2021 Sub 3:00 Marathon Thread (Read 423 times)

jhudak55


     

    I have made no such promise.

     

    Courses are measured/certified by measuring wheel - which is measuring the length of the surface of the running route - i.e. the hypotenuse.

     

    (I suspect that in practicality, the slope of even what we consider to be a steep downhill is so minimal that there is negligible difference between the hypotenuse and the base leg)

     

    Confirmed. If you equate the total elevation loss (of Cal's marathon, from Strava) as the AC leg, the BC leg is 26.18 miles.

     

    However, this doesn't make much sense to me because technically only perfectly flat courses would be "not short". Any change in slope would result in the measurement being off. I feel like I'm being trolled...

    darkwave


    Mother of Cats

      Yup.  Your race at Indy, and perhaps some of CK's races in Oklahoma (plus any track races) are the only legitimate performances this year.  Everything else was short.

      Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

       

      And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.


      Elite Jogger

         

         

        Mikkey: I just took a look at your training log: how the hell did you get in shape so fast?! I'm jealous. Great to see those big LRs. I think you're sandbagging big time with that goal for Valencia. 

         

         

        Aww thanks!  Considering I could barely walk for 3 months during the summer I’m happy to be running another marathon again!  I’m not going to get too greedy as I’ve only run about 900 miles this year...but I’ll give you an honest goal time the week before the race. 👍  And I’m pleased to see that you and darkwave are putting in some decent runs again. 👍

         

        Cal - I could never run that race as I’m scared of heights...I’d be petrified looking down at the start line!  Seriously though that must be a confidence booster for CIM. 👍

        5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

        CommanderKeen


        Aspiring Hobby Jogger

          Cal - You're insane! Congrats on Big Bear.
          Also, accidents like that (or the website just eating posts) are why I type all this out in notepad and copy/paste!


          DWave - Good to see you had a pretty solid week, and I'm glad there weren't any negative findings.
          I appreciate geometry-based jokes.


          JT - That's a pretty big week on only 6 runs, nice. No specific target for CIM yet - I'll let you know when I do later on after conferring with my coach.

           

          Thanks, everyone!

           


          I didn't get all the mileage I wanted last week (close to 14 miles short in total) due to the race and mostly interference around DD1's soccer tournament (which they won!), but I'm super happy with it overall with a shiny new 10k PR!
          The race was a test run for a pair of ASICS Metaspeed Sky, and I must say that I LOVE those shoes and they're likely what I'll wear for CIM.

           

          Weekly for period: From: 11/08/2021 To 11/14/2021

          Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
          in ft
          11/08 1 great horned owl & 1 barn owl 12.51 20.12 01:43:46 08:18 05:09 505
          11/08 1 box turtle 5.50 8.85 00:48:36 08:50 05:29 246
          11/09 Sticky atmospherics 11.05 17.79 01:40:17 09:05 05:38 436
          11/10 6x 5 min HMe 12.75 20.52 01:41:19 07:57 04:56 410
          11/10 Who knew hedge trimmers could be so amusing? - Yorkshire 4.25 6.84 00:34:41 08:10 05:04 0
          11/11 3 great horned owls, 2 deer (2 strides), & 1 heron 10.51 16.90 01:32:52 08:50 05:30 348
          11/12 1 barn owl & plenty of talkative coyotes 10.05 16.18 01:27:28 08:42 05:24 489
          11/12 Taking deliveries. Of fitness. - Watopia 5.06 8.14 00:41:24 08:11 05:05 0
          11/13 Campus tour 4.71 7.57 00:38:22 08:09 05:04 141
          11/13 Holiday Hustle 10k 6.22 10.01 00:37:57 06:06 03:47 141
          11/13 Winding down a tad 3.45 5.55 00:31:05 09:01 05:36 98
          11/14 To soccer I go! 5.05 8.13 00:45:53 09:05 05:39 249

          Total distance: 91.11mi

          5k: 18:14 11/21 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:24:16 11/19 │ M: 3:04:13 11/18

           

          Upcoming Races:

           

          12/4 - Tucson Marathon?

          12/5 - California International Marathon

          CalBears


            Keen - congrats again on your 10K PR! I agree with JTR - with this new time and your weekly mileage you are in great shape to go sub 2:55, imho. The year I had almost identical PR in 10K (37:47 in 2014), I ran CIM several months later in 2:51. And I think I ran similar mileage, maybe a little less on average. But there is a difference though - by then I already ran sub 3 time 5 times. So, I had no psychological barrier (if it exists Smile. On the other side - you are much younger. so, you can go straight for a faster time. I am opposite of JMac though - I will take few little PRs instead of one huge one. rovatti called me Bubka for doing that - I ran 9 marathons, each faster than previous one before breaking the out of it. Anyway, I think you are bound for a great time and it can definitely happen this year, just do not relax too soon (but do not fret too much Smile

             

            JTR - great mileage week. Also glad you are running conservative paces. Lately I started to think again that mileage takes precedent over great speedy workouts with less mileage (of course combining both makes it even better but I have difficult time to do both now).

             

            DW - hope you found/find a great doctor who will help you in pinpointing the problem(s).

             

            Thanks for all kind words re my Saturday's marathon. I didn't mention it because I didn't consider it as a race for a time. Of course I wanted to run it as fast as possible, but mostly I ran it out of curiosity. I ran enough trail races and enough runs to (and from) my favorite Mt Diablo summit to understand what is so different about running a downhill race. So, I just wanted to try.

             

            It was a good experience. Judging by results of some runners whom I know and who ran this race, if you run it with the same effort as a flatter race, you can expect 10-15 minutes improvement over your recent race time. Not guaranteed, of course, but if you don't blow up, you can hope for that kind of better time.

             

            As always, running a marathon is always a challenge, whatever course is (unless you run it for site seeing). If you run it for time, then it's definitely challenging. When you think about this course and its 5000ft descent, you think, oh, no problem. But there are/were a few.

             

            1st - miles 2 to 9 are rolling hills. You can only kind of see one of the hills on the elevation map (and that one is steeper and longer than Boston's Heartbreak hill), but in reality it goes up and down, up and down. Breaks your rhythm. I was constantly passed by many runners on the uphills, but was gaining back on the downhill parts. By mile 9 I was barely on sub 3 pace - my avg pace was 6:47.

             

            2nd - after mile 9 it is all downhill (except flat mile 12 to 13) - felt great as I was ready for it (I did 3 11 miles road downhill runs from Mt Diablo to prepare for this race), but still, by mile 20-21, my cadence was not enough to continue a natural type of running, my quads still started to hurt and because of that I have to break a little bit, naturally, because you have to do that just not to fall. Running that much downhill still breaks your quads, even if you trained for this - at least it had that impact for me.

             

            3rd - it was kind of hot, really. Even when we started from 7000ft high, even then it felt totally fine in a t-shirt. But by mile 17-18, when we were out in the direct sun, the high temps became pretty noticeable, but especially the direct sun. By finish time forecast was sying 76oF, but I was told it was 80+ at 9am and with no shade it was probably even hotter. Mid November I would expect something cooler, even for South California.

             

            Other than that, it was fun. Pretty good organization, luxury buses to the top, good course marking. I would say there were way too few volunteers at the aid stations, especially at the beginning, when I missed drink at one of the station and then at the next one I have to stop to have a drink (because the only volunteer serving Bodyarmor drink was busy with other runners). Pretty scarce food selection at the finish, not terrible, but very limited and controlled Smile. But overall still pretty uneventful. I was thinking at breaking my PR at some point before the race (do not worry Mikkey - I would never claim it as a PR) - but  after first 9 miles I knew there is no way I could do that. My finish time was 2:50:13 and it told me that I am still on that border between sub 3 and over sub 3 for a flatter marathon. So, I think I will just go for sub 3 at CIM - or at least I will go for sub 3 pace until mile 18 or so.

             

            For all people who still think these downhill races are the easy ones - I urge you to try - just like I urge all the people who think CIM is a cheater's course to try it and discover a beauty of running an undulated course, not the course they imagine in their heads Smile The same was here, at Big Bear - there is always something you have to experience before starting to bash it Smile

             

            Oh... I believe my finish time allows me to apply for Berlin's marathon guaranteed entry, avoiding lottery. They require a certified course time, but I checked USA TF and it is certified. I know Mikkey won't be able to that race - so, I have time to think until December 6th.

            paces PRs - 5K - 5:48  /  10K - 6:05  /  HM - 6:14  /  FM - 6:26 per mile


            Elite Jogger

               

              Oh... I believe my finish time allows me to apply for Berlin's marathon guaranteed entry, avoiding lottery. They require a certified course time, but I checked USA TF and it is certified. I know Mikkey won't be able to that race - so, I have time to think until December 6th.

               

              That’s great that you qualified for Berlin!  But I’d never run it again even if I qualified...it’s not a race I particularly enjoyed compared to other destination races.

              5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

              Marby


                Jmac:  I’m sorry, that’s a bitter pill.

                 

                Cal: NZ course or no, it sounds far from easy, that’s a great run and experience to have had.  You are going to have quads of steel from all this hill work and likely surprise yourself at CIM.

                 

                Keen:  Cracking 10k, great pacing, congratulations!!!

                 

                DW: Good news there was no news from the neuro.  Do you supplement Magnesium? Sounds like a that causes all sorts or weird stuff if deficient.

                 

                JTR: Is only 71 really enough for you to start showing your face 

                 

                Sub 1:30:  Enjoy the cricket over there? It’s hard to like our team even as an Aussie, winning helps a bit. Then again I’d trade a dozen T20’s for one Test champ.

                 

                Mikkey: That performance by Stokes in the 50/50 WC final was nothing compared to what he did to level the 2019 Ashes series, that was one of the most devastating things I have witnessed. The Invincible sounds interesting, keen to hear how you find them.

                 

                The first part of my week was easy going after the time trial.  Finished by bagging another decent long run on Sunday and 102km/63mi for the week.

                10K 41:35 (2016), Half 1:27:01 (2015) Marathon 3:02:48 (2015)

                CommanderKeen


                Aspiring Hobby Jogger

                  Holiday Hustle 10k Race Report


                  For many months now my coach has had a pre-CIM 10k tune-up on my schedule and it was quite fortunate that one of the top 10ks in the area did happen to fall on that weekend. My biggest worry was that they would cancel for covid, which this same group did cancel a 10k I had planned to run two months ago. If that happened this time I had it in my mind to either 1) run this course myself, or 2) cherry pick a super-flat 10k course across a dam at the edge of a local lake for a TT.


                  With no indication that the race would be cancelled I signed up the day before and showed up 90 minutes early to pick up my packet and get in a long warm-up. I set out do do a couple laps around the college campus to somewhat familiarize myself with the course, but I was on the path early enough that the route hadn't been marked, though I did see the kilometer marking signs.
                  The warm-up felt disappointingly like most of my runs earlier in the week - plodding and slow, though as I sped up in the last 1.5-2 miles I did feel a bit better, though certainly not "I'm going to crush this race" good.


                  "Nothing new on race day"
                  Bother that nonsense. 10 minutes before the race started I took off my warm-ups and traded my well-worn Escalantes for a pair of ASICS Metaspeed Skys that I had only previously put on for size. What better way to see if a pair of fancy shoes work for a race than to try them out in one?
                  I did a couple more strides in these (having already done 3 in the Altras) and WOW the difference in feel was immense. Light & bouncy like they wanted to go fast (more so than the Endorphin Pro) while at the same time without the wonky unstableness I felt when trying the OG Nike 4%.


                  I lined up as close to the front as I could while keeping behind those who were obviously faster than I am, but had an unfortunately large number of overly-confident middle school to high school kids in front of me.


                  The gun went off and so did we, nearly immediately making two very congested right hand turns. A short distance later and we turn off the roadway onto a running path, again very congested with kids. Things opened up a bit at this point, but I'm still having to weave around far more people than I want to as they were taking up random spots in the trail and not at all running the tangents along some gentle curves.

                  I hit the 1k mark in 3:58 - Oh, heck with that! This is quite a bit slower than I feel it should be given the effort I'm putting out, so I turn things up a bit. A short bit later (around the mile mark) I pass a girl who was at most 2 years older than my oldest daughter wearing a pair of Alpha Flys and get a bit of amusement out of this.

                   

                  Just prior to 2k I see a guy I've paced the local Hot Chocolate 15k with a couple times and he's a solid 250m ahead of me. I had thought he was about my speed, but this elicited a bit of a negative thought.

                   

                  I hit 2k in 3:41 and think "that km didn't feel near that fast, maybe the markers are off. Either way it means I'm on pace for my overly ambitious goal.

                   

                  Things are relative uneventful for a while as I continue to pass a few people here and there as we run through some rather scenic sections of the campus - wooded areas, past a small pond with an unsettling number of fish floating in it...

                  3k - 3:46
                  4k - 3:53
                  5k - 3:49 - 19:08 elapsed

                   

                  Things go smoothly through here as I continue to pass people, though a series of tight turns in a 200m stretch is less than ideal before the final ~200m stretch to the start/finish. In this home stretch a HS kid charges past me and I try giving him some encouragement (an oddly similar situation to the last 10k I ran) and prepare for traffic to really thin out as I go for my second 5k lap.


                  Starting the second lap I'm a little dismayed that I'm 8 seconds behind my goal pace, but I'm feeling better and better overall and know that I'm still on pace for a PR even if I do miss my goal. Up ahead there are two people within sight - the guy I've paced with who was maybe 30 seconds ahead and a young kid maybe 10 seconds behind him who I had thought was only running the 5k.


                  6k - 3:53
                  7k - 3:42

                   

                  This first km didn't feel nearly that slow and again the next didn't feel nearly that fast, so I'm pretty confident at this point that there's a misplaced marker. I've had nothing but open path ahead and have managed to pull to within ~10m of the kid in front of me, but have no recollection of seeing the other guy. Just after the 7k mark we started passing people who are walking or run/walking their race so we have a bit of weaving to do.

                   

                  8k - 3:43
                  9k - 3:48


                  I'm liking seeing these splits pass as I'm certainly feeling the effects of the effort by this point, but having that kid ahead of me helped as he was trucking along pretty well but also seemed to be working a bit harder than I was. I moved ahead of him just before the 9k marker.


                  A little more passing run/walkers and we get to the twisty, curvy 200m stretch and the teammates of the kid behind me are waiting there for him (some dressed as bananas) to cheer him on. Just after hitting the final straightaway the kid inches ahead of me (blasted youth speed!) and I catch sight of the other guy I've been trying to chase and he's not nearly so far ahead of me as I thought he would be.
                  The kid and I charge down the final straight (he just ahead of me) and I catch a glimpse of the clock - 38:50 - and think "I can still pull this off!" and manage to speed up just a little. Thankfully this final spurt doesn't last long as I'm seriously sucking wind.


                  10k - 3:43 - 37:55 chip


                  I can't remember being so gassed after a race before, which I take as a (somewhat painful) good sign. I catch my breath, grab a bottle of water, and go find the kid (also chip time of 37:55) to congratulate him on his race, then go find the guy I've paced with. Oddly he doesn't show in the results, but Strava has him with a 37:58 moving time.


                  Pacing guy and I chat for a bit and I find that he's also running CIM and also doesn't (yet) have a goal.


                  All in all I'm super-excited and happy for this result, especially given how slow I felt the week preceding it and that I took zero taper for it as well. I find myself wondering a bit how much lower I could take this result with a taper and perhaps fewer traffic issues early in the race given my current fitness, but more immediate matters are a turkey trot 5k (will be my first ever 5k with a bit of a meaningful taper ahead of it) and then CIM!

                  5k: 18:14 11/21 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:24:16 11/19 │ M: 3:04:13 11/18

                   

                  Upcoming Races:

                   

                  12/4 - Tucson Marathon?

                  12/5 - California International Marathon

                  Running Problem


                  Problem Child

                     

                     

                    To be complete, he ordered a set of MRIs - brain, cervical spine, and thoracic spine.  So I get those in early December.  In the meantime, he suggested that this might be orthopedic - something's off somewhere and my body is basically in defense mode as a result.  So I'm going to follow up on that.

                     

                    In the meantime, things do seem to be trending upwards, though I've still got a way to go.  This morning's long run was one of the best runs I've had in quite some time. 

                     

                    I would really like to know what is going on, though, and how to prevent a repeat.

                    So it's like you blew a fuse and an internal surge protector is preventing you from doing more damage to yourself, or like my truck has "limp mode" where the truck can only go 45 mph until the code is cleared/fixed. I guess "no news is good news" still applies. Have you considered yoga/acupuncture/dry needling/alternative western treaments (whatever that is) yet?

                     

                    cal I've always wondered with people who might have learned english as a second language, do your anger words come out in english, or the "native/first language" you learned? Typically I've been told "it's a mix" and I think the "really bad ones" are in a foreign language.

                     

                    Keen WE STILL AREN'T SEEING YOUR CIM GOAL BEING POSTED. In. Case. You. Missed. It. YOU SPECIFICALLY are required to put a time with a +/- 2 minutes for CIM. How else will sandbagging be verified?

                     

                    Downhill courses are easier because they're shorter. Didn't everyone know that? I always thought this is why everyone ran BOSTON CIM and had such amazing results, except for the one woman who authored a book about running marathons and was invited to CIM as a VIP in 2019.

                     

                     

                    My week:

                    OOF dah. Tried out the new Vaporfly Next% and they're pretty identical to the Zoom Fly from what I remember in 2019. They're fast and just FEEL fast. Almost like they're pushing me. The 10M was spur of the moment, and I changed the breathing to a 3-3 from a 2-2 during the run to see if it would help with a side stitch. The stitch held off until after mile 9, and at that point I knew I'd make it. Heck, I almost went 11+, but it was late at night, and I never told DW I was doing a workout. Thursday went well also with a 2x3 mile in some warmer weather. No speed shoes, and I picked this workout thinking "longer time at harder effort to help build up LT tolerance" vs a 3x2 mile workout. Oh and I was forced to stay home with both kids all week "due to covid 19 exposure" closing our daycare (horseshit if you ask me) so I was glad to get the workouts in. Saturday's long run ended with the traditional "overcaffinated bowel movement" I'd held for about 6 miles, and then I proceeded to roll my ankle at a trampoline park. Note to self: don't carry a 45 pound kid capable of walking down steps. Especially narrow ones with a steep drop. Ice/rest. The rest of the weekend, and yesterday was canceled due to having received my second COVID 19 shot, and that shit put me DOWN. muscle cramps, exhaustion, and "food poision like" symptoms for about 30 hours. Oh yeah, and a sore arm. THIS WEEK will be focused on M paced only, due to my youngest now having pink eye, and me just recovering from the shot. Not eating for 24-30 hours kind of sucks, and it sucks even more when on the border of marathon trianing. Obviously after my wonderful M paced workout I was thinking "well that's only 10 miles, not a full marathon." Counterinitiative since I've done this plan and it's worked every time with CIM.

                    Much less running overall than I wanted, and more "outdoor walking with toddlers." At this point the hay is starting to fill up the barn, and there wasn't a whole lot I could do. I got my three workouts in which I believe are more important overall than 70 mile weeks.

                    Weekly for period: From: 11/08/2021 To 11/14/2021

                    Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
                    in ft
                    11/08 Respect versus like. 1.04 1.67 00:26:06 25:06 15:38 23
                    11/08 That time the best plan is no plan at all. 13.73 22.09 01:38:58 07:12 04:29 154
                    11/09 Campaign season starts early 1.36 2.19 00:27:09 19:58 12:24 43
                    11/10 That time I did it for your birthday. 11.10 17.86 01:37:47 08:49 05:28 1440
                    11/11 Birthday party hangover 1.46 2.35 00:37:24 25:37 15:55 43
                    11/11 That time Strava needs to get with it 10.02 16.12 01:14:13 07:24 04:36 131
                    11/11 Start with a Hole in One, and 2 putt the rest. 0.38 0.61 00:30:57 81:27 50:44 0
                    11/12 Majestic trail running encounters. 1.94 3.12 00:55:07 28:25 17:40 62
                    11/13 That time I was over caffeinated. 16.11 25.91 02:17:41 08:33 05:19 141

                    Total distance: 57.13mi

                    Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                    VDOT 51

                    5k19:35 | Marathon 2:59:10

                    Running Problem


                    Problem Child

                       

                      Other than that, it was fun. Pretty good organization, luxury buses to the top, good course marking. I would say there were way too few volunteers at the aid stations, especially at the beginning, when I missed drink at one of the station and then at the next one I have to stop to have a drink (because the only volunteer serving Bodyarmor drink was busy with other runners). Pretty scarce food selection at the finish, not terrible, but very limited and controlled Smile. But overall still pretty uneventful.

                       

                      For all people who still think these downhill races are the easy ones - I urge you to try - just like I urge all the people who think CIM is a cheater's course to try it and discover a beauty of running an undulated course, not the course they imagine in their heads Smile The same was here, at Big Bear - there is always something you have to experience before starting to bash it Smile

                       

                      Oh... I believe my finish time allows me to apply for Berlin's marathon guaranteed entry, avoiding lottery. They require a certified course time, but I checked USA TF and it is certified. I know Mikkey won't be able to that race - so, I have time to think until December 6th.

                       

                      The bold highlights my "pre-covid 19" experiences/displeasures of Revel races. Nice bus ride, and good course markings, but they could focus a lot more effort on being a downhill FAST MARATHON. As for being easy, well no one really understands how a downhill marathon could be hard, until they run one. The heat/temperature change is probably the WORST for any race I've ever been in. 40 degrees hotter at the finish than the start. I don't know where they get their volunteers, and I think they just need to pay people, or offer some kind of financial support to local running organizations to obtain better volunteers.

                      Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                      VDOT 51

                      5k19:35 | Marathon 2:59:10

                      Running Problem


                      Problem Child

                        Keen Nice race report. I've always wondered why races start a 10k and a 5k together. I assume the kids with you at the start were doing the 5k. I've been smoked by plenty of middle school kids to know why ones I need to line up behind, so they can break up traffic ahead of me. Old man skills use other people to do more work. Any idea why the clock said 38:50 and you chipped at a much faster time? BLAZING FAST speed for this not being the target race, and you not doing a full taper for it. Also, glad you got the shoes you like and they obviously didn't give you any problems.

                        Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                        VDOT 51

                        5k19:35 | Marathon 2:59:10

                        SteveChCh


                        Hot Weather Complainer

                           

                          Sub 1:30:  Enjoy the cricket over there? It’s hard to like our team even as an Aussie, winning helps a bit. Then again I’d trade a dozen T20’s for one Test champ.

                           

                          Heh, I'm the same and have been anti-T20 from the start.  I'd still prefer we win but I woke up, checked my phone and saw we'd lost the toss which pretty much decides the match in this tournament, so I didn't bother watching.  Contrast with the test final when I was a zombie for a few days.  I listened to the episode of the Howie Games with Mitch Marsh on it a few months ago, and he seems like a decent bloke who's been through a fair bit along the way.

                          PB:  Christchurch 2016 1:29.25

                          Recent Races:    Selwyn Running Festival Half-Marathon 1:29:32  November 7, 2021

                          Race plan:  Christchurch Marathon April 10, 2022 (Target: Sub 3:20)

                          JMac11


                          Milkman

                            Keen - it's interesting you can't remember being so gassed after a race. How did your HR compare to other 10Ks? If it was higher than other races, and yet you didn't slow down at all, this may be a great learning for you: you can push harder than you think you can. Incredibly helpful for CIM when the going gets tough earlier than you want it to (which it will). Something we've talked about before with your training (your last MP run you couldn't get the effort to sub 3 yet your HR was too low).

                            5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:00 (10/21)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

                             

                            Next Race: Unknown 

                            CommanderKeen


                            Aspiring Hobby Jogger

                              RP - Thanks!
                              The winner of the 5k and 10k were both in their teens - 19 & 16:58 for 5k then 16 & 32:29 (!) for 10k. Combined starts work well so long as those kids actually seed themselves properly. It was pretty smooth for my September 10k, but considerably less so this past weekend.

                              No CIM goal yet  - I actually may not really set that until after the turkey trot.


                              JMac - This was actually only my 3rd 10k, and my HR was lower across the board for this one than my others. Average and max HR is highlighted below.

                               


                              Only one more real workout before CIM!

                              5k: 18:14 11/21 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:24:16 11/19 │ M: 3:04:13 11/18

                               

                              Upcoming Races:

                               

                              12/4 - Tucson Marathon?

                              12/5 - California International Marathon

                              Running Problem


                              Problem Child

                                RP -

                                No CIM goal yet  - I actually may not really set that until after the turkey trot.


                                JMac - This was actually only my 3rd 10k, and my HR was lower across the board for this one than my others. Average and max HR is highlighted below.

                                 


                                Only one more real workout before CIM!

                                 

                                I move we removed commanderkeen from the official record boards until he accepts a 2:57 or faster marathon target.

                                 

                                Interesting data on the watts. You tried the hardest on this 10k (obviously). You're heart rate was lower and pace was faster than one two months ago. I'd totally attribute it to fitness, and competition/shoes/keeping the racing edge sharp.

                                Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                                VDOT 51

                                5k19:35 | Marathon 2:59:10