Sub 1:30 Half Marathon in 2020 (Read 579 times)

watsonc123


    Extremely out of a line is an exaggeration.  Some people never align with what they "should" run a marathon given their other times.

     

    And then we have people who go the other way like whoever it was that has a sub 3, but not a sub 20 5k!

     

    Steve - sorry your race did not go well.

    PRs: 5km 18:43 (Dec 2015), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:26:16 (Sep 2016), full 3:09:28 (Jun 2015)

     

    40+ PRs: 5km 19:31 (Oct 2020), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:29:39 (Jun 2018)

    Marky_Mark_17


       

      FTFFY - keep in mind that some of us are following both the marathon and the HM thread . I like the corrected version better, because in my mind your HM PB and your marathon PB are so extremely out of line that you should not yet say "never again!"

       

      Just for the record (and certainly not to start another discussion - I think I read everything you wrote on this topic): I think you've got inherent speed (as evidenced by your 3.000m time while being sick and in recovery mode from your marathon), you've got stamina (as evidenced by your HM PB), but you are maybe lacking those last few capillaries and mitochondria you'd need for an adequate marathon time and that you'd get from more slower longer runs. Even that 3.000m time (remember: while being sick and in recovery mode) indicates a faster marathon. Yes, the COVID-19-rollercoaster the weeks and months before certainly didn't help, but I can't believe that your ability to race long distances falls off the cliff between the HM and the M.

       

      Me - on my way to the highest weekly mileage since ... (and still feling good, knock on wood)

       

      I appreciate the sentiment, but literally the only thing that will get me to run another marathon ever will be if my shorter distance times start to slow as I get older, but there's still a realistic possibility of running a moose mug say in my mid-late 40's.  I didn't enjoy the training once the mileage really ramped, I didn't enjoy the last third of the race, I've hated the 6 weeks since.  Last time I ran a marathon I hated the race and got injured a few weeks down the track.  I know I could probably run a faster marathon, I just don't think it's worth the inevitable cost and that much misery.

       

      FWIW I ran a lot of slower long runs this year too, I had probably 10+ runs over 30km and a ton more between 25-30km.  A lot like last time, my last long training run (35km with 20km or so at MP) probably went better than race day - so there was definitely something about the training dragging on a bit long (that ended up being 5 weeks before my race rather than the intended 3).

       

      And I agree with Watson - the times are a bit out of line, but I wouldn't say extremely so.  We've all got distances we're naturally better at or gravitate towards.

      5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20) | 10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) 

      HM: 1:10:46 (Nov-19) | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

      Last race: Wairarapa Country Marathon, 11 Oct, 2:41:41 (PB)

      Up next: Mt. Maunganui Half Marathon, 28 Nov (I HOPE!)

      "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

      JMac11


      Taper Czar

        I would argue they're extremely out of line as well, but one is on a very downhill course. If you're able to put up a sub 1:11 on a flat course (which it sounds like you think you might be able to), then they're definitely extremely out of line. You should be running 2:2X with that half time, which would put it in line. A bad day would be 2:35, which would put it out of line. 2:40 is extremely out of line. Again, it's not surprising given your strengths, but Josh's statement is correct.

         

        And that sub 3 but not sub 20 is RP. That is just mind boggling.

         

        Looking forward to hearing from Steve.

        5K: 16:42 (9/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:28 (3/20)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

         

        Next Race: Whatever COVID-19 will allow me to run 

          " I appreciate the sentiment, but literally the only thing that will get me to run another marathon ever will be if my shorter distance times start to slow as I get older "

           

          Then you will be running another marathon Mark 

          50+ PBs -  

          5k 18.25 Tauranga Parkrun  Sept 20      81.36 % age grade

          10k 38.55 oct 19 strava run

          Next races

          Mount Maunganui half 10k 28th nov 2020

          " If you don't use it you lose it but if you use it, it wears out.

          Somewhere in between is about right "      

           

          SteveChCh


          Hot Weather Complainer

            I’m back in Christchurch waiting for my partner at Lone Star for my traditional birthday dinner.


            Early thoughts: I’m not gutted. This is not a fast course and it was warm and windy to add to that. 

            I’m way more fit than that time. My socks were covered in blood at the end. No training on trails. I like the road I think

            PB:  Christchurch 2016 1:29.25

            Recent Races:    Queenstown Half-Marathon November 21, 2020 1:35.11 Cherry Blossom Half-Marathon, September 13, 2020 1:33:38 Half-Marathon Time Trial May 31, 2020 1:31.51  Auckland Waterfront Half-Marathon 2019 1:30.49 

            Plan for 2021:  Christchurch Motorway Half-Marathon February 28 (tempo/training run), Christchurch Marathon April 11, South Island Half-Marathon August 1, Queenstown Half-Marathon November 20

            watsonc123


              I know a woman who did 1:43 at Queenstown.  She normally does 1:31 to 1:35, she was a little under trained, but only a little.  So, I agree that it is a slow course.

              PRs: 5km 18:43 (Dec 2015), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:26:16 (Sep 2016), full 3:09:28 (Jun 2015)

               

              40+ PRs: 5km 19:31 (Oct 2020), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:29:39 (Jun 2018)

                Nice job Steve you are out there doing it on a tough day.

                Enjoy Lonestar make sure you eat it all not like my daughters when I came to Lonestar Christchurch 

                50+ PBs -  

                5k 18.25 Tauranga Parkrun  Sept 20      81.36 % age grade

                10k 38.55 oct 19 strava run

                Next races

                Mount Maunganui half 10k 28th nov 2020

                " If you don't use it you lose it but if you use it, it wears out.

                Somewhere in between is about right "      

                 

                Marky_Mark_17


                  Piwi - there was a crucial 'but' which you missed out from my post!

                   

                  JMac- I don't agree.  In good form, I could run sub-1:12 on a flat course.  That's like 3:24/km.  A sub-2:30 marathon is 3:33/km.  That gap is way too narrow to be credible.  There are a bunch of guys around here I know that just sneak under the 16 minute mark for 5km, they are all circa 2:40's marathon runners.

                   

                  Aside from the fact that runners can be suited to different distances - in some cases like RP it's pretty drastic.  Personally I think your marathon PB stands out as being particularly strong relative to your other PB's.  That's a compliment because tbh the marathon is the tougher race.  "Extremely out of line" is very subjective.

                   

                  Steve - was it your actual birthday today?  If so, happy birthday!  If not, happy birthday for whenever it happens to be.  I haven't been to Lone Star in way too long.  Anyway I agree you are a better runner, and in better shape, than that time suggests.  It's definitely a slow course and that headwind would've sucked too.  Don't rush into the next thing, take a week or two easy and see how you feel.

                  5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20) | 10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) 

                  HM: 1:10:46 (Nov-19) | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

                  Last race: Wairarapa Country Marathon, 11 Oct, 2:41:41 (PB)

                  Up next: Mt. Maunganui Half Marathon, 28 Nov (I HOPE!)

                  "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

                  SteveChCh


                  Hot Weather Complainer

                    Thanks Mark, it’s actually tomorrow. Next on the list is Christchurch marathon and I suspect the next half after that will be a good one. My only regret for the year is 3 attempts which I feel like all didn’t reflect my fitness level. I’ve never been this fit with this consistency! In training that is.

                    PB:  Christchurch 2016 1:29.25

                    Recent Races:    Queenstown Half-Marathon November 21, 2020 1:35.11 Cherry Blossom Half-Marathon, September 13, 2020 1:33:38 Half-Marathon Time Trial May 31, 2020 1:31.51  Auckland Waterfront Half-Marathon 2019 1:30.49 

                    Plan for 2021:  Christchurch Motorway Half-Marathon February 28 (tempo/training run), Christchurch Marathon April 11, South Island Half-Marathon August 1, Queenstown Half-Marathon November 20

                    zebano


                      Oh and in other good news I felt miles better this morning now those antibiotics are getting out of my system.  Managed a half-respectable track workout and felt good at the end.  Given the varying levels of soreness, sickness and general misery over the past 6 weeks, I can confidently say I'm not running another marathon.  Ever.

                       

                       

                       

                      I've heard that before. Give it a year =)

                       

                      Steve - the nice thing about consistency is that you can continue to build on it.

                      1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 45:24 (2017), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Mary - 3:37:17 (2018)

                      JamesD


                      JamesD

                        ...My only regret for the year is 3 attempts which I feel like all didn’t reflect my fitness level... 

                         

                        Steve - There's a flip side to that - if you're like me and only have one or sometimes zero attempts per year, you can have years-long streaks of not showing your fitness.  My last good half was the first in five years that I had been really pleased with and the first in three that had been even ok.  If not for PRs in shorter races, it would have been a long slog.  Glad you're not gutted; sounds like tough conditions.  Happy birthday tomorrow (today by now?).

                         

                        Mark - I took doxycycline for most of the time for three years while we lived in Mozambique.  Made me vomit sometimes, but that was better than getting malaria.  DW & son took mefloquine, and one time son (age 2) swallowed his normal 1/4 pill and then grabbed and swallowed DW's full adult-sized pill.  Since the main side effect of mefloquine is erotic dreams, it was difficult to figure out if he was affected.  For my recent infection, I took sulfamethoxazole for two weeks.  Am wondering whether that's why I could only swim a third as far as I had three weeks earlier (back up to 2/3 now), though maybe it was the infection itself and not the antibiotics.

                        Post-1987 PRs:  Half 1:30:14 (2019); 10K 39:35 (2019); 5K 19:12 (2017); Mile 5:37.3 (April '20)

                        Re-revised 2020 Goals:  35+ mpw (maybe), 5K<19:30 (no); Mile<5:40 (yes), no injuries (no)

                        JamesD


                        JamesD

                          Gradually increasing my swimming & pool running, though I still only got in around 5 hours of total exercise this week, compared to around 8 (nearly all running) during my base weeks a few months ago. Our aquatics center says it controls the water temperature, but the water has gotten a little colder as temperatures have fallen this week, or at least cold for me.  Almost nobody is there when I am, so I don’t mind looking funny wearing a beanie and arm warmers while I pool run.

                           

                          Sun - 1 mile jogging in four 1/4-mile jogs w/walk breaks, glute somewhat sore

                          Mon - 38 minutes swimming, 15 pool running

                          Tues - 60 minutes pool running, glute not too bad

                          Weds - 1 mile jogging in four 1/4-mile jogs w/walk breaks, glute slightly less sore, PT session

                          Thurs - 37 minutes swimming, 20 pool running

                          Fri - 60 minutes pool running, glute not bad, left knee stiff

                          Sat - 45 minutes swimming, 20 pool running

                           

                          Total - 2 miles jogging, 120 minutes swimming, 175 minutes pool running



                          Post-1987 PRs:  Half 1:30:14 (2019); 10K 39:35 (2019); 5K 19:12 (2017); Mile 5:37.3 (April '20)

                          Re-revised 2020 Goals:  35+ mpw (maybe), 5K<19:30 (no); Mile<5:40 (yes), no injuries (no)

                            James I've been having erotic dreams for years 

                             

                            Steve happy birthday 

                             

                            My week

                            Weekly for period: From: 16/11/2020 To 22/11/2020

                            Date Name Distance
                            in km
                            Duration Avg Pace
                            per km
                            Elevation Gain
                            in m
                            18/11/2020 Farewell manflu 10.12 00:46:41 04:37 14
                            18/11/2020 Afternoon Run 10.01 00:49:25 04:56 6
                            19/11/2020 Morning Run 10.01 01:03:19 06:20 295
                            20/11/2020 Morning Run with 6k@10k pace 10.18 00:43:58 04:19 2
                            20/11/2020 Cool down 0.80 00:05:00 06:15 0
                            22/11/2020 With Phillip B 20.12 01:42:13 05:05 11

                            Total distance: 61.25km

                            50+ PBs -  

                            5k 18.25 Tauranga Parkrun  Sept 20      81.36 % age grade

                            10k 38.55 oct 19 strava run

                            Next races

                            Mount Maunganui half 10k 28th nov 2020

                            " If you don't use it you lose it but if you use it, it wears out.

                            Somewhere in between is about right "      

                             

                            SteveChCh


                            Hot Weather Complainer

                              Thanks all for the kind words and birthday wishes.

                               

                              Queenstown Half Marathon Race Report

                               

                              This race was targeted as a confidence builder without too many expectations.  I wanted a good race experience and ideally a negative split with the second half of the course being flat after several ups and downs in the first half.  My training in 2020 has been great with solid consistency since September 2019 - my longest spell of consistency.  I've increased the volume to higher levels than ever before with the help of extra miles at recovery or very easy pace.

                               

                              I flew down to Queenstown the afternoon before the race and has a very quiet night at my partner's parents place.  Early to be but a very fractured sleep in an unfamiliar bed.  I just couldn't stay asleep more than dozing for 2-3 hours.  I had good sleeps leading up though so I wasn't too worried about it.

                               

                              Traditional breakfast of muesli and banana then out the door at 6:50am to drive out to the start.  The race is point to point so I was very keen for light winds - the forecast was for lightish northerlies which would be a cross wind and tail wind, with a forecast gale south west wind later in the day which would be worst case scenario with headwind most of the way particularly in the last 8-10km.

                               

                              I wandered to the start area which is about 300 metres long in quite a narrow country lane.  I did a few warm ups and chatted with a guy doing his first race and stayed nice and relaxed.  My plan was to run by feel and that feeling should be very comfortable.  The MC announces a slight change to the course at Frankton because of a slip on the course.  It crossed my mind this could lead to a hill coming inland then back out to the river trail.  The hooter goes and we're off.

                               

                              I felt like I was going quite easy and checked my watch less frequently than usual and saw it hovering between 4:15 and 4:20.  The first 3km are on a nice sealed road and my splits were 4:15, 4:15, 4:15.  Nice.

                               

                              At this point the course joins the Queenstown trail around the Shotover then Kawerau rivers towards Queenstown.  I had psyched myself up for a sharp drop and initially it was a nice grade and I thought I'd built it up in my head the last time I ran this but then it veered sharply down and for about 200 metres it was tough going keeping the feet on the gravel.  Quite a few people went past me here so I guess it's safe to say I'm not a good technical trail runner which isn't surprising since none of my training is on trails - a potential mistake for this race.  Kilometres 4-6 had some good climbs and I went past all the people who had passed me on the up hills.  I also bumped into a Strava friend, Rosie, around this point.  She's about a 1:30 half runner and we exchanged passes for a few km - she'd pass me downhill and I'd pass her up hill.  At about 6km there's a significant climb up a road to get to a bridge over the river and I passed her here and didn't see her again.

                               

                              4-6 went through in 4:14, 4:30, 4:20 which I was happy with as I thought this was the worst of the climbing and my legs did feel it a bit but recovered over the following kms.  I was starting to doubt my GPS though because I'd reach the km markers well before my watch beeped, and this only started happening after the 4:30 km.

                               

                              From 6-10km the wind started to pick up and was a slight headwind.  The sun was also high in the sky and it started to feel warm.  At every aid station I grabbed a water and poured it over my head.  I wasn't puffing much at all unlike a lot of people around me and I thought I'd weathered the toughest part of the course while still having the energy to pick it up in the second half.  7-11km had some more little hills that I'd forgotten about and I went through in 4:17, 4:22, 4:18, 4:23, 4:26.  Last time I did this race I really started to pick it up with 10km to go and I felt like I'd positioned myself well for this, going through 11km in 47:27 (official time).  I thought with 4:15 average required I might break 1:30 here.  Around this point I noticed the diversion was starting and first of all we went down into a heavily bushed area with a very windy path.  It was hard to keep too much pace here.  Suddenly we came round a corner and saw a short but very steep climb in front of us.  "Oh for fucks sake" me and a guy close to me said in unison.  I probably dropped to 7 minute pace up this hill and was breathing heavy.  At the top my legs felt wobbly - from here we join the road and then head back down to the trail around the Frankton Arm of the Wakatipu lake so there was some downhill to regroup.  I knew it had impacted me but figured in 1-2km I'd recover and my legs and breathing would get back to normal.

                               

                              This km was 4:40 which wasn't bad considering the damage the hill did, followed by a 4:29 for km number 13.  Unfortunately at this point I knew I was starting to hurt and struggling to regroup from the hill.  This is the best part of the course on a slightly firmer path and basically perfectly flat.  Unfortunately the south west wind had arrived early so there was a headwind all the way home - the wind got way worse later in the day so it could have been worse.  I went through 14,15 and 16 in 4:41, 4:37 and 4:38.  With 6km left I first thought about quitting.  I looked at the grass just off the trail and imagined how great it would feel to stop but I told myself I'd feel so bad if I pulled out.  Also at the start they'd said if we pull out we should make our way to the next aid station so they don't spend all day looking for us and I figured I'd be better off just to keep going.  I thought I should just drop to 5 minute kms if I had to and worked out I'd get 1:37 if I did that.  I decided not to care how I got there, just keep going.  There was a lot of 10km walkers now and while the narrow parts of the trail required concentration, the support they gave was a great boost.  I had my name on my bib and all throughout the course there was amazing support.

                               

                              17-19 were all straight into the wind which wasn't too bad as there was shelter, but wasn't great when you were in the shape I was.  I started getting stomach cramps here and could feel a blister or something under my toes which is not usual for me.  These kms went through in 4:50, 4:36, 4:43.  It seemed a really slow km helped me feel slightly better but the bad feeling would keep coming back.  The last 2km are around the peninsula then through town up one last hill then down into the domain.  Very narrow and windy again and when I came round the corner got absolutely blasted by the wind and slowed right down.  I knew the wind would be behind me on the other side so shuffled along in 4:51.  There was a sign 1km to go which a couple of guys in front of me whacked in defiance.  Through town there was great support while I braced myself for the hill.  I wanted to go under 1:35 by now but the hill punished my tired legs.  I went down the ramp and 100 metres on the grass to the finish with my official time 1:35.11.  Obviously not what I wanted but the race had some surprises which made any target setting difficult.  I spent 5-10 minutes on the grass before I could get up.  Very nice to get home and get a beer, but when I took my shoes off my socks were soaked in blood which made the shower very painful.  I guess training on trails for a race on trails might be a good idea.  Also looked in the mirror and saw blood all down my face from my nose which happens from time to time.

                               

                              So I didn't get my negative split or nice strong race day experience but I again gutsed out a race.  I have a thought of doing the Canterbury Half-Marathon in 3 weeks - it's in mid summer at 10am and I won't do any training for it in the next 3 weeks.  I'll have 2 weeks of nothing but recovery and maybe one pace tune up mid week before the race and probably aim to run 1:35 pace for the first half and see how I feel.  I'm not 100% on this though and will see what my coach and this forum thinks first.  I may wait to see the forecast and make a late call - if it's crazy hot I'll give it a miss but there are still some cool days in summer so I may get lucky.

                              PB:  Christchurch 2016 1:29.25

                              Recent Races:    Queenstown Half-Marathon November 21, 2020 1:35.11 Cherry Blossom Half-Marathon, September 13, 2020 1:33:38 Half-Marathon Time Trial May 31, 2020 1:31.51  Auckland Waterfront Half-Marathon 2019 1:30.49 

                              Plan for 2021:  Christchurch Motorway Half-Marathon February 28 (tempo/training run), Christchurch Marathon April 11, South Island Half-Marathon August 1, Queenstown Half-Marathon November 20

                              Marky_Mark_17


                                Steve - nice RR, I remember last time I ran Queenstown the old Marathon Hill really knocked me around and I never recovered from that.  Headwinds when you are hurting in a race are the absolute worst.  Honestly unless it looks like a really cold day I would skip that Canterbury HM.  A summer race at 10am spells Suffering with a capital S.  Occasionally I've had to run workouts at that time when my wife has been away and they've been pretty rough for the most part.

                                 

                                Me - managed a semi decent track workout yesterday but felt a little bit bleh again this morning and the PF niggle on the right foot has floated around to my achilles.  Just going to play it by feel a bit this week with the Mt. Half coming up on Saturday and will likely take a very easy week or two after that.

                                 

                                Weekly for period: From: 16/11/2020 To 22/11/2020

                                Date Name Distance
                                in km
                                Duration Avg Pace
                                per km
                                Elevation Gain
                                in m
                                17/11/2020 Hobby loop with a few strides 11.02 00:47:39 04:19 66
                                18/11/2020 Humid, windy and bleh 15.17 01:03:24 04:11 45
                                19/11/2020 (I got the) Doxycycline blues 12.23 00:50:01 04:05 42
                                21/11/2020 Good luck to everyone running Queenstown and Kerikeri 14.80 00:56:23 03:49 25
                                22/11/2020 The thin line between humidity and rain 16.01 01:13:25 04:35 178

                                Total distance: 69.23km

                                5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20) | 10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) 

                                HM: 1:10:46 (Nov-19) | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

                                Last race: Wairarapa Country Marathon, 11 Oct, 2:41:41 (PB)

                                Up next: Mt. Maunganui Half Marathon, 28 Nov (I HOPE!)

                                "CONSISTENCY IS KING"