Competitive Jerks Racing and Training - 2023 (Read 572 times)

Mikkey


Mmmm Bop

     

    Yeah I have the same Q time requirements for the two, you are correct NYCM times are always tougher. Although you can qualify with a half which is much easier—you only need at 1:36. But time qualifiers only take up a portion of the entries, most are via lottery (or via running NYRR events).. Are international runners not allowed to enter the lottery?

    One thing is for sure, of the big three US races, Chicago wins hands-down for logistics. So many hotels within walking distance from the start/finish. And the race starts at a normal civilized time, so even if it’s a warm day you can beat the worst of it.

     

    I know they have expensive charity packages but not sure about the lottery.

     

    Chicago sounds like Paris as my hotel was less than 10min walk from the start. Paris should be a Major as it’s a great course/experience and accommodates over 40k runners each year!  My top 3 marathons are…London, NYC and Paris. 👍

    5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

    Running Problem


    Problem Child

      WC man...I can see how there was a logical progression to ultras when a marathon is just a typical training run.

       

       

      DavePNW

      I'll have to keep an eye out at NYC. SHEESH! Thankfully, I'm not up to date on who celebrities are so if one of them wanted to drop a 2:55 with me it would be just like Cameron Haynes and Lance Armstrong running Boston for a Sub-3. Cam wasnt the celebrity he is today, and his race report makes it clear EVERYONE knew who Lance was and wanted a chance to run with him even if it was only a mile.

      https://www.menshealth.com/fitness/g27511321/celebrity-marathon-results/?slide=1

      Stiff competition too.

      https://www.runnersworld.com/runners-stories/a20825027/im-a-runner-kirk-acevedo/

       

      oh and you HAVE to try and get into NYC for 2024. It's going to be so awesome complaining about weather while training for a November marathon with unpredictible weather. Why is it we don't all meet at CIM in December???

       

      fishy if you're paying attention to current events get ready for some more feel good legislation (bump stocks were not used in the October 1 Las Vegas shooting yet the State banned them for safety). I really hate the "we can't go back so get use to it" mentality of new rules. Clear plastic bags are great, and yet CIM said due to COVID 19 they could no longer have the delivery trucks sitting at the starting line where you hand your bag to a volunteer collecting them who drives it to the finish, so due to covid 19 you had to hand them to a volunteer at the finish line and you could have a different volunteer at the finish hand it to you.....yeah this is bullshit cost savings making the race less appealing, and pissing me off about littering on course. "just throw your shit out as you run and maybe someone will pick it up eventually." Just...like...Burning Man.

       

       

      flavio be confident and cautious on muddy parts. I've experienced slipping on ice and mud (pretty much the same) and if you're confident with a foot placement some times you can still run quickly without slipping while others are more cautious and slip. Best of luck and don't get injured mid race. This is why scouting the course is in your benefit.

       

       

      I had a buddy who had a time qualifier for NYC and said he didn't get in. Maybe he missed his window to apply? I THOUGHT it was a "first come first served" (First In First Out) type of application system until the set number of qualified entries are taken, and then you're general lottery meat. Maybe I'm wrong.

       

       

      plastic bag. food to eat after breakfast but before the race, throw away clothes and shoes. museums, book stores, breakfast, and give the man who gave Heartbreak Hill it's legendary status a tip of the hat or a nod of the head, and don't go out too fast. Sounds like a solid plan for Boston.

       

       

      strava art....I like the ones comparable to my artistic level. Some are just...mind blowing?

      https://www.strav.art/animation

      There is one in there for Mikkey 

      Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

      VDOT 53.37 

      5k18:xx | Marathon 2:55:22

      Running Problem


      Problem Child

        Why would an international time qualifier be treated any different than a freedom eagle qualifier? Their website says nothing about "time qualifiers are only for those who are currently a dumbass U.S. Citizen."

        Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

        VDOT 53.37 

        5k18:xx | Marathon 2:55:22

        mmerkle


          Half Crazy K Hope you manage to make the best of whatever weather happens.

           

          dktrotter "Write a CONCISE 10 page paper" lol. That was always my issue with lit courses. Yeah all my niggles are gone. Thanks for the encouraging words.

           

          Krash My thoughts exactly, the rain, hopefully light enough to not soak my shoes, should help cool me down since it will be 60 degrees, or 15 degrees for those of you who identify as water.

           

          RP Can we analyze this point more? I'm intrigued. So to some degree I should vary my effort rather than keep it steady? Since it's 3 days or so out, the weather is probably going to be what it's saying now. So that is,

           

          Now 19 mph ! mostly from the south and a little west. So that means I'll be eating shit on miles 3-6 which will be a dead on head wind, and most of 11-17, where 11-12 is dead on head wind and the rest at an angle but still bad. It will be at my back the last 5k, which is cool I guess but not nearly enough to negate headwind miles. Should I back off during the head winds and press a little for 6-11, and 18 onward? Or steady effort throughout and try my best to "blast" the last 8k-10k?

            re: celebrity marathoners - here's a good list, not necessarily celebrities but people from various fields who have run marathons. You can sort by any column to see who the fast ones were. Alan Turing ran a 2:46!

             

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_non-professional_marathon_runners

             

            I ran the Grand Rapids Marathon, and the pace groups were based on celebrity finish times.

             

            https://www.grandrapidsmarathon.com/information/pace-teams/

            Dave

            Mikkey


            Mmmm Bop

               

               

              Now 19 mph ! mostly from the south and a little west. So that means I'll be eating shit on miles 3-6 which will be a dead on head wind, and most of 11-17, where 11-12 is dead on head wind and the rest at an angle but still bad. It will be at my back the last 5k, which is cool I guess but not nearly enough to negate headwind miles. Should I back off during the head winds and press a little for 6-11, and 18 onward? Or steady effort throughout and try my best to "blast" the last 8k-10k?

               

              Firstly you just have to accept that you aren’t doing to hit your original goal time due to circumstances beyond your control and should adjust accordingly.

               

              Not running a sub3 doesn’t mean it’s a failure if you give it your best shot and race smart.

               

              Don't fight the headwinds…slow the pace down and run by feel and conserve energy for the last 5k.

              5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

                 

                 

                 

                I had a buddy who had a time qualifier for NYC and said he didn't get in. Maybe he missed his window to apply? I THOUGHT it was a "first come first served" (First In First Out) type of application system until the set number of qualified entries are taken, and then you're general lottery meat. Maybe I'm wrong.

                 

                 

                Yes. No cutoff times like Boston. They have a fixed number of time-qualifier spots so they can fill up, but I think they usually don't.

                Dave

                JMac11


                RIP Milkman

                  MM - I saw that forecast this Saturday in these parts as I had a planned 5K and thought "shocking, another bad forecast for one of my races." I didn't realize it was the same day as your marathon, which is a much bigger deal. I'm sorry to hear. The thing with wind is that you just have to go with the flow. There will be points where it will feel like you're literally not moving forward, but don't increase the effort. Even effort is key, and ignore the numbers on the watch during the headwinds section.

                   

                  Steve - I think you're far enough out you should be okay with the illness. One week before would be much more worrisome. The hay is in the barn.

                   

                  NYC - weather is actually one of the best things about it, way better than Chicago or Boston. Unfortunately not the case this past year, but usually you are 75% of getting a nice day in the 40s or 50s. The only unpredictable thing usually is if you will get a north headwind, which would hit you for the first 20 miles. Also on time qualifiers - they do fill up. The past two years, they've been gone within 1 hour of opening.

                   

                   

                  Unfortunately I am having another cycle ruined by injury. I've been going to PT since January for an insertional Achilles issue. It hasn't really gotten better, but was stable enough I could run through it. Now I developed a posterior tib issue in that same foot, and this I cannot run through. I'm shutting things down for at least a week, but it could be more. If it ends up being 2+ weeks, I just don't know if I have the motivation and really the heart to try to build back up for CIM just to have another injury occur. It's not like I just let this injury persist and not address it: I tried to take all the right steps and even proactively went to PT even though my running could continue. It didn't seem to matter.

                   

                  Being injury prone sucks. It's nothing like what some others go through (DW and JT come to mind), but it's just ruining my heart in this sport. This cycle was stopped before I could really race, my NYC buildup was damaged due to a strained hamstring, and I lost my 2021 CIM attempt to that stress reaction.

                   

                  I'm not making any final decisions at the moment, it's still way too early to do that. My mind still wants to work as hard as I physically can for that Moose Mug. I just don't know if my body is going to be able to come along for the ride.

                   

                  I am still going to attend PT for the next couple of weeks, so I haven't fully quit just yet!

                  5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:14:57 (5/22)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

                   

                   

                  Mikkey


                  Mmmm Bop

                    re: celebrity marathoners - here's a good list, not necessarily celebrities but people from various fields who have run marathons. You can sort by any column to see who the fast ones were. Alan Turing ran a 2:46!

                     

                    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_non-professional_marathon_runners

                     

                    I ran the Grand Rapids Marathon, and the pace groups were based on celebrity finish times.

                     

                    https://www.grandrapidsmarathon.com/information/pace-teams/

                     

                    I see Jill Biden ran a 4:30 in 1998 at Marine Corps!  I bet she cheated. 

                    5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

                    Running Problem


                    Problem Child

                      MMerkle Back off on the headwinds especially for 3-6. Don't kill yourself. Go off of feel and the feel is going to be "this sucks. it feels like someone is pushing against me".

                      I've done 20 mph headwinds. it fucking sucks especially the first time. The constant push against you will make everything a lot harder. I'd roughly estimate a 20-30 second slow down. I think for one of my hardest workouts I AVERAGRED a 6:53 with a 6:30 or 6:40/mi target. It's early in the race and 20-30 seconds NOW might give you some umph later on and you might have some power for the final miles should you possibly get a push from behind.

                       

                      3-6 looks downhill. With a headwind it's just all going to feel so much harder to hold PR pace. The entire body has to work at it.

                      The cross wind might make you feel like you're getting pushed sideways but it isn't bad.

                      You'll probably have an occasional gust behind you making you feel like you're being lifted off the ground or pushed ahead which is kind of weird to feel during race pace.

                      For those later miles and the second time you hit the headwind you'll have done it once and might could remember how the effort feels compared to what you've been running.

                       

                      thread dictator I just saw the comments about my 5k. SANDBAGGED?!?!?!!?! Bless YOUR heart.

                      Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                      VDOT 53.37 

                      5k18:xx | Marathon 2:55:22

                      Mikkey


                      Mmmm Bop

                        Milkman - Sorry to hear that, I remember the surgeon I saw regarding my heel in 2021 said it was insertional achilles tendinopathy and would gradually get worse and eventually need an operation. But you are still young so I guess competitive marathon training is not that good for the body!  CIM is a long way off so don’t give up just yet.

                        5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

                        dktrotter


                        Dorothea

                          Damn mmerkle, right now the weather looks like a lot of bad luck. Looks like there's some kind of front coming through. Hope it gets through a little bit earlier!! There's still a bit of time for it to change. And if it doesn't and the race is actually held with those predicted gusts (50mph?!), I like this advice

                          MMerkle Back off on the headwinds especially for 3-6. Don't kill yourself. Go off of feel and the feel is going to be "this sucks. it feels like someone is pushing against me".

                          ...

                          For those later miles and the second time you hit the headwind you'll have done it once and might could remember how the effort feels compared to what you've been running.

                           

                           

                          My last real windy race (again, Blackpool), I remember what messed me up was not having a plan for into the wind v. with the wind. Have a pace plan that accounts for the decrease in pace! (just remember a headwind is twice as detrimental as a tailwind beneficial...) And all those moments into the wind (which, with a SW wind, looks like miles 3-6, 9.5-10, 11-12, 13-14) seem concentrated in the first half, which can be a good thing. You just need to adjust. It also means you'll get relief for that second half. But also don't forget, you can be a jerk and find someone to run behind to block the wind for you! It's what I would do... or actually I would find someone who is willing to trade off with me. If you're lining up via pace, you can maybe find someone aiming for the same time as you and maybe be able to talk through a strategy like... hey, if we're running near each other, if I do miles 3-4.5, would you do 4.5 to 6? Or if I do miles 11-12, would you do miles 13-14? or something like that.

                           

                          Having gone through weather-messed-up-my-PR-attempt multiple times, I can imagine how you're feeling right now. But don't let that get you off your mental game for the "A" goal. And I would say also find a "B" or "C" goal that's not a time goal, just in case.

                          Qualifications: I like to run. In Florida. In the summer. At noon.  

                          Last race: Community 5K, March 2nd. Speed test run with 2 walk breaks. Went pretty well.  

                          CommanderKeen


                          Cobra Commander Keen

                            RP - Yes, sandbagged. I stand by it. It wasn't intentional, but there are no all-out 5ks that result in such large PRs without also feeling like your legs and/or lungs are on fire

                             

                            ETA: DW is a librarian and today the library got a donation they (for whatever reason) can't/won't use. A nearly pristine copy of the 4th edition of Lore of Running. I now have something else on my list of books to read.

                            5k: 17:58 11/22 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:23:22 4/22 │ M: 2:56:05 12/22

                             

                            Upcoming Races:

                             

                             

                            Half Crazy K 2.0


                              For mmerkle, I think the tough thing with any papce adjustment is that it's not just the wind you need to account for. Best case, it's 60, riany and windy. Worst case, it is 70+, sunny, humid & windy. Either way, its going to be warmer than ideal and warmer than it's been recently.

                               

                              ETA, there is always the option to decide to do the HM and then hope for better conditions another week. You can make that decision up until almost mile 11.

                              JMac11


                              RIP Milkman

                                Milkman - Sorry to hear that, I remember the surgeon I saw regarding my heel in 2021 said it was insertional achilles tendinopathy and would gradually get worse and eventually need an operation. But you are still young so I guess competitive marathon training is not that good for the body!  CIM is a long way off so don’t give up just yet.

                                 

                                Thanks. You said shockwave was the only thing that cured it, right? Not that I'm going down that route now but this plantar/Achilles issue is the only chronic injury I've had. It first popped up in late 2020 and never has truly gone away. It's like a dormant volcano, always waiting to erupt. All of my other injuries are usually healed within a few months at worst.

                                5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:14:57 (5/22)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19)