The Waltons aka Advanced Half Marathon Training Thread - 2022 edition (Read 443 times)

JamesD


JamesD

     

    Speaking of cold, I had my first sub-freezing run of the season today.  29º feeling like 23º (-2C/-5C), so of course I was over-dressed a bit because I'm always erring on the side of too warm when the cold weather first arrives and I have to re-learn what to wear every time winter rolls around.  To think I was running in 66º (19C) just 3 days ago (albeit in the afternoon, not the early morning).

     

    I'm having that issue of relearning winter wear in preparing for Saturday's half, aggravated by the fact that it may be in the low 30sF/near 0C and I've never raced in temperatures below 42/6, which itself was too cold for me.  My coldest recent run has been 4 easy miles on Sunday at 40/4 with wind.  I wore a long-sleeved shirt over a base layer along with a beanie, a thin buff, thin gloves, and tights.  Near the end of the run, my chest felt a little warm and sweaty but I was otherwise ok.  I felt cold for a few hours afterwards, but that may be because I foolishly stretched outside for about 10 minutes while sweaty after the run.  The colder raceday temperatures may be balanced out by running faster (I hope) and having less wind, so I may wear the same things I did Sunday.  I figure if I overdress, I may sweat too much and get more tired and maybe dehydrated, but if I underdress I may get actually sick.  I expect the course will pass near our place after a mile or so (organizers still haven't posted the course), and DW has volunteered to catch any excess clothes I throw at her as I go by, so I may add a vest or something.  I may also wear heavier clothing while waiting for the start & give it to her at the last minute.

    Post-1987 PRs:  Half 1:30:14 (2019); 10K 39:35 (2019); 5K 19:12 (2017); Mile 5:37.3 (2020)

    '23 Goals: health; consistency; age-graded PRs; half < 1:30

    zebano


       

      5x1,200m (5 minute) with 1 minute rest.  Targeted 6:40/mi pace and it was too easy.  ‘Last one fast one’ was 6:25/mi ISH pace.  It was enough effort for me to know it wouldn’t have been possible to hold for the whole workout, and definitely enough to tell me I should try 6:30/mi (4:00/km) pace for either a workout or the race. Unless some magic comes in I probably won’t run sub-40 and I’m not trying to this time

       

      Just FYI because I was obsessed with a 20 minute 5k forever. 6:26/mi is the pace you want for a 20-5k/ 40-10k. I'm still betting on the magic.

      1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 41:20 (2021), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Marathon - 3:37:17 (2018)

      Fredford66


      Running Musician

        James - Being able to dump stuff with family, either right before the start or early in the race is a real blessing.  I have found a vest to be a very useful piece of clothing.  I have a lightly insulated one that zips halfway up my neck and keeps my core quite warm, yet I can unzip it halfway to cool off without it turning into a big parachute slowing my down.

         

        RP - I'm rooting for you too.  I have a 5-miler coming up, which even more than a 10k feels like a go out fast and hold on at the end race.

         

        Rest day for me, though I've been trying to get back in the habit of using my rowing machine, so I may get in 30 minutes later.  Given I get very little upper body work, this could help out.  My running partner has a marathon on Sunday and I've been doing his taper runs with him, trying to keep him from going too fast.  His start time forecast is 30º feeling like 22º (-1C/-6C) and not getting much warmer.  Worse, the winds are forecast to start at 9mph and pick up to 16, gusting to 25 (13/26/40kph).  I've run a marathon in weather like that and it's not fun, but still better than the high humidity that hit so many people at the NY marathon a couple of weeks ago.

        5k 23:48.45 (3/22); 4M 31:26 (2/22); 5M 38:57 (11/22); 10k 49:24 (10/22); Half 1:48:32 (10/22)

        Upcoming race(s): Winter Series #5 Trail 10k, 2/4; E. Murray Todd Half, 3/12
        CommanderKeen


        Cobra Commander Keen

          I had a few days off around the weekend, so I'm a little late to the game here. Stuff not addressed in the marathon thread:


          Zebano - Good week, and that sounds HUGE for a XC race to me. That's considerably bigger than the half I just ran that was in the middle of the largest metropolitan area within at least a 16 hour drive of me.


          RP - 10k turkey trot? That's a lot more Ks than anyone runs around here. Overachiever!
          Races without an expectation of a given finish time are awesome since there's no pressure to hit anything specific, which I think opens the door to going out at a good effort and crushing the last mile or two.


          One more big week left, and after my workout today that mostly boils down to the LR.
          I had a great time at the half this weekend, which was likely the most fun I've ever had in a race. Possible RR incoming.

           

           

          Weekly for period: From: 11/07/2022 To 11/13/2022

          Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
          in ft
          11/07 3 rabbits & 1 coyote 10.05 16.17 01:24:54 08:27 05:15 351
          11/07 2 herons 4.00 6.44 00:34:42 08:41 05:23 161
          11/08 1 more stupid driver 8.20 13.20 01:15:04 09:09 05:41 262
          11/09 That time I said "nope" 13.02 20.94 01:47:51 08:17 05:09 427
          11/09 2 oblivious dog walkers and late season heat doping 4.00 6.44 00:36:09 09:02 05:37 269
          11/10 2 rabbits & 1 crane 8.00 12.88 01:13:54 09:14 05:44 341
          11/11 This run brought to you by GORE 10.05 16.18 01:26:54 08:39 05:22 571
          11/11 Sure enough, the wind is still there 4.05 6.52 00:34:39 08:33 05:19 269
          11/12 1 owl & 1 heron 6.25 10.06 00:52:44 08:26 05:15 279
          11/13 Let the music begin! 2.11 3.39 00:17:26 08:16 05:09 46
          11/13 Toyota Music Factory Half 13.21 21.25 01:23:38 06:20 03:56 200
          11/13 Morning Run 1.05 1.69 00:09:38 09:10 05:42 16

          Total distance: 84.00mi

          5k: 17:58 11/22 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:23:22 4/22 │ M: 2:56:05 12/22

           

          Upcoming Races:

           

          Heartland 50 - May 6

          Running Problem


          Problem Child

            Zeb I got to run a sub-20 and sub-40 once. I think they were in the same year too. We shall see if I can max out the effort and run sub 40. It's a fitness test and I don't think I'm a good enough runner to hop into a 10k and run sub 40 without detail oriented and very focused training...unless wearing super shoes (carbon fiber).

            Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

            VDOT 52.45

            5k19:35 | Marathon 2:56:07

            ccoakley


              Keen, congratulations on the half, very cool that you enjoyed it so much.

               

              RP, I'm not buying the self doubt.  Your body has run sub40 before and you seem to have a dangerous ability to push yourself past pain in race situations so there's no way you don't meet your goal unless you give up and you don't give up.

               

              Fred/James, agree it takes a couple weeks to fine tune the winter wardrobe.

               

              Zebano, yes unscheduled rest day.  Sounds like you managed to have fun at the xc race despite not meticulously researching all aspects ahead of time.  I didn't realize that was allowed here.

               

              The day off worked and I feel much more refreshed and energized this week.

              5k 24:53 (2020) |10k 52:24 (2021) |HM 1:57:14 (2019) |FM 4:24 (2007) |50k 5:57 (2022)

               

               

              JamesD


              JamesD

                Mark, please put me down for the Heroes of America half on Nov. 19.  No goal time.  Thanks.

                 

                For what it's worth, the organizers still haven't posted a map of the half course, but they did post elevation maps of the full, half, and 5K courses.  Looks like the half course is what I thought it would be.  I thought it was interesting that the elevation map for the half says starting elevation is 265 feet and the map for the full says its starting elevation is 237 feet.  The two start together.

                Post-1987 PRs:  Half 1:30:14 (2019); 10K 39:35 (2019); 5K 19:12 (2017); Mile 5:37.3 (2020)

                '23 Goals: health; consistency; age-graded PRs; half < 1:30

                Marky_Mark_17


                   

                  RP, I'm not buying the self doubt.  Your body has run sub40 before and you seem to have a dangerous ability to push yourself past pain in race situations so there's no way you don't meet your goal unless you give up and you don't give up.

                   

                  I agree. Not sure there's a lot of folks on this thread or the other less cool thread that would bet against RP!

                   

                  Keen - if it's that fun, we definitely need an RR!

                   

                  James - race added.

                  3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)  

                  10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

                  * Net downhill course

                  Last race: Run the Point 10k, 27 Nov, 35:00, 1st overall

                  Up next: Clevedon Country Half Marathon, 5 Feb

                  "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

                  CommanderKeen


                  Cobra Commander Keen

                    Hastily written, please forgive the formatting errors.

                     

                     

                    Toyota Music Factory Half Race Report


                    Ever since signing up for this race in August my coach had a note next to it in my training plan "tune up, ~95% effort". A bit disappointing in that I would have loved an all-out race and a shiny new PR before CIM, but I decided to trust the process. Prior to the race my coach did amend this somewhat, saying to keep to this effort for the first 15k, but then giving me the option of "opening things up" if I felt good after that point.


                    This was originally going to be a family trip, but DD1 had three soccer games re-scheduled for this same weekend. Given that these games were all against teams that were fighting for a top 2 spot in the league (and thus promotion come the spring season) the whole family ended up going different directions - DW and DD1 east to Tulsa, DDs 2 & 3 with my parents to the west, and me south to Texas.


                    The weather on race day was just about perfect - overcast and 37F/2.7C with a 5mph/8kmh wind.


                    I arrived in PLENTY of time to grab a primo parking spot, pick up my bib and goodies, then sit in the warm car until it was time for a quick warm up and change to proper racing shoes (Endorphin Pro 3).


                    The 10k and half marathon races started together, so I lined up in the second row giving some space to anyone running the 10k. I heard one guy say he was looking to run 1:16 (while wearing full tights, a LS shirt, another shirt over than, plus a buff around his neck he certainly didn't look like a person who could run that fast), and another guy who wanted to run 1:15, so thoughts of sneaking a "W" immediately left my mind.


                    The gun goes off and so do all of the racers. Everyone around me seemed to have lined up pretty darn well - no one passed me and I only passed a couple people in the first mile.


                    There were a few rollers in the first couple miles, but aside from a "pedestrian" 6:43 first mile the other hilly miles were pretty much right on target at ~6:30/mi. Normally I'd back off on hills a touch, but a nice benefit of intentionally holding back some


                    I zoned out and missed lapping my watch at mile 2 and never saw the mile 3 marker, though I don't doubt it was there - this was one of the best marked courses I've ever run.


                    Just before mile 3 the 10k runners split to the other side of a center median and I passed the only runner I could see in front of me. From the conversations I heard prior the start I knew there had to be at least 2 people ahead of me, but they (and anyone else in the half) were so far ahead of me that I couldn't see them over the next hill.


                    I'm just cruising along and nearly to mile 4 when I become conscious of footsteps behind me - the guy I had passed about a mile before is only a few steps away. Given that I wasn't going all-out, why not slow down a tad and get someone to run with? I slow down just a bit and ask over my shoulder if he has a goal time in mind.
                    This guy doesn't hear me clearly and speeds up a bit to match the pace I've been running, and I repeat my question.
                    "1:26 is my goal, 1:25 would be awesome but I don't know if I'm in that kind of shape".


                    A glance at my watch (with the "Race Screen" CIQ data field up) tells me that we're bang on 1:25 pace at that moment, so I tell him "you'd better be in 1:25 pace because you're running it now".


                    My new running buddy, who looks a little familiar (what are the odds I know anyone running a race that's a 3.5+ hour drive from my home?), isn't deterred so we motor along and make a transition from roads to a sidewalk that quickly turns into a paved multi-use path.


                    New Running Buddy and I chat away on this rather windy but mostly flat path, still far enough behind anyone else that we have no idea how many people are ahead of us.
                    I take a gel at mile 5 as part of a nutrition test for CIM, which goes down perfectly well even without having timed it to match with a water stop.


                    We're near mile 5.5 when we see the leader heading back towards us, and a couple minutes later two other guys running side-by-side (one of which is the overdressed guy). I make a note of our elapsed time when this pair passes by a sign by the path to help figure out how far back we are.


                    Just a few seconds later the path curves a bit to the right and as some trees clear I see that we're right at the turnaround with no runners that those previous 3 ahead of us. I speed up a tad to create some extra room for New Running Buddy and myself to go around the cone without us hitting each other, then drop back immediately after making that turn. We pass the sign I used as my timing marker 40 seconds after the pair in 2nd/3rd place.
                    "40 seconds isn't too much to make up in a bit over 7 miles" I think to myself. I figure at best those guys will maintain their pace to the end, meanwhile I know I've got a good deal of room to increase the effort to make up that time in the final few miles - my biggest concern is running out of road to chase them down.


                    Shortly after this we begin to encounter the rest of the runners behind us, none of which seem to be close enough to possibly catch us. New Running Buddy and I have been keeping up a chorus of "thank yous" to all of the race volunteers and police who are handling traffic at intersections and we add "looking good", "great job", "keep it up", and various other race platitudes as we see other runners.


                    Over the next mile or so it becomes clear that the pair of runners ahead of us are both slowing down and going through a breakup. I calculate out that we've gained 20 seconds off the closer of the two runners, and 10 over the other guy. Making progress!


                    Just after mile 8 we unexpectedly encounter a hazard on the course in the form of a wooden bridge over a creek. It's humid enough and cold enough here that the bridge has frosted over and footing was quite sketchy.
                    About this point New Running Buddy asks me what my 5k PR is, and I return the question. "Great", I think. "This guy's 35 seconds faster than me over 5k."
                    I also find out that a bit more than a month earlier New Running Buddy ran 3:30 in Chicago, owing to under fueling.


                    About mile 9 we pass the guy in 3rd place - Overdressed Guy - who seems to be crashing pretty hard and we're also only about 10 seconds behind Other Dude as well.


                    Right along here New Running Buddy and I have a chat about the future of the race. I say I'm going to open things up by mile 9.5, and he wants "to feel good at mile 11". Knowing that we're likely to separate soon, I finally introduce myself, and he tells me his name as well (Jeremy). Then comes the surprising question from him: "did you run the Wurst Race?" (my favorite HM in a small, out-of-the way German town in Texas).


                    "Wait a minute, you're THAT Jeremy??"
                    I knew this guy looked familiar, but I certainly wasn't expecting to actually know him, let alone have race against him years before.


                    We're passed mile 9.5 now, so I drop the pace a little bit, moving up to actual HM effort, and we pass Other Dude and put ourselves in 2nd/3rd place as we also make a transition to proper roads again. As an added bonus, we've also made a turn that has us going with the wind - the headwind wasn't an issue at all before as there was more than enough tree cover to block it.


                    Neither one of us are talking much at this point given the increase in effort. We've averaged 6:28/mi thus far, but mile 10 comes in at 6:13, mile 11 at 6:15, & 6:08 for mile 12.

                    Once we close mile 12 I decide to drop the hammer for two reasons:

                    1) Going sub-6 pace for the final 1.1mi sounds like fun
                    2) Even though (judging by our breathing) Jeremy has been working harder than I have this entire time he also has a much higher top speed than I do, so if it comes down to the last 800m or less he may well outkick me.


                    And thus I crank things up to about 5k effort, pulling ahead of Jeremy, now having to run around some of the back-of-the-pack 10kers. After 1/2 mile he catches up and runs along side me for a few seconds before dropping back again. I recall him saying earlier how he didn't know if he was in 1:25 shape or not, and here we are sprinting to well under a 1:24 half. "What BS was that?" & "Keep it up!" I tell myself as I enter that tunnel vision mode I got during my 5k PR race over the summer.


                    I fly by a volunteer and very shortly thereafter hear her yelling to Jeremy "Catch him! Catch him!".

                    "HA!" I think. "If you only knew how the race had gone so far!".


                    The last 1/4 mile went by a number of buildings with entrances to parking lots that all looked the same - "Where's the damn finish??"
                    Finally that last parking lot entrance comes into view, a police officer stops traffic that is wanting to cross and I move across the finish line mats (not a single photo of me reaching for my watch!).
                    5:47 mile 13, 5:40 pace final bit. 1:23:33 overall.


                    I do finally stop my watch and suck wind for a bit and see Jeremy crossing the line maybe 5-6 seconds behind me.
                    We catch our breaths a bit, compliment each other on the race, chat just a bit, then head our separate ways.


                    So far this has definitely been the favorite race I've run. I've never had an opportunity to work with someone for so much of a race before, and then to close the race as strongly as this with someone to compete against directly was just a ton of fun.
                    It wasn't until JMac mentioned it that I realized I was only 12 seconds off my official PR (though I still say I have valid reasons to think that course was long). While it's mildly irritating to know that a PR was within reach like that, at the same time it's just really nice to know that my fitness has improved substantially even just since April when I set that PR and that I'm in a really good spot to PR the 5k at a turkey trot and then the marathon at CIM the next week.

                    5k: 17:58 11/22 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:23:22 4/22 │ M: 2:56:05 12/22

                     

                    Upcoming Races:

                     

                    Heartland 50 - May 6

                    JamesD


                    JamesD

                      Great race and RR, Keen.  I was rooting for overdressed guy, as I may wear a bit more than what he had on in similar temperatures.  (I'm not aiming for a 1:16, though.)

                      Post-1987 PRs:  Half 1:30:14 (2019); 10K 39:35 (2019); 5K 19:12 (2017); Mile 5:37.3 (2020)

                      '23 Goals: health; consistency; age-graded PRs; half < 1:30

                      Fredford66


                      Running Musician

                        Ccoakley - glad to hear the day off helped.

                         

                        Keen - Great report; thanks for sharing.

                        5k 23:48.45 (3/22); 4M 31:26 (2/22); 5M 38:57 (11/22); 10k 49:24 (10/22); Half 1:48:32 (10/22)

                        Upcoming race(s): Winter Series #5 Trail 10k, 2/4; E. Murray Todd Half, 3/12
                        zebano


                           

                          Fred/James, agree it takes a couple weeks to fine tune the winter wardrobe.

                           

                          Zebano, yes unscheduled rest day.  Sounds like you managed to have fun at the xc race despite not meticulously researching all aspects ahead of time.  I didn't realize that was allowed here.

                           

                           

                          The joy of fine tuning the winter wardrobe is that by the time you do the temp has changed another 5 degrees or the wind has kicked up. =)

                           

                          Lol yes it really was a fun run for me. I'll be sure not to post future fun runs on the front page in order to avoid contaminating the rest of you Wink

                           

                          Keen Dang, I'd seen the strava splits but the casual 9.5 miles chatting is such a huge fitness gain that I'm in awe. Apparently all those hundred mile weeks actually work!

                          1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 41:20 (2021), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Marathon - 3:37:17 (2018)

                          Fredford66


                          Running Musician

                            One of the fun parts about dressing for winter running, for me, is my running partner grew up in the western plains of Canada, where it's quite a bit colder than NJ, but he's always colder than I am and dressed more warmly.  Today, in 34º, he wore tights vs. me in shorts and he had a hat where I just had a warm headband.

                            5k 23:48.45 (3/22); 4M 31:26 (2/22); 5M 38:57 (11/22); 10k 49:24 (10/22); Half 1:48:32 (10/22)

                            Upcoming race(s): Winter Series #5 Trail 10k, 2/4; E. Murray Todd Half, 3/12
                            Running Problem


                            Problem Child

                              Fred I have a similar RP (partner...not problem) who would dress like you. The ONLY time I've seen him wear gloves it was probably below 20F and dark out. Oh and he might wear them more since he recently fell and cut his hand on ice.

                               

                              Marky_Mark & CC I'm pretty sure you'd win a bet against me even if it was "I bet you CAN'T go out at race effort then back off to win $100."

                              Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                              VDOT 52.45

                              5k19:35 | Marathon 2:56:07

                              watsonc123


                                Keen - nice RR.

                                 

                                Everyone else - good running.

                                 

                                Sorry I've been a bit AWOL this week.  I've been a little busy.  Last week was fine during my low volume, strength & speed cycle.  For the first time ever, I did pure flat speed work on Wednesday.  And on Sunday I ran a hill I hadn't ran for years, it was much longer than I initially remembered.

                                 

                                Weekly for period: From: 07/11/2022 To 13/11/2022

                                Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
                                in m
                                08/11 Evening Run 4.26 6.85 00:36:34 08:35 05:20 36
                                09/11 Evening Run - 5 * Flying 30s 4.22 6.79 00:39:55 09:28 05:53 7
                                11/11 Afternoon Run 6.27 10.09 00:54:37 08:43 05:25 22
                                13/11 Afternoon Run - Kelson Hill 8.56 13.77 01:09:07 08:04 05:01 214

                                Total distance: 37.50km

                                PRs: 5km 18:43 (Dec 2015), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:26:16 (Sep 2016), full 3:09:28 (Jun 2015)

                                 

                                40+ PRs: 5km 19:31 (Oct 2020), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:29:39 (Jun 2018), full 3:13:55 (Sep 2022)