between efforts - he even encourages me to stop the watch and rest for 2 minutes before starting a cool down. I'm slowly getting my mind round it although the fact that he does it as a 2:20 marathoner should be enough. I've really noticed my HR not dropping during the cool down after a speed workout lately.
Dave - Good to see you right back into it. I'll be interested to see how the 5km goes.
darkwave - Really positive signs from you it sounds like. I won't be surprised to see you back up to your true level before too long.
mmerkle - Really solid week there.
dorothea - Did it feel like your heart rate was in the 190s? By which I mean, were you close to seeing a pink unicorn?
Mikkey - Just shows how wrapped up in themselves the Scots are if someone didn't recognise you.
So I've been thinking about the rest of my year - I'd like to do one more Park Run, attempt a sub 40 10km and a sub 1:28 half to qualify for New York, preferably in that order. Finding the races is a hindrance to that. The Selwyn marathon on June 4 says the half and full are certified - I really doubt that 7 weeks after the marathon is giving myself the best chance remembering I did Queenstown 7 weeks after Melbourne and really felt the fatigue even at a moderate pace. There is a 10km there too which may be more sensible, or equally stupid. 7 weeks is too short right?
5km: 18:53 12/22 │ 10km: 40:49 2/22 │ HM: 1:27:32* 5/22 │ M: 3:35:02 10/22
*Net Downhill. Flat course PR: 1:29:25 6/16
Christchurch Marathon April 16, 2023
RIP Milkman
Flavio - it's so great that you are PR'ing in so many distances lately! I can't remember what year it was (2020? 21?) where you struggled a lot and there was fear maybe your PR days were behind, but now you're running really well. Where was Jesus though? If you didn't see him, I think there's even more there to grab at the 10K!
Mark and Mikkey - nice races by both of you. Sorry for being 67 years late to congratulate the latter.
DK - 6 hours of sleep! I would be a mess. If I do that 2 nights in a row, I actually do become a robot. I get at least 8 every night (except for weekends), sometimes shoot for 9. I would also highly recommend the super shoes. Once you run in them once, you can't imagine running a race in normal shoes again. Of course, this is if the budget allows, but the market has been flooded with them so you can usually get them on sale these days.
mmerkle - I think 4 drinks is probably the right amount to lead to good consequences. It's like with beer pong. Once you get too many, your performance falls off a cliff.
Watch Looking - in a race, looking at a watch helps me the most during early miles, where it prevents me from going too fast, e.g. mile 2 and 3 in a half marathon. The other place it really helps me is when the going gets tough and I feel like I have nothing left, yet another good mile clicks off. That tells me to calm down and that I really can finish this race at this pace. However, I do agree with everyone else that seeing a bad number pop up in a critical part of the race, e.g. mile 9 or 10 of a half, can be disheartening. Very fine line to balance.
Krash - our winter has been so insanely good here it's been great. Yeah I'm done with it, but I'd take this winter over the bad summer heat right now. I've had less than 5 runs below freezing this winter. Usually, I have 2-3 per week!
I haven't really posted my training, but I guess I'll dump them off for now if anyone is curious. It's mainly been all about work at mile pace to gain running economy. Another 2 weeks of this and then we get into the fun stuff. Added in a 10x600 workout in here just to get the legs a feeling of VO2 work. I have rarely done VO2 work with that little rest (2 minutes working, 1 minute rest). I'll probably regret saying this later, but I think I'd rather take the longer reps with more rest. I felt like 1 minute rest meant I was never really resting!
5K: 16:37 (11/20) | 10K: 34:49 (10/19) | HM: 1:14:57 (5/22) | FM: 2:36:31 (12/19)
Next Race: NYC Half (3/19)
Problem Child
Anyone interested in my BAA Adidas discount code? Maybe someone looking for a pair of Takumi Sen 9s?
Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.
VDOT 52.45
5k19:35 | Marathon 2:56:07
I would also highly recommend the super shoes. Once you run in them once, you can't imagine running a race in normal shoes again. Of course, this is if the budget allows, but the market has been flooded with them so you can usually get them on sale these days.
I've seen VF's on sale on the Nike website every few months in the last little while. This NEVER used to happen. It seems to be mostly clearing out the old colourways to make way for new ones but if I'm saving $100 I really don't care too much what colour they are.