2021 Sub 3:00 Marathon Thread (Read 420 times)

JMac11


Milkman

    NYC Marathon - DW  I'm shocked you haven't run it given the races you come up here for. I also can't believe Cal is saying American cities are boring, but then hasn't even visited NYC! Mikkey - the time qualifying historically has been very easy. You just need to run a 1:36 half. My guess is they will lower it though for 2022 given how many people now run those times, similar to what they've had to do with Boston.

     

    Mikkey - what a beatdown by the US. Knew they would probably win given the talent they had compared to Europe, but didn't expect anything like this. I will say watching Whistling on TV made me sad that I don't know when I get back to it. It really is the best course I've ever played (ahead of Black imo). I'm heading to Bandon Dunes next summer though so we'll see how those courses look, especially since they're true links style.

     

    Flavio - I'm glad you got a true MP run in. I was going to comment that your coach had a lot of MP intervals, but nothing sustained. I can see hitting sub 3 pace though was tough. Honestly though, you should still feel rundown. If I'm feeling good before the taper, it's not a good sign!

     

    JT - I remembered one of the things we spoke about with your taper last time was getting in another big long run in 2 weeks prior to the race. This actually seems like a better alternative: shorter, but more intensity (I think you used to do 20+). I think you're on track for a PR 

     

    DW - what does elite entry for Indy entail?

     

    Cal - your 5K story with 16-17 year olds reads backwards compared to every race I've done: usually they storm out of the gate, run out of endurance, and then get passed. They must be coached pretty well if they're running more appropriately.

     

    Me - After the 10K last Saturday, this was a normal training week. I usually like to give 3 days between a 10K and my next workout, but the weather dictated otherwise with oppressive humidity forecasted, so I had to move it up a day. That led to a pretty bad workout: some of it was just my legs being tired, but I also overdid the E pace in the middle. I generally like to run something around MP+15% during those workouts, but I was getting closer to MP+10% on some miles. Ended up running a slow 2T at the end instead of a normal 3T. Oh well

     

    Legs then felt like crap most of the week for the first time this cycle. I was worried given how good they felt, but finally got that dead leg feeling I'm used to. Saturday's long run started out the same, but my legs finally warmed up and I was able to do my usual progression. Daniels doesn't really prescribe these progressive long runs, but ever since I tried one based off of Pfitz's idea of gradually working to MP+10%, I was in love. It's a perfect run because if you don't feel good, you just keep it at normal E pace, but if you find yourself doing okay, you can gradually pick it up. I did this one in Central Park too, so it was a good test on some of the rolling hills.

     

    I'm still not seeing much that says I'm in PR shape just yet. Still a long way to go to CIM. Next big test will be a half marathon in 3 weeks. JT - can you put me down for the Suffolk Half Marathon on 10/24? My workouts say I'm in 1:16:30 shape, but I have to set a PR goal, so put me down for 1:15:27. I'll be happy with sub 1:16 though.

     

    Weekly for period: From: 09/20/2021 To 09/26/2021

    Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
    in ft
    09/20 Afternoon Run 10.33 16.62 01:22:47 08:01 04:59 413
    09/21 1E + 3T (5:47) + 10E + 2T (6:04) + 2E 18.01 28.97 02:07:52 07:06 04:25 722
    09/22 Afternoon Run 6.76 10.88 00:57:47 08:33 05:19 171
    09/23 148 TDP post equinox is criminal 10.30 16.57 01:22:21 08:00 04:58 413
    09/24 Lunch Run 10.41 16.76 01:22:11 07:54 04:54 410
    09/25 Progression 20.86 33.57 02:32:35 07:19 04:33 961

    Total distance: 76.68mi

    5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:00 (10/21)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

     

    Next Race: Unknown 

    jhudak55


      DW: Very nice long run. I think I just missed you as Flavio noted on Strava. I'm also curious what elite at Indy entails. I know I qualified for one of the faster corrals based on a half I ran last fall.

       

      JMac: 77 miles in 6 days of singles is impressive! What is the theory between the 10 miles in between tempo reps on your Tuesday workout. I know you do a lot of JD workouts, which I'm not as familiar with.

       

      Cal: Really nice job on the 5k. That was very close to a PR, correct?

       

      JT: Solid week considering the long days and lack of sleep. Good call bailing on the 5x1.

       

      Flavio: Hopefully the GI issues clear up, but it sounds like you are already on the right track.

       

      My week:

      30.5 miles

      M, T, W: Off

      T: 3 miles easy (8:15)

      F: 5.2 miles easy (8:09)

      S: 7.5 miles easy (8:22)

      S: 14.8 mile long run (7:54)

       

      I've had a rough time running wise the last two weeks. On the 15th I ran a 7 mile tempo then a 4 mile recovery double in the afternoon. This was too much and I felt some soreness on the inside of my left knee. The following day I ran a very easy 10 miles which seemed to worsen the swelling and soreness. After another easy run last Saturday, I decided to take a couple days without running to let everything heal up. I got back to running after 4 days and the knee felt alright, but the outside of my knee and hip now is very sore likely due to some overcompensation.

       

      All of this is very frustrating. I'm at a weird point, 6 weeks out from a goal race and supposed to be running my biggest mileage and workouts, but instead I'm at about 30 MPW. I have a half scheduled on 10/10 which I really want to run, but now I'm debating whether I should actually run that. I don't know if I should just try and push through this stuff or really prioritize additional recovery.

      CalBears


        DW: Very nice long run. I think I just missed you as Flavio noted on Strava. I'm also curious what elite at Indy entails. I know I qualified for one of the faster corrals based on a half I ran last fall.

         

        JMac: 77 miles in 6 days of singles is impressive! What is the theory between the 10 miles in between tempo reps on your Tuesday workout. I know you do a lot of JD workouts, which I'm not as familiar with.

         

        Cal: Really nice job on the 5k. That was very close to a PR, correct?

         

        JT: Solid week considering the long days and lack of sleep. Good call bailing on the 5x1.

         

        Flavio: Hopefully the GI issues clear up, but it sounds like you are already on the right track.

         

        My week:

        30.5 miles

        M, T, W: Off

        T: 3 miles easy (8:15)

        F: 5.2 miles easy (8:09)

        S: 7.5 miles easy (8:22)

        S: 14.8 mile long run (7:54)

         

        I've had a rough time running wise the last two weeks. On the 15th I ran a 7 mile tempo then a 4 mile recovery double in the afternoon. This was too much and I felt some soreness on the inside of my left knee. The following day I ran a very easy 10 miles which seemed to worsen the swelling and soreness. After another easy run last Saturday, I decided to take a couple days without running to let everything heal up. I got back to running after 4 days and the knee felt alright, but the outside of my knee and hip now is very sore likely due to some overcompensation.

         

        All of this is very frustrating. I'm at a weird point, 6 weeks out from a goal race and supposed to be running my biggest mileage and workouts, but instead I'm at about 30 MPW. I have a half scheduled on 10/10 which I really want to run, but now I'm debating whether I should actually run that. I don't know if I should just try and push through this stuff or really prioritize additional recovery.

         

        My 5K PR is 18:23, ran at the time I was at the peak of my running form - so, yes, 18:42 is very close considering my marathon shape is not where it was at that time.

         

        As for your issue - yep, that happens all the time - I know plenty of fast people who cannot make it to a race - time after time after time. Getting to a race healthy is also a skill. Not throwing any stones to you, but there might be some signals before it got really bad? It's totally an art - determining when to slow or shut down. Right now you do not need to panic - take a day off, run next day - slowly, if you feel the pain, slow down more, if there is still pain - stop and walk. Repeat the same. You might cancel your sub 3 goal for this cycle (not necessarily, but possible), but your task is to minimize time off and minimize the damage you might do to your knee/hip. Easy running, slow running, will still keep you fit and will help to get back quicker. It's like a Foundation series (Apple TV) - if you do it right, you can get back in 2 weeks instead of 4 months Smile. Btw, 8:06 pace is way way too quick - it's not easy, your mind can call it easy but I do not think in this situation you should operate in old terms.

         

        JTR - ha-ha - I don't know why I had that 5:55 in my signature, my PR is faster than I ran yesterday, so, the PR pace was actually 5:48, but still - I feel good about the result.

         

        JMac - those teenager were definitely from some high school running Team - they were pretty conservative from the start but that still allowed them to make 30 meters on me, I caught them by half a mile mark and I think that surprised them and they decided to keep up with me - it required some faster pace on their part and I think, at the end, my attempt to race them helped them to have a better finish time. Actually, I think I was lucky to have them in my wave as most of other waves before mine had really small kids and slower runners.

        paces PRs - 5K - 5:48  /  10K - 6:05  /  HM - 6:14  /  FM - 6:26 per mile

        JMac11


        Milkman

           

          My 5K PR is 18:23, ran at the time I was at the peak of my running form - so, yes, 18:42 is very close considering my marathon shape is not where it was at that time.

           

          .

          .

          .

           

           

          JTR - ha-ha - I don't know why I had that 5:55 in my signature, my PR is faster than I ran yesterday, so, the PR pace was actually 5:48, but still - I feel good about the result.

           

           

          Cal - 18:23 pace is 5:55, what am I missing?

           

          Jhud - what are you doing to deal with the knee? My go to is always 4 pronged: strengthening, massage, heat, taping. Rest almost never works for me. In an odd way, big runs often get rid of my aches and pains. I've had a small glute issue that was so sore this week I was waking up in the middle of the night every 2 hours in pain as I turned over. You know what fixed it? My 21 mile run. Told me it was just some nonsense trigger point issue. Not saying that you should run through it, but I also use 2 other factors to determine if I'll run: pain scale, and limping. If I have to limp to avoid the pain for more than the first few steps of a run, I shut it down. However, the more important thing I watch is the pain scale. Anything that hits 3 out of 10 after a mile warm up also means it's time to shut it down.

           

          For JD - he does a lot of work where the idea is to really tire your legs out before starting LT work. It's trying to mimic late marathon fatigue, without having to do some crazy 22 mile long run with the last 10 at MP (a workout I've always thought was a bit silly even though I know it's tried and true for a lot of people). Sometimes it's a long warmup followed by cruise intervals (a workout I'll try tomorrow), but other times it's to tire your legs out a bit first with some LT work, then hit the easy stuff for a long time. It's like doing a long run, without the damaging impacts on your legs, because you hit them hard with LT work first.

          5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:00 (10/21)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

           

          Next Race: Unknown 

          CalBears


             Cal - 18:23 pace is 5:55, what am I missing?

             

            You are not missing anything - if you've ran 3.1 miles in 18:23, then yes, the pace is 5:55. But if you ran 3.16, like I did, then the pace is 3:48(49). So, I compare my pace in two races - in this case 5:48 and 5:55. Or you can compare times - 18:23 and 18:42 - doesn't matter really. The more positive thing is - I ran 18:23 at 50 yo, which gave me 78.46% of AG ranking, and the 18:42 I ran yesterday, 6 years later, gave me 81.05%. I know you guys do not care about AG, but so I would too, when I were 35, but I am not 35 anymore, so, I should find incentives somewhere, somehow Smile

             

            Jhud - I guess, you have to find your own way of treating issues you experience. Opposite to JMac, running would be the worst thing for me in a sense of extending recovery from upcoming injury. I tried that few times, running through things, never ended good. Two times I skipped goal marathons were the times I tried to run through the issues. But one time, when I was injured, I totally stopped all the workouts and all I did - ran at as slow pace as to allow me not to feel my hurting hamstring. There were runs at 11 and 12 minutes pace - but I ran a lot, 100+ miles, very slow. For more than 2 months, I felt recovered two or three weeks before marathon and was able to hit few workouts - mostly at MP effort. And I ran CIM at 2:51:16 - my PR at that time was 2:50:56 (from Boston, btw, not from CIM Smile.

             

            But again, I guess you will have to find out what works for you (because if I do what JMac suggests, I would never race another marathon Smile

            paces PRs - 5K - 5:48  /  10K - 6:05  /  HM - 6:14  /  FM - 6:26 per mile

            Andres1045


              You are not missing anything - if you've ran 3.1 miles in 18:23, then yes, the pace is 5:55. But if you ran 3.16, like I did, then the pace is 3:48(49). So, I compare my pace in two races - in this case 5:48 and 5:55. Or you can compare times - 18:23 and 18:42 - doesn't matter really. The more positive thing is - I ran 18:23 at 50 yo, which gave me 78.46% of AG ranking, and the 18:42 I ran yesterday, 6 years later, gave me 81.05%. I know you guys do not care about AG, but so I would too, when I were 35, but I am not 35 anymore, so, I should find incentives somewhere, somehow Smile

              Not to revive a disagreement from two years ago, but at least my position wasn't that factoring age isn't relevant. I find your 18:42 at 56 to be more impressive than your 18:23 at 50. And even more impressive than JMac's 16:37. What irked me was the idea that your 18:42 today proves that you could have run faster than 16:37 at JMac's age had you just tried. Or I think back two years ago it was the thought that your 2:47 at age 47 or 48 proved you could have run faster than 2:36 in your 30s.

              Upcoming races: Boston

              Marby


                Cal: Congrats on the race, great sign following those big weeks. Going easy after that discomfort you had seems to have freshened you up nicely.

                 

                DW:  Nice week, you really got moving at the end of that tempo. I listened to that Juno Reactor album from one yours last week. It sent me time travelling to Anjuna beach 30 years ago.

                 

                Flavio:  Trust the taper and get ready to let her rip. I wear a tube thing on most runs. Got two of them, actually. One came with a 500ml soft flask and has countless compartments for stashing stuff. Light as, I forget it’s there.

                 

                JTR: Happy taper, hope the other stressors get reduced as much or more than the physical.

                 

                Mk885: Hi, love the overall goal of running for another few decades.

                 

                JMac: Good to see the legs came good for that progression

                 

                JHud: Listen carefully to your body and have an alt plan for the half if you’re not quite there, like running but not racing.

                 

                An ordinary sort of week for me. Tuesday was 5x1mi again, this week a bit faster, some will be happy to hear after your comments. I couldn’t get recovered enough for my session on Thu and bailed on it when it felt certain to be a shocker.
                My marathon is now rescheduled for 12/12… maybe.
                My team lost the final, the opponent was just too good on the day and had been all year to be fair.

                 

                09/20/2021 To 09/26/2021

                Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
                in ft
                09/20 Hunts 4.37 7.03 00:35:17 08:04 05:01 253
                09/21 Flea 9.40 15.12 01:10:13 07:28 04:39 240
                09/22 Naughty 5.00 8.04 00:41:22 08:16 05:09 203
                09/23 Nator 7.67 12.35 01:04:49 08:27 05:15 259
                09/24 Bay 10.01 16.10 01:25:59 08:35 05:20 531
                09/25 Bonti 8.71 14.02 01:13:56 08:29 05:16 207
                09/26 Jean Cunningham 1935-2021 19.07 30.68 02:28:41 07:48 04:51 801

                Total distance: 64.22mi

                10K 41:35 (2016), Half 1:27:01 (2015) Marathon 3:02:48 (2015)

                JTReeves


                  without having to do some crazy 22 mile long run with the last 10 at MP (a workout I've always thought was a bit silly even though I know it's tried and true for a lot of people). 

                   

                  Ok, now I know that's a jab at me!  I'll have you know sir I did none of those this cycle, and actually only ran 4 x 20 milers and 2 x 22 milers, with most of the other long runs 18 milers. Definitely restrained myself in that regard this time around.

                   

                  BTW, I also like the Pfitzy-style progression runs; they're a nice low-key way to get some quality in a long run.

                   

                  jhudak: Welcome back; I suspected something was up when you disappeared. I agree with Cal that it's kind of an art to know your body and how to best deal with an injury; balancing healing and maintaining running fitness. If you can manage what Cal did a couple weeks ago, just running very slowly until you are healed, that may be a good way to go. If running aggravates it, then cross-training is an option to at least maintain some aerobic fitness.

                   

                  I also agree with JMac on the strengthening aspect, especially for long term prevention. I can't remember if you do any strength work, but if not I'd highly recommend it for general injury prevention. Squats, deadlifts, hip ab/adductor band exercises; those are the key things, and maybe some ab work. Upper body work is a waste of time. 

                   

                  Marby: Solid week. I hope your race doesn't creep out any further into December.

                  2:52:16 (2018)

                  flavio1980


                  Intl. correspondent

                    Jmac - Yeah, I was supposed to be running these workouts a few weeks ago but then got injured.

                    So the coach had to adjust and prepare me again to run them.

                    I’m glad I’ve gotten at least one, which is more than zero.

                     

                    JHud - the exact same thing happened to me, 6 or 7 weeks out. Recover your health first, forget about that half race. 

                    Run a 3k time trial if you need an aerobic gauge. Most of all, don't panic, try to rest as much as possible, sleep more, take a nap during the day. Let the body heal.

                    I see Jmac is offering advice, do note he weighs 100lbs though 😂

                    I kid I kid, he offers very good advice.

                     

                    Marby - ordinary week is the best kind.

                    PRs: 1500 4:51 2019 - 5K 17:56 2021 HM 1:21:59 2021

                    Up next: Rest and recover

                    Tool to generate Strava weekly

                    Running Problem


                    Problem Child

                      Cal Congratulations on the race. Just like JMac said I think it's amazing those kids backed off so early. I really struggle with it and might have to do a race to remember what it feels like. Even in speed workouts I go out too fast. 5:55/mi is CRAZY fast for anyone in my mind. IF this isn't PR shape I'm not sure what you'd be looking for. If it isn't CIM it would be an upcoming race.

                       

                      JHud In 2020 when I had an achilles pain flaring up it would go away after a few miles, then come back and eventually went away. I think for me, like JMac said running helped, to a point. I pushed through a pain at 4 miles to see if it went away, and found out it came back at 8 miles. I wasn't smart, so I did it as an out and back and the turn around was mile 5 so the risk of a 5 mile jog/walk home was real. I'd see how the knee feels after this weekend and make a decision then.

                       

                      JT 22 mile long runs? ew.

                       

                       

                      I'm debating a 10k on October 3. I'll have to discuss it with the wife, and if I run it I'll most likely removed the Thursday 8 mile Marathon paced run for just another 8-10 miler. This would be a PR attempt because my PR is apparently 42Tight lippedx. I would be using this race to determine marathon training paces/goals moving forward. Right now I think a 3:07 is in the cards on the right day, and with a lot of "CIM Magic" I could get it under a 3:05, but I'm not sure how other than to run a faster M pace in training. Based off my Memorial Day 5k (19:34) I could do sub 41. Training paces for speed work are all 5k/10k based, the speed work ends pretty much next week or the following week, and M pace or "10 seconds faster than M pace" workouts begin. I've accepted I'll not be a sub 3 finisher this year and my best is probably a BQ-90 seconds. Enough to be happy with the training, and slow enough to need another marathon for a 2023 entry.

                       

                      My week:

                      Just got what I could. Monday I didn't want to run for some reason. Probably work, but also mentally depressed. I tried to make up for it later in the week and I think it helped me get through speed work this week. I've settled into a 7:10/mi marathon pace and it seems comfortably hard. Same 7 miler I did last week felt easier on mile 7. Last week it was all I could do to not quit, and this week it seemed like just another mile.

                      Friday a friend who is doing the Hanson's plan, but modified to fit his schedule, asked why I was trying to get 30 miles in 3 days. I told him it's just running and if I ran the 6 he said the book called for I'd go home and sit around doing nothing so why not just keep running. Sunday I was hoping for a 12 miler, but woke up late. Nothing seems to be bothering me right now and the legs don't seem to be the limiting factor in my speed. When I finish workouts it feels like my aerobic base is being worked harder than my physical leg strength.

                       

                       

                      Weekly for period: From: 09/20/2021 To 09/26/2021

                      Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
                      in ft
                      09/21 That time there is too many people doing too much bullshit causing too much grief. 10.26 16.51 01:26:33 08:26 05:15 131
                      09/21 A week off wasnt smart. 0.00 0.00 00:31:29 00:00 00:00 0
                      09/22 That time I saw it coming and knew they weren’t going to change their mind. 7.60 12.23 01:01:40 08:07 05:03 354
                      09/23 That time it kind of looks like something resembling marathon shape. 10.28 16.54 01:19:00 07:41 04:47 141
                      09/24 That time I did it perfectly 10.01 16.11 01:26:55 08:41 05:24 82
                      09/25 That time it was enjoyably cold. 14.65 23.56 02:02:46 08:23 05:13 456
                      09/26 That time I saw a Rat Fink 10.86 17.47 01:31:30 08:26 05:14 640

                      Total distance: 63.66mi

                      Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                      VDOT 51

                      5k19:35 | Marathon 2:59:10

                      CalBears


                        Andres - you do not need to argue with me, if you want you can talk to data people who created those AG calculators Smile. And of course, it doesn't mean I could run 16:37 at JMac's age - because I would probably not train like he is at that age - that would be a good reason Smile. We cannot go back in time and check that, so, I guess, we have to wait for 20 years and see if JMac will be able to run 18:42. I bet he would be one fat dude by that age (he hates running as I remember and wanted to retire right after CIM Smile - so, he will be bragging when he is 56 that if he trains properly, he would beat 18:42 handsomely... So... What is the way to resolve that "eternal" problem? Correct - AG Calculators, the only more or less reliable instrument - like it or not...

                         

                        Marby - I am glad that "names" saga finished and now we can hope for getting more detailed description of your workouts instead of reading names of people we hear for the first and, probably, for the last time Smile Nice Long Run - for some reason I can't get a good avg pace on those this cycle.

                         

                        RP - yes, the 5K pace surprised me a bit, but it is still far away from the shape I was in 2015 - just the whole picture of all the runs then - faster pace, higher mileage, lower heart rate - man, that was magic... But you are right too - I am in a PR shape - probably the best one since early 2017 (or that's what I think Smile.

                         

                        Your week looks like a really good training week. The only thing I would add is a little bit more of optimism and positivity. I would strongly recommend get off that covid thread - that is toxic stuff - for you and everybody. Sleep, wake up, kiss your family, drink coffee, run, enjoy the sun and peace - in no particular order. Life is freaking short and fragile (I am a part of my University message group and it starts getting sad more and more with more years go by).

                        paces PRs - 5K - 5:48  /  10K - 6:05  /  HM - 6:14  /  FM - 6:26 per mile

                        Running Problem


                        Problem Child

                          Cal ah that thread is such a joke. I'm shocked it's been allowed to go as long as it has. After the 3x1 mile workout today I have some confidence for a 10k. I did this same workout as part of CIM 2019 training. Today was 6:19, 6:18, 6:17 with a 6:20 goal. In 2019 I did 6:18, 6:19, 6:23 with temps 30 degrees warmer. It makes me feel like CIM could be really great if I keep putting in the work, and maybe I am holding myself back just a tad bit. I've been doing 7:10/mi marathon paced runs and they're "comfortable hard" so I don't want t o just start going faster because it predicts a specific time, but if I'm actually ready based on some real data I see no reason to hold back.

                           

                           

                          The Daniels Table spreadsheet puts me at a 6:34/mi (4:05/km) 10k pace using my 19:34 5k which is what I've used for training. I think I'll try for at least this, and maybe see if I can hold 6:30/mi later in the race. Just easy miles for the rest of this week, and maybe not a total of 70 miles this week since I now have a race. It's been a LONG time since I've actually been in an organized race locally. March was a semi organized 5k, and the one I did on memorial day was really small so I had enough to get the mentality back. Now I need to see if that still holds because I expect to have more competition. I'm still shocked the race is in person. I'm expecting masks to be 50/50.

                          Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                          VDOT 51

                          5k19:35 | Marathon 2:59:10

                          jhudak55


                            I appreciate all of the comments.

                             

                            Cal: Yeah. I'm working on keeping easy stuff a lot easier. I got a bit carried away with the cooler temperatures, but need to make sure I'm not overdoing it.

                             

                            JMac: Currently I'm just doing bodyweight stuff for strength, but have some bands I plan on incorporating as well. I don't consistently do any injury prevention work. That is something I have to get much better about.

                             

                            JT: The healing vs maintaining fitness is the hardest part for me. It is tough to decipher whether I'm whimping out by not running or doing the right thing to allow for recovery.

                            JMac11


                            Milkman

                               

                              Ok, now I know that's a jab at me!  I'll have you know sir I did none of those this cycle, and actually only ran 4 x 20 milers and 2 x 22 milers, with most of the other long runs 18 milers. Definitely restrained myself in that regard this time around.

                               

                               

                              There's a reason I said you're going to PR this cycle 

                               

                              Cal - I'm probably one of the more vocal opponents of AG, but the way you described it is exactly what it should be used for and I'm glad you're finding motivation that way! I think I will retire and become a fatso not because I don't agree with AG, but rather I think there's only so many years you can try to be achieving peak performance. I know there are people out there who go for a very long time, but for me, it feels like there is a 7-10 year window where you can keep improving (absolutely or relatively) before you lose the fire.

                               

                              RP - there is plenty of time until CIM. Your fitness will grow exponentially. Don't be so down on it yet. If it was late October, different story.

                               

                              Marby - You guys and the NZ folks not knowing when races are happening: just brutal. Hard to keep the motivation up. I know I lost a lot of it in March 2020.

                               

                              Flavio - I would never question you as the one and only strength man. I just said you should strengthen, not what to do! I emailed my PT actually to get a good workout regimen at home as he moved cities.

                               

                              JHUD - forgot to ask, are you on Strava? I don't think I follow you (and if you follow me already, apologies!)

                              5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:00 (10/21)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

                               

                              Next Race: Unknown 

                              darkwave


                              Mother of Cats

                                 

                                 

                                Cal - I'm probably one of the more vocal opponents of AG, but the way you described it is exactly what it should be used for and I'm glad you're finding motivation that way! I think I will retire and become a fatso not because I don't agree with AG, but rather I think there's only so many years you can try to be achieving peak performance. I know there are people out there who go for a very long time, but for me, it feels like there is a 7-10 year window where you can keep improving (absolutely or relatively) before you lose the fire.

                                 

                                Age grading also gets depressing, just because if you start crunching numbers, you realize just how high an age grade your PRs from a few years ago would be....

                                 

                                You guys asked about elite entry at Indy - there it's the ability to put out bottles on course (for marathoners), free entry, and a VIP place for pre- and post race.  Usually elite status also has its own bag check, which is really nice.

                                 

                                I'm weighing dropping down to the half at Indy, and just doing both the Columbus half and the Indy half, then a turkey trot, and then calling it a season.  I'm the anti-JTReeves in terms of long runs, but that usually works for me because I'm entering a marathon cycle from a higher level of general fitness.  Here, I think I just need more time in the training cycle to get ready to run a good marathon - time I don't have.  Unless I swap to a marathon that is 2 weeks later (but I really want to run Indy). 

                                 

                                Sad thing too: I'm basically coasting into elite status at Indy and Columbus based on my times from 2-3 years ago.  So this may be my last year to enjoy some perks.

                                 

                                 

                                JHudak - did you do any cross training during your injury issue?  I didn't see any, and you didn't mention any, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen.  If you cross-trained, that can cover for a lot.

                                Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                                 

                                And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.