Sub 1:30 Half Marathon in 2019 (Read 638 times)

JMac11


Taper Czar

    Well now that enough people have commented, I'll throw my hat into the ring one more time on this.

     

    I agree with everything Andres just said: chasing PRs only can lead to the wrong approach to this sport (and I've been guilty of that myself.) So yes, go out, run as hard as you want on any course, nobody is suggesting otherwise!

     

    However, even if you're not competing with others, people will ask you "what's your PR?" That's where I think this stuff matters. To me, it's very similar to golf. There are golf courses that are impossible, and golf courses that are a joke. Luckily, in golf, there is a handicap system that takes all of this into account to give you a handicap that accounts for your ability. You get your handicap adjusted down for playing on a hard course, and up for playing an easy course. So when someone asks you "what's your handicap" you know it's a genuine number. However, if someone asks you "what's your lowest score?" you can easily exclude the fact that your 74 you said you shot was actually on a course that was 2000 yards shorter than normal courses with absolutely zero hazards.

     

     

    PRs are not everything. But this sport requires a lot of integrity at the amateur level. You can easily cut a course, run downhill courses, claim a GPS PR, claim a short course PR, etc. It's one thing to say "oh I don't care about PRs, I run for fun!" vs. actually setting goals and then claiming a PR in your signature line, like a lot of us do. That's where the issue is. How you answer the "what's your PR?" question to another runner on the starting line says a lot.

     

     

    The day will certainly come for all of us (or already has) when PRs are not possible. But by claiming a non-legit course as your PR, you're going to make that day come a LOT sooner, because it's going to be hard to beat that PR on another more normal course.

    5K: 16:42 (9/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:28 (3/20)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

     

    Next Race: Whatever COVID-19 will allow me to run 

    darkwave


    Mother of Cats

      You guys are so civil talking about your politicians. In the US, we can’t speak about any candidate across the political spectrum without starting a war.

       

      I think that doesn't hold true for all of the US.

       

      By nature of the fact that I'm in Washington DC, I know a lot of people on all sides of the aisle.  My running training partners have included an appointed official in the Trump administration, one of President Obama's personal aides, and a lot of congressional staffers, lobbyists, and think tankers with a political bent one way or the other.

       

      So....we've all learned to discuss current affairs and politics, and sometimes discuss them strongly, but not get too personal or offended about it (though we all get annoyed at shut downs, regardless of political position).  Regardless of one's politics, everyone sometimes needs a tree to duck behind when a bathroom is nowhere in sight.

       

      So I tend to be a bit free-er in discussing these things than most.  Which has gotten me into trouble when I then casually reference US politics on a website like this one, forgetting that it's taboo here in much the way that emergency pit stops would be taboo on other chat boards.

      Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

       

      And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

      darkwave


      Mother of Cats

        I really like this response. I find that we often get way too caught up on PR's, myself included. Yeah, I understand and agree with darkwave that this is inherently a competition and is a comparative sport. But I think it often leads to a hyper focus on PR's, with nothing else counting. You often see the "if it's not a pr, what's the point?" attitude. The most common way this pops up is with weather conditions. The, "well this cycle has been great, but the weather sucks so bad on race day that I know I won't have a shot at PRing, so I'll just jog it."  But you also see it in other forms, like "I'm so far behind in my training that I know I won't be able to PR, so I'm going to just go back to running 20 miles per week until it's time to race." Or, as in this example, "it's a downhill course that I won't be able to claim as a PR, so no need to go all out, or better yet, I'll just skip it despite it being a fun looking race."

         

        Well...competition can also be about head-to-head, not just PRs.  It is comparative across races, but most comparative within a race.

         

        I agree with you, I've never understood the idea of half-assing a race.  I am completely on board with playing it safe sometimes (a friend of mine just earned his first sub-3 - he was potentially in shape to run much faster, but instead just cruised to his sub-3, finally hitting a goal that he had spent a decade working towards).  But I don't like showing up to a race, and not racing.  You go out there and see what you can do.  And sometimes you fail, and that sucks. But it's also OK, and much better than not trying.

         

        [edit: to clarify, I think there are different choices within racing - taking risks, or playing it safer.  But either strategy is still racing, and different from just jogging it in]

        Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

         

        And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

        JMac11


        Taper Czar

          The only time I half-ass a race is if I am specifically using it as a marathon pace run. I need those in a race setting to practice taking in gels and water, as my stomach needs just as much training as my legs. Also, pacing friends to a goal. I have a lot of fun in those races not feeling like I'd rather be gored by the pink unicorn than continue running.

           

          Regarding politics, I think it's a bit what you're getting at: it's not acceptable on the Internet. The conversations people have in their personal homes are very different than the conversations being had online or in any more public setting. I would definitely never share any of my personal views on this website regarding politics, or anything even touching the political realm (like the Mary Cain story, Caster Semenaya, etc.), as you're asking for trouble.

           

          For the PRs, either way, we all know Mark is a robot that is a half marathon machine. He will continue to destroy these courses one by one, and I imagine his training will reach a new level with the high mileage he puts in next year for the marathon.

          5K: 16:42 (9/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:28 (3/20)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

           

          Next Race: Whatever COVID-19 will allow me to run 


          Elite Jogger

             

             

            However, even if you're not competing with others, people will ask you "what's your PR?" That's where I think this stuff matters. To me, it's very similar to golf. There are golf courses that are impossible, and golf courses that are a joke. Luckily, in golf, there is a handicap system that takes all of this into account to give you a handicap that accounts for your ability. You get your handicap adjusted down for playing on a hard course, and up for playing an easy course. So when someone asks you "what's your handicap" you know it's a genuine number. However, if someone asks you "what's your lowest score?" you can easily exclude the fact that your 74 you said you shot was actually on a course that was 2000 yards shorter than normal courses with absolutely zero hazards.

             

             

            We actually have a handicap system based on race results. My handicap is 4.2. 😁

             

            https://www.runbritainrankings.com/runners/profile.aspx?athleteid=118420 

            5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

            paul2432


              I like smaller local races where I have a chance to contend AG or OA.  I had my first OA wins ever last year in small local 10K and 5K in fairly unremarkable times that were not PRs but the wins were a great thrill for me.  The 10K was fairly hilly and the 5K cold and raining sideways.  In medium size races I really like spotting another guy in my AG and dueling it out.  Trail races are great for this due to small field sizes and PRs having little meaning on trails.

               

              As someone with a science background, the thing that bothers me most about politics is people acting in bad faith with all kinds of fake outrage and bogus arguments.

              Marky_Mark_17


                How you answer the "what's your PR?" question to another runner on the starting line says a lot.

                 

                 

                The day will certainly come for all of us (or already has) when PRs are not possible. But by claiming a non-legit course as your PR, you're going to make that day come a LOT sooner, because it's going to be hard to beat that PR on another more normal course.

                 

                I've never had anyone ask me that on the start line.  Definitely talked about goal times for the race with other runners, to see where they were at and also to figure out if we could put a pack together.  Again, that might partly be because here in NZ we tend to know a lot of the other runners either directly or indirectly, so we generally have a good feel for where we sit relative to others.

                 

                I agree fully with what Andres said.  PRs are very cool, but they aren't everything.  For me it's about knowing that you ran your best race and left everything out there - get the process right and the outcome (time) will be what it is.  If I never ran a time faster than my current HM PR, I wouldn't care at all because I know that day I ran the absolute best race that I could run and I was ecstatic with it.  I've had non-PR races that were very satisfying for similar reasons.  There's so many ways to enjoy our sport and PR's are just one aspect of that.

                 

                In terms of Darkwave's view about not half-assing races... it leads to some spectacular failures at times but sometimes you learn quite a lot from those (and/or you decide you're never going to run a particular course again because you hated it - I have 3 of those).  JMac, I wouldn't count using a race as a MP tempo or pacing others as half-assing either.  Those are both specific and very valid objectives that would lead to someone running a HM at less than full HM effort.

                 

                Anyway it was good to get some different perspectives on this and particularly from some runners with a lot more experience than me.

                 

                (I'm looking forward to having this debate again in 4 months time when I run Southern Lakes HM, which has a similar net downhill but none of the uphill!! It's a stunning course in one of my very favourite parts of the world so I had to give it a go some time)

                5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20) | 10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) 

                HM: 1:10:46 (Nov-19) | FM: 2:57:36 (Oct-17)

                Last race: NZ 10,000m Champs, 21 March, 32:34 (PB) 

                Up next: Wairarapa Country Marathon, 11 Oct (I HOPE!!!!)

                "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

                SteveChCh


                Hot Weather Complainer

                  Regardless of one's politics, everyone sometimes needs a tree to duck behind when a bathroom is nowhere in sight.

                   

                  You win the internet today.

                  PB:  Christchurch 2016 1:29.25

                  Recent Races:   Cherry Blossom Half-Marathon, September 13, 2020 1:33:38 Half-Marathon Time Trial May 31, 2020 1:31.51 Auckland Waterfront Half-Marathon 2019 1:30.49

                  2020 Planned Races:  Queenstown Half-Marathon, November 21

                    Flavio your politicians certainly bring a perspective to this discussion  !

                     

                    Mark/Steve I actually voted National as I am such a big time businessman 

                     

                    The main thing you risk by claiming a PB on a largely beneficial course is losing street credibility.

                    I still remember Amuse running a 2.39 on a big downhill course. I will mostly remember him for his great knowledge of running though.

                    50+ PBs -  

                    5k 18.25 Tauranga Parkrun  Sept 20      81.36 % age grade

                    10k 38.55 oct 19 strava run

                    Next race Mount Maunganui half 10k 28th nov 2020

                    " If you don't use it you lose it but if you use it, it wears out.

                    Somewhere in between is about right "      

                     

                    SteveChCh


                    Hot Weather Complainer

                      The problem I'd have with claiming a PB on an "easy" course, is how I'd feel in the future when I absolutely nail a race and miss that PR by a few seconds.  But then, that might never even happen.

                       

                      piwi - anyone running a small business or owning a rental property would be crazy to vote for what we currently have!

                      PB:  Christchurch 2016 1:29.25

                      Recent Races:   Cherry Blossom Half-Marathon, September 13, 2020 1:33:38 Half-Marathon Time Trial May 31, 2020 1:31.51 Auckland Waterfront Half-Marathon 2019 1:30.49

                      2020 Planned Races:  Queenstown Half-Marathon, November 21

                      Marky_Mark_17


                        Well, the weather is still looking pretty promising, with a very light tailwind and clear skies.  It should be around 12C/low 50's at race start but will warm up fast on a sunny morning and probably be closer to 16C/60F by the finish.

                        5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20) | 10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) 

                        HM: 1:10:46 (Nov-19) | FM: 2:57:36 (Oct-17)

                        Last race: NZ 10,000m Champs, 21 March, 32:34 (PB) 

                        Up next: Wairarapa Country Marathon, 11 Oct (I HOPE!!!!)

                        "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

                        dpschumacher


                        Making a comeback

                          🧐

                           

                           

                          DPS - Minnesotans are not allowed to complain about the weather. That portion of the world is not meant to be inhabited 

                          2019 Goal: Run every day Goal: Get to 165 lbs Goal: Get in shape to be able to run 2 marathons in 2020

                          2020 Goals:

                          5k:16:30

                          HM: 1:18:00

                          Marathon: 2:45:00

                          New 2020 Goal: Actually run a race, any race, just run a real legit race. **Eye Twitching**

                          flavio1980


                          King of pastries

                            Mark - I think you're going to have to run that half in a track otherwise Jmac won't accept your PR. Make sure to film the whole thing so nobody can claim lane infractions.

                            PRs: 1500m 4:54.1 3K 10:34 5K 18:05 HM 1:23:30 - Up next: Some 5K race Sep 6th.

                            Tool to generate Strava weekly

                            Marky_Mark_17


                              Mark - I think you're going to have to run that half in a track otherwise Jmac won't accept your PR. Make sure to film the whole thing so nobody can claim lane infractions.

                               

                              I'm still allowed gels though right? 

                              5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20) | 10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) 

                              HM: 1:10:46 (Nov-19) | FM: 2:57:36 (Oct-17)

                              Last race: NZ 10,000m Champs, 21 March, 32:34 (PB) 

                              Up next: Wairarapa Country Marathon, 11 Oct (I HOPE!!!!)

                              "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

                                I'm sorry Flavio a half on a track is a 21100m 

                                 

                                Mark all this discussion and I've forgotten to wish you good luck !

                                 

                                Steve cricket at the Mount today and a perfect forecast through the weekend.

                                50+ PBs -  

                                5k 18.25 Tauranga Parkrun  Sept 20      81.36 % age grade

                                10k 38.55 oct 19 strava run

                                Next race Mount Maunganui half 10k 28th nov 2020

                                " If you don't use it you lose it but if you use it, it wears out.

                                Somewhere in between is about right "