2018 Sub-3. No rules. Run. (Read 789 times)


    I think it's been a few weeks since I've posted my weeklies.  I'll get better about that.  I have been following along and keeping up with all the good training (and I'll start to participate/comment more on that too!). Mikkey, I'll look in to what I need to do to log miles here.  But if it's not an auto load thing from Garmin to here, I'm not likely to stay consistent with it!


    Weekly Summary
    Monday, Feb 12, 2018 thru Sunday, Feb 18, 2018

    <tfoot> </tfoot>
    Day Miles Pace Description HR Link
    Mon 7.9 8:06 Mud Pit 142 (73%) strava
    Tue 5.8 8:19 Major nasal congestion meant no sleep which then meant skipped workout. 142 (73%) strava
    Tue 3.2 8:11 Afternoon Treadmill Run 144 (74%) strava
    Wed 9.7 6:59 8@~GMP 164 (84%) strava
    Thu 6.2 8:02 Morning Run 148 (76%) strava
    Fri 8.1 7:50 Morning Run 147 (75%) strava
    Sat 20.1 7:34 Great RacePace Group Run in slop 151 (77%) strava
    Sun 6.0 8:11 Morning Run 137 (70%) strava
      67.0 7:46      


    I'm happy with this week.  Despite a cold, I managed to get in the mileage and the workout I wanted.  This is the third week in a row I've done a long-ish MP tempo (starting at 6 going to 8 this week).  Each week the HR has been on the high side for these workouts, but other factors have come in to play, so I'm not sure what I can take away from it right now.  The efforts seemed more or less manageable. I'll keep these going at around this pace (~6:30) and then make a better evaluation of what's realistic the week of Boston.  I've got two more weeks of good running, then I'll be in Spain for spring break, with not too much running.

    Upcoming races:  I dunno.


      Andres, nice looking mileage and solid MP miles, 8 is no joke.


      my week

      I did it! - 80 miles

      Tu - 15x 400's (1:16's)

      Th - 20 minutes of one on, one off fartlek

      Sa - 21 @ 7:10


      mostly happy that the long run was steady and chatty. Not sure of the value of the 400's at this stage but I incorporated it into 16M, although one of the strict fast guys from my club tells me that you can't count a long run if it contains intervals because you get a rest! He's mental though.


      Mikkey, I think I've now hitched Garmin to Running Ahead and I manually uploaded todays run. I'll try to get comfortable with this feature soon.

      Upcoming; 3rd May Scottish 5k champs, 9th May Helensburgh 10k, 16th May Dumbarton 10k, 24th May Monument mile, 26th May Shettleston 10k, 1st June Killearn trail 10, 2nd June Milngavie trail race, 16th June 7 hills of Edinburgh, 12th October TAMA half marathon, 27th October Leeds Abbey dash 10k


        I usually don’t log weeks unless I get over 70 in but I’ll do it this week because I did my first quality sessions since my leg snapped in half in October.


        Mon 8 7:58

        Tue 8 with up hill strides 7:53

        Wed 8 with 8x200 at R effort target 39 (38,38,37,37,36,36,35)

                 With jog recovery.  Clunky at first but nice and smooth by

                  The end

        Thurs 7 8:00

        Fri 8 with strides on flat ground 7:45

        sat 8 8:00

        Sun 13 as 5E, 3 at M effort (6:36,6:29,6:04) 5E 7:18

              Was under instructions to progress the effort to get the avg

              Near where I would like to be on race day.  Was able to do it

              6:05 felt super easy by the time I got there.

        HM: 1/17 1:18:53. FM: 12/18 2:46:04


          Andres: Solid looking week.  That MP looks pretty encouraging and its a great time to get that in. Nice LR yesterday as well.


          Fin: Huge LR in there.  Congrats on getting back over 80 as well.

          Swim: Again a nice way to climb back from that injury!  Congrats on introducing some Q runs again.  That has to feel pretty good!


          Happy to get the mileage back over 70 at 3 weeks post-marathon.  Would like to get back into the low 80's for about the next 3-4 weeks before I leave for Italy and then taper for Boston.  Like Andres I came down with a cold last weekend that has lingered much of the week, but was definitely feeling better for this mornings' workout/race.  As i mentioned last week I jumped into a local 10K today that included two Florida style bridge climbs within the last 2 miles.  Went out feeling somewhat decent, probably closer to my true tempo pace, but was able to work it down into the mid 5:40's by mile 5 (including the first bridge climb and decent).  Did fall back a bit after the turnaround coming in at mile 6 at 5:52, but passed another with a few hundred meters left.  Actually the heat wasn't too bad as it was in the low to mid 60's (still humid) which is the coolest we have seen in weeks!  Was able to pass 2 guys in the final 5K and finished 4th overall with an official time of 36:09.  Think if I went out a bit harder and ran even splits from the beginning I might have had a shot at sub 36 for sure, but wasn't sure how the legs would respond.  Also thinking I still can feel the marathon a bit in my legs evidenced by the fact I ran this 10K just as fast as my 3K last week.  It was an automatic PR since I'v never raced this distance, but thinking I've got some room to improve especially on a flatter course.  Made it into a nice LR with 17 total for the day.  Other workout went pretty well on Tuesday where I ran 11 with 4 at tempo pace.


          Weekly Summary
          Monday, Feb 12, 2018 thru Sunday, Feb 18, 2018

          <tfoot> </tfoot>
          Day Miles Pace Description Link
          Mon 7.2 7:44 EZ + new shoes strava
          Mon 4.2 7:43 EZ + old shoes strava
          Tue 11.1 7:06 Running with a cold is snot fun (4E + 4T* + 3E) strava
          Wed 8.3 7:49 Hmmm lots of traffic around the Hi-Point motel before 6 🤔 strava
          Wed 4.1 7:13 Shouldn't I be getting something for my wife instead of running again? strava
          Thu 8.2 7:56 EZ with Jen & Jon strava
          Fri 8.3 7:36 EZ + strides strava
          Sat 6.1 7:32 Clearing out the pipes strava
          Sun 2.8 8:31 EZ warm up strava
          Sun 6.3 5:47 Dragon 10K strava
          Sun 8.0 7:35 Makin it 17 for the day w/ a few more bridge repeats strava
            74.6 7:27    

          5K: 16:44 (11/18)  |  10K: 36:09 (2/18)  |  HM: 1:17:15 (12/18)  |  FM: 2:48:58 (1/18)


            Mikkey: You've been putting in some huge mileage and given that + a cold I can see how you would be feeling tired going into that half. Good idea to take a rest day. Impressive running streak; mine never gets more than 6 days since I take Monday off every week!


            TN: Sorry to hear about the achilles problem; I hope your plan with calf strengthening sorts it out.


            Kram: Excellent week last week with impressive Q sessions. I noticed you are incorporating some segments at a pace faster than easy but much slower than your MP in your runs, especially the MLR type ones. What is your thinking on those? I sometimes think I should do something at those types of paces, rather than everything either very easy or MP or faster.


            Lela: Nice first week of your Buffalo cycle and I like that wave tempo.


            Andres: Solid week and I like those MP runs. Sounds like a good plan for the remaining weeks till Boston.


            Finbad: Congrats on the 80 mile week!


            Swim: Great to see the quality ramping up. You're showing great discipline to make the return gradual.


            My week: I was feeling tired from last weekend's time trial/long run combo, so opted for just a moderately hard hill workout on Wednesday. By today I was ready for a bit more quality so I put some faster miles at the end of my LR.


            I have a change of plans for my marathon: since my wife will be travelling for work the week surrounding Ocean's Run, I am instead going to do the Martian Marathon in MIchigan on April 14. That pushes out my race date by 6 weeks, but I think I can accommodate the change.


            Weekly Summary
            Monday, Feb 12, 2018 thru Sunday, Feb 18, 2018

            <tfoot> </tfoot>
            Day Miles Pace Description Egain Link
            Tue 10.2 8:13 Morning Run 510 strava
            Wed 10.0 7:47 TM steady run with hills (4-10%) 0 strava
            Thu 10.2 8:07 Morning Run 247 strava
            Thu 5.1 8:45 Evening Run on TM 0 strava
            Fri 12.2 7:54 Afternoon Run 664 strava
            Sat 6.2 8:13 Afternoon Run 378 strava
            Sun 20.0 7:33 Long run on TM: 120 min easy + 31 min @ 6:27 0 strava
              73.9 7:57   1799  

            5K: 17:55 (2017)    HM: 1:23:57 (2016)    FM: 2:52:16 (2018)

            Up next: Erie Marathon (Sept. 8)


              Doppleback - welcome.


              Mikkey - I've just set-up the RA Garmin Connect.  So hopefully going forward it will appear.  However, if you're not using Garmin, then it's quite a pain as you'd have to manually upload also into RA.  IMHO Strava is better for this.


              My week was in one word - humid.


              In a few more -  I got my volume aim, which was continuing the gradual increase (4km / 2.5 miles more than the previous week).  I was off the pace for both Tuesday and Thursday workouts.  Tuesday's intervals started ok, but then a huge fade in the heat wind, plus I had not drank enough beforehand.  Thursday's tempo was a bit slow, but consistent without a fade on a very humid evening.


              <tfoot> </tfoot>
              Day Miles Pace Description Link
              Mon 5.0 8:55 Evening Run strava
              Tue 8.8 7:44 Lunch Run - Incl. 11 * 400m circa 10k pace, except bad fade in heat and wind strava
              Thu 7.4 7:34 Evening Run- tempo 4.0km-11.0km strava
              Fri 6.2 8:22 Morning Run strava
              Sat 5.0 8:40 Afternoon Run strava
              Sun 10.6 8:29 Afternoon Run strava
                43.0 8:13    

              PRs: 5km 18:43, half 1:26:16, full 3:09:28


              40+ PRs: 5km 20:34, half 1:29:39


              2019 aims: Unlike 2017 & 2018, be consistent.  So get 40+ weeks of 40+ miles incl. two quality sessions (5 weeks achieved so far).


                I know I am stepping in the middle of this and will likely ask questions other people already know, so please stick with me.


                Andres - What are you targeting as your longest MP run prior to Boston

                Finbad - When you say rest ... are you walking the intervals or running easy ?  Either way you have to do what is right for you

                Swim - 6:05 Super easy ... That sound fun to an old man

                Weatherboy - Lot of Doubles ... do you usually do a long mid-week run (14+ miles)?

                JTReeves - When I am in shape my favorite type of workout is to run 2 hours for the price of admission and then start my speed work.

                Watsonc - I melt in the heat ... but this time of year in Wisconsin heat = 39F


                Week #1 / 13 of Couch Potato to 50 Mile trail race.  6 days run / walking for a total  38.6 miles .  Long run 9.4 Miles on Sunday with 5x1 minute striders at what will be marathon pace this fall.  6:40 was comfortable for a minute - But light years away from MP.  I also did 3,051 vertical feet on TM (Up only)


                Week #2 / 13 Plan is for >= 45 miles with at least 2,500 vertical feet on TM.  I will do 2 speed workouts 8 to 10 x 1 minute faster than last week and 20 minutes @ T (I am not looking forward to how slow T will be).  1 mid-week long run of at least 10 miles and one weekend long run of at least 10 miles.


                Regardless of speed or walk breaks I really need to get up to a 20 miler and then a 30 miler pretty quickly to be able to complete the May 12, 50 miler ~ Ice Age in LaGrange, WI.  If I have the time and my body will take it ... I will push Sunday's long run.


                It is time to start focussing on hydration, nutrition, sleep and given up most of my beer drinking.

                Comeback #19    Comeback # 20 ... 5/12/18 Ice Age 50 Miler





                  Finbad - When you say rest ... are you walking the intervals or running easy ?  Either way you have to do what is right for you





                  I was jogging the rests in my intervals so I'm counting it as a continuous run whatever happens.


                  DoppleBock - sounds like you're coming in pretty hot and trying to ramp up fast but as you say


                  "It is time to start focussing on hydration, nutrition, sleep"


                  watch the niggles, I'm getting shin splints just thinking about jumping into that much elevation gain from a standing start and a history of injuries.

                  Upcoming; 3rd May Scottish 5k champs, 9th May Helensburgh 10k, 16th May Dumbarton 10k, 24th May Monument mile, 26th May Shettleston 10k, 1st June Killearn trail 10, 2nd June Milngavie trail race, 16th June 7 hills of Edinburgh, 12th October TAMA half marathon, 27th October Leeds Abbey dash 10k


                    Lot's of good weeks here.  I haven't posted mine in a bit (training for ultras now, no marathons planned in 2018), but still love this thread.  Lot's of good info and inspiration.


                    Anyway, here is my week.  Nose breathing pace is something I read about on irunfar as a means of keeping the pace easy (all-day pace).  It was hard running that way, but did serve the purpose of keeping the pace in check.


                    If anyone is interested, my race report from the Sean O'Brien 100K (dropped down to 50 miler) is in the ultra group (https://www.runningahead.com/groups/ultra/forum)


                    Weekly Summary
                    Monday, Feb 12, 2018 thru Sunday, Feb 18, 2018

                    Day Miles Pace Description Egain Link
                    Mon 4.0 10:38 Afternoon Run 0 strava
                    Tue 8.1 8:55 Tempo @ 5% - 18 min then 12 min 0 strava
                    Wed 6.5 11:17 Morning Run 1115 strava
                    Thu 8.5 10:16 Morning Run 1482 strava
                    Fri 6.0 11:20 2 x 1 mile at 15% grade 0 strava
                    Sat 19.8 10:56 Morning Run 3378 strava
                    Sun 14.4 12:19 Nose breathing pace 3306 strava

                      Finbad - Another great week there.  Your long runs have been super impressive for several weeks now.  Add that to the 80 weekly mileage and you're in great shape.


                      Swim - 6:04 at elevation as a goal marathon pace?  What's that, like 5:50 at sea level?  I like it!


                      Weatherboy - even with the week in Italy, if you get back to the 80's, I expect you'll have a better-than-not shot at a PR, with the huge assumption that we get decent weather in Boston.  You've seemed to get right back to a good routine.  I'm with you on 60s and humid not being terrible in general--I've actually noticed how pleasant it is when you're not shivering during the warm up.  But it still sucks for a race/workout/LR in my opinion.


                      JT - That's 6 more weeks of big training!  If you can hold it together mentally, that's got to pay off.


                      Way to let the mileage start creeping back up, Watson.


                      Doppleback - I don't have a set plan for the weekly MP sections.  Maybe I'll get it up to 12? For now I'll keep adding a mile each week and see how that goes.  I'm with Finbad - that seems like a ton in a short period of time, but I'm guessing you've done the comeback off of a lot of nothing before?


                      Mikkey - I linked this account to my Garmin account, but nothing showed up after my morning run.  Is it something that populates automatically?

                      Upcoming races:  I dunno.


                        I always like to be able to run 20-25k at MP during a 20 miler to gain comfort of MP.


                        I am rolling the dice on the quick ramp up.  It used to be a piece of cake in my late 30's to early 40's ... Now I am turning 49 this month.  I love IA 50 Mile trail race and it is my carrot to train this winter / spring.  Then will come marathon training and sub 3 is the carrot to train.


                        I have narrowed the marathon down to 4 choices - I will run at least 1 of the top 3 and Monkey.

                        *  9/8/18 No Frills - Minocqua, WI (If I am ready)

                        *  9/23/18 Fox Cities - Appleton, WI (Home Town)

                        *  10/21/18 Grand Rapids, MI (I always wanted to run and my best chance at sub 3)

                        *  11/18/18 Harpeth Hills Flying Monkey - Nashville, TN (3,700 feet of elevation Change)








                        Dopplebock - I don't have a set plan for the weekly MP sections.  Maybe I'll get it up to 12? For now I'll keep adding a mile each week and see how that goes.  I'm with Finbad - that seems like a ton in a short period of time, but I'm guessing you've done the comeback off of a lot of nothing before?


                        Comeback #19    Comeback # 20 ... 5/12/18 Ice Age 50 Miler






                          Western States this year ... Nice!  I will be out there for my Sister ... It only took 5 years in Lotter.  My friends Andy and Dan are in this year also ... took them 6 years.


                          Pacing certain distances makes more sense to me than others.

                          * 5k - I do not understand

                          * 8k to 10k - I am right on

                          * 10M - 25K sub par

                          *  Marathon - I am right on

                          *  50k - I have no idea

                          *  50M - always nail it

                          * 100M - tried once and failed

                          *  24 Hour - It made sense to me until I decided to take it to the race instead of letting the race come to me ... now I got nothing for the 24 hour.




                          If anyone is interested, my race report from the Sean O'Brien 100K (dropped down to 50 miler) is in the ultra group (https://www.runningahead.com/groups/ultra/forum)


                          Comeback #19    Comeback # 20 ... 5/12/18 Ice Age 50 Miler




                            My usual Monday catch up with everyone!


                            Andres: Great week and MP tempo! Spain in a few weeks, maybe lighter on running but will be awesome time on feet I'm sure. Any big plans while you're there?


                            Finbad: 80!? with 3 quality sessions to boot! NICE!


                            Mikkey: I'm OCD about my RA log, so  yeah no worries on that.


                            Swim: I really prefer progressing to average the goal pace, a lot of my workouts end up being that way...though I know sometimes I should be better about forcing myself to do some steady states and hit and go workouts just finding the pace and sticking to it.


                            Weather: Glad you are feeling better, solid 10k 3 weeks removed from marathon...you definitely have ability to be faster at that distance but can't complain about auto PR!


                            JT Reeves: 4-10% on mill....sweating buckets thinking about that. Bummer to have to change marathon plans but sounds like more ideal that way with logistics and travel for you/wife etc. What does the Martian course look like? Run it before?


                            Watson: Still 2 good qual sessions even with the humidity, there is a reason there are conversion calculators out there for humidity. The effort matters more than the pace in those conditions!


                            Dopplebock: Welcome! Don't give up beer totally, I mean...as long as you're not doing a keg stand every night I think you're good!


                            Paul: 15%. FIFTEEN?


                            Second week of Buffalo training down, happy with how it went. I wasn't able to do the 8 mile race I wanted so I did a solo 8 Mile TT on Sunday in the middle of my 'long' instead. Averaged 6:30 but splits were: 6:46, 6:42, 6:49, 6:27, 6:16, 6:20, 6:18, 6:21 so finished well faster which was good. Dropped a sub 20 5k and 40 10k in there so I'll take it especially as a solo effort. There's a small 4ish mile race this coming weekend, hoping I can jump in that. Really itching for a race to see where I am at, though yesterday did make me feel good with 14 weeks to go till Buffalo still.


                            Mon: 5 Miles 8:30 Recovery Mill miles
                            Tues: 10 Miles 7:00 400-800-1200-1600-1600-1200-800-400 @ 6:02
                            Wed: 6.1 Miles 8:04 OUTSIDE in SHORTS!
                            Thurs: 3.6 Miles + strides 8:12/5:30 Just shorty today.
                            Fri: 6.1 Miles 8:04 More outside miles, thank goodness for fresh air
                            Sat: 7 Miles + strides 7:48/5:16 Legs just wanted to go today, had to really work to keep it slower.
                            Sun: 14.4 Miles 7:50/6:30/7:33  4 miles up, 8 miles TT, 2.4 miles down
                            Total: 53 Miles    

                            Pre-Baby PR's (all from 2015): 5k: 18:46  10k: 38:37 HM: 1:24:51 FM: 2:58:13

                            Postpartum PR's: 5k: 18:18 (2018)  HM: 1:21:14 (2019) FM: 2:57:06 (2018-12 mo PP)


                            2019 Lineup: Winter Warrior Half (1/5) {1:21:14}, NYC Half (3/17), Boston (4/15)





                              Weatherboy: Great job on the 10k race! I definitely think that further removed/recovered from your marathon, without the lingering cold, and maybe with more even splits you can easily go sub 36. Your 5k PR equates to a 35:39 in Daniel's Vdot calculator, FWIW.


                              Watson: Sounds like summer weather with the humidity. I'm so sick of snow/ice/cold now that I think I would take heat and humidity, but by mid-summer here when we get that weather I'll no doubt be complaining about it and longing for winter.


                              Dopplebock: The quick ramp up should be less stressful if you are doing a lot of it on the mill, especially the climbing, since you avoid the downhills. I'm guessing if you are in Wisconsin you are doing a lot of mill running in the winter?


                              Paul: Nice week. Ditto what Lela said about the 15% grade. My mill goes to 15% grade but I rarely go above 10% as above that I run into problems hitting my head on the ceiling... drawbacks of having the mill in the basement with lower ceiling, and being 6' 4". Anyway, mile reps at that grade are no joke.


                              Lela: Great 8 mile time trial; especially with the progressively faster splits. That should be a good confidence booster. Also nice ladder workout. You asked about the Martian course: I've never done it before but know it is flat (I grew up in that general part of Michigan; it is flat in general) and it should be pretty fast. Kram is familiar with it (I think he ran the half there) and has given some good feedback. Here's the elevation profile:



                              5K: 17:55 (2017)    HM: 1:23:57 (2016)    FM: 2:52:16 (2018)

                              Up next: Erie Marathon (Sept. 8)


                                Dopple - I was in Appleton last June for the Lawrence U graduation (sister-in-law). Nice flat area for running.


                                Lela - nice 8 mile TT. Those are never easy alone, hence the reason I went to a race on Saturday.


                                A friend was just noting that he thought his week's mileage was pretty good, but then looked at a Strava group and he was #12. I said it all depends on the group. I'm #2 mileage wise for our local running group, but my 65 miles last week puts me at #32 for the RWOL Sub 3 group. Some high mileage folks in there!


                                I haven't been able to post lately, but am trying to read when I can. I'm about 4 weeks out from another full. Not sure yet if a sub-3 is possible. A week ago Sunday I pretty much bailed on what was to be 18 with 14 @ MP. I did 3 warm-up, 8 at about a 7:00 pace (struggled to keep that), and called it with one mile cool-down. I blamed it on warm temps, humidity, wind, some fatigue, and general life stress. I didn't let it get to me though.


                                This past Saturday I jumped in on a 10 mile race in hopes for some confidence building and for a good workout. Some rolling terrain, some flat recreation trails, and one nasty hill from 8.5 to mile 9 made for a challenging, but not horrible course. My Garmin read a bit short. The official time was 1:04:15 for a 6:26 pace.


                                I've looked at a couple of calculators and this translates to anything from a 2:58 to a 3:06 full.


                                Date Distance Pace Comment  

                                 Mon Feb 12 



                                 Afternoon Run 


                                 Tue Feb 13 



                                 Track: 5 x 600m


                                 Wed Feb 14 



                                 Supposed to be 14


                                 Thu Feb 15 



                                 Easy 5


                                 Fri Feb 16 



                                 MLR - anti tapering


                                 Sat Feb 17 



                                 Pre-race warm-up


                                 Sat Feb 17 



                                 Charlotte 10 Mile Race 


                                 Sun Feb 18 



                                 Morning Run 




                                Bike commute: 85 miles