Beginners and Beyond

Philadelphia Marathon RR - marathons are hard (and dumb) - pics added to page six (Read 105 times)


delicate flower

    Marathon #5 is done.

     

    Summary:

    3:18: xx goal

    3:23:27 finish

    15:15 PR

    OA 1131 / 10330 (top 11%)

    AG 133 / 850 (top 16%)

    The final 10K got me.

     

    What:

    The Philadelphia Marathon was pretty much my goal race for the year.  While I ran Vermont City back in May, I knew Philly would be the big one, coming off summer training and a year of strong running.  All of my training, my shorter races, and my focus was aimed at Philly.  DW ran the half marathon dressed in her Peter Pan costume, because why wouldn't you wear a Peter Pan costume if you had one?  This is her off season and she just jogged it for fun.

     

    Training:

    I followed my "run whatever” plan.  For the 16 weeks prior to taper, I averaged 62 MPW, with peak weeks of 71, 73, and 77 miles.  I had five runs of 20+ miles and ran them well.  One thing I did differently this time was adding a bunch of MP miles, something I hadn't done before.  I’m guessing up to 20% of my miles were at GMP.  I skipped more tempo and speed work than I should have.  I thought I trained well, but I really need more structure to my training if I want to keep improving.  I never really did feel great during my taper.  I felt good, but my legs never really felt springy even during the last week.  My legs still felt a little heavy right up until the last few days before the race.  I don’t know why.

     

    The prep:

    One mistake I made before my last marathon was not eating enough leading up to the race and I think it cost me.  So this time I started carbing up three days before the race with extra bagels, pasta, potatoes, rice, and electrolyte drinks.  The day before the race, I also made sure to eat lots of carbs.  French toast and eggs for lunch, Mediterranean dinner of couscous, potatoes, beef kabobs, empanadas.  I stuffed down more potatoes despite being full.  Race day breakfast was two packets of oatmeal, a banana, and coffee.  On race day, I felt fully nourished.  I got maybe five hours of on and off sleep the night before the race, which is about all I can really ask for.

     

    The race:

    Weather was perfect.  40 degrees at the start, high of 53, light wind, partly cloudy.  For race nutrition, I carried a handheld with Perpetuem and took a squirt every two miles.  I downed a Hammer Gel every 35 minutes, so I consumed six of them during the race.  I drank a cup of water at almost every station.  I got seeded in corral 1 and lined up in the back of it.  I saw a bunch of Boston Marathon shirts and jackets in corral 1.  WHERE'S MINE.  These were large corrals.  My goal was to keep a 7:35 pace from start to finish.  Of course they played the Rocky theme prior to the start.  I’d have been disappointed if they didn't.  Right at 7:00, we were off.  It took me about a minute to get to the starting line.

     

    First 10K:  7:25, 7:28, 7:22, 7:36, 7:41, 7:35

    I was feeling pretty good right from the start.  The course was crowded (30,000 runners), though not too packed.  There was plenty of room for me to move around if I needed to.  I was just settled in though and didn’t feel the need to bob and weave.  I started a little fast but dialed it back quickly.  Some guy asked me my goal and then said he’d pace off me.  Whatever…buy a watch, bro.  He ended up taking off when I settled down.  I passed him at mile 18 and never saw him after that.  The early miles are through the city and the crowd support was great.  It was so much fun running through so many spectators.  With the personalized bibs, I gave a thumbs up whenever someone shouted my name.  I didn't see much of the historic Philly landmarks between the crowds and my race focus.  Normally I love that stuff.

     

    Settling in:  7:08(??), 7:47, 7:20, 7:49, 7:35, 7:33, 7:40

    The first 10K is pretty flat, but some rolling hills pop up after that.  Mile 8 is pretty much all uphill through Drexel University.  Not steep, but it’s there and it’s long.  The biggest hill came in mile 10.  It’s about a half mile long and somewhat steep.  Much to my surprise, I was not passed a whole lot on it.  And to the lady that said “You’re almost at the top!”, 2/3 of the way is not almost at the top.  My legs first started to tire around miles 11-12.  I crossed the 13.1 split in 1:39, which is right where I wanted to be.  In my last marathon, I knew I was in deep trouble at the half split.  This time though I thought I might be able to hold on.  The half marathoners headed to the finish, and the full marathoners headed outbound.

     

    Miles 14-20:  7:31, 7:40, 7:37, 7:40, 8:06(?), 7:47, 7:55

    At this point, the biggest hills are done.  There were some rollers left, but nothing at all significant.  The second half is nice, running along the river, over some bridges, and through a crunchy town.  I was holding my pace pretty good but the hurt was starting to hurt.  I first felt it in my hips, then my calves.  No cramping, just hurting.  The 3:15 pace group caught me at mile 17.  I was very surprised to see them.  According to my Garmin, they should have been ahead of me.  I asked one of the guys if they were ahead or behind pace.  I could barely make out his grunted “Slightly ahead” response, and with that I knew he’d drop.  Poor bastard.  (I passed him at mile 20).  I briefly thought of trying to hang with them, but 9 miles is a long way to go so I let them go.  In hindsight, that was a wise decision.  At mile 20, the marathon started to feel like a marathon.

     

    The fade:  7:50, 7:54: 7:59, 8:16, 8:11, 8:05, 7:33 pace

    My pace started to slip at mile 20, hard as I tried not to let it.  The final 10K of my last marathon was a death march, dropping 90 sec/mile off pace.  Today I was just getting tired.  No wall, no bonk, no cramps…just tired and sore.  Mentally though, I was still in it and fully engaged.  I was fighting, battling, trying so hard for every minute, trying to will my legs to move faster.  My legs weren't up to the challenge, though I was pushing as hard as I could.  I spent the last two miles just trying to pass people, counting how many spots I was picking up.  My goal time was shot, but I could still improve my placement.  In my last marathon, I lost seven spots the last six miles.  This time I gained 40.  I was giving these last miles everything I had.  I can't wait to see the professional pics.  I had the pain face going.  The finish chute was long…had to be a half mile.  Knowing I had a big PR in the bag, I was pumping my fist and crossed the finish line smiling with my arms raised.  While I missed my goal, this was my best executed marathon and 15 minutes is a big PR.  I am getting better at these.  My Garmin measured 26.45 miles, so I lost a couple of minutes there too.  I tried to run the tangents but it's tough in a crowded race that has a lot of turns.

     

    Post race:

    Recovery started immediately.  Soon as I crossed the finish line, I forced myself to drink water, eat a doughy and salty pretzel, drink chicken broth (nice touch), and eat some chips.  I met up with DW and got a big hug, then got a free massage (the dude WORKED me).  I replenished a couple hours later with an awesome cheese steak.  I felt good after the race.  For the first time after a marathon, I didn't feel nauseous or sick.  I was happy, smiling, enjoying the live music at the finisher's area, and drinking hot chocolate.

     

    I don’t know how or why I faded.  I thought 3:18 was a reasonable goal.  Maybe I burned out a little in training, maybe I didn't taper well, maybe it was just poor race execution, or maybe it was too aggressive a goal.  I’d like to know why I had a five minute positive split.  Granted, I’m probably being nit-picky.  I ran a 3:23 marathon, and for that I am very happy.  I've had a good year.

     

    My marathon progression is coming along nicely, though I am sure it’ll start to slow substantially.

    10/2011:  4:16

    05/2012:  3:58

    10/2012:  3:45

    05/2014:  3:38

    112014:  3:23

    I feel like my marathon is finally in line with my shorter distance races.

     

    I’m targeting the New Jersey Marathon in April next.  Any chance I can shave another 9 minutes off in that time?  Seems like a tall order.

    <3

    Jack K.


    uʍop ǝpᴉsdn sǝʇᴉɹʍ ʇI

      Damn, the last 10 is tough! It has been fun following your training, Baboon. You help keep me motivated and I might try adding some GMP miles in my next cycle. That was a heck of a training cycle you did and the BQ is yours for the taking. Oh, and you are right; marathons are dumb.

        Great race! Excellent job capitalizing on a really solid training cycle. That fade really does not look too bad, although I guess it doesn't take much to add up to 5 min. NTAWKAAT.

         

        I think we are in a somewhat similar marathoning boat (except your boat is traveling much faster). Like your race, Detroit was also the first time for me that the final miles did not feel like grim death - just out of gas. So I consider that progress. A 6 min positive split for me; like you, I just thought I was better equipped to sustain that early pace than I actually was. Also like you I have been able to cut off some healthy chunks off the finish time with each race, but unsure of where/when it will plateau.

         

        Of course I have no idea of whether you can cut off another 9 min in the spring. But sure seems like you've got a lot of upside potential. My 2 cents (if it's even worth that much):

        - It's evident from your training runs & shorter races that you've got a lot more speed in you.

        - Even if you repeated the exact same training, you would probably improve just based on having that much more accumulated mileage under your belt.

        - Sounds like you will probably go with a more formal plan and/or coach next time - that's gotta help.

        - Winter training is tough, but I know you are not afraid of the treadmill.

        - One of my learnings from some of the faster guys, that I would want to incorporate in my next cycle (assuming I ever run again): incorporate some fast-finish long runs, to be better trained for the end of a marathon.

         

        Now rest up & eat up! As if you need to be told.

        Dave

        hog4life


          Congrats on the big PR!

          LRB


            10/2011:  4:16

            05/2012:  3:58

            10/2012:  3:45

            05/2014:  3:38

            11/2014:  3:23

             

            I have no idea whether you can trim 9 minutes off your current PR, but you are trending in the right direction.

             

            As for your "fade", there are not many here who have not experienced a similar or worse fate at some point during their running exploits.  Marathoning is not easy, especially for those of us who have chosen to run them so soon after joining the sport.

             

            Nice job son.  

            workinprogress11


              I'll let people wiser than me advise on what happened with the fade, but it looks an awful lot like the last marathon I raced in Chicago where my brain was telling my body to do stuff and my body was telling me to STFU.  Though you've run a lot of marathons, you've only been dong it for 3 years so I'm sure there's still lots of room for improvement. 9 minutes by spring might be a bit ambitious, but a really structured training program might just do the trick.

               

              Congratulations on the big PR! You've improved your time by almost an hour in the past three years. That's due to the hard work you've put in and is definitely something to be proud of.  If you keep working as hard as you have been, I can't imagine you won't BQ at some point.

              fourouta5


              Healed Hammy

                Gratz on the nice PR, you certainly trained with a purpose these last few months, put in lots of hard work and earned it.  Well done.

                 

                Let me apologize in advance for not getting to FE with you.  I also ran yesterday but given family and work commitments I had zero opportunity to set aside some time for a friendly gathering.  Maybe the NJ Marathon as I too am thinking about a spring jog.

                 

                My guess is that you were just a tad optimistic about your goal pace, evidenced by your legs tiring a bit in mile 11.  Probably a bit early for that feeling.  And I know exactly the lady on Lansdowne Ave saying we were near the top, I would have punched her but that means I would have had to leave the course to do so and didn't want to risk a DQ from any crazed runners who might turn me in, lol.

                 

                I will have my RR up in the next day or so, but overall was a great experience.  Did you notice the elites on the other side and the winner was in 2nd place in mile 24?  He made up about 50 yards in the last 2 miles and musta been an impressive finish.  Mile 24 looked really hard for you.  BTW, my Garmin measured 26.18.  For your next cycle perhaps some Daniels R type workouts to improve leg turnover might help as you seem to have the endurance based on you higher miles.

                onemile


                  Congrats on the big PR!

                   

                  How could the 3:15 group have been behind you?  Weird.

                   

                  I have no training advice. I like a structured program that includes longer runs with some quality but then you ran 21 miles at a 7:45 pace in training... which would kill me. So I really couldn't say you need harder workouts.  And it didn't sound like you were feeling over trained either.

                   

                  So my only advice is to skip the spring marathon and wait until fall to shave off those 9 minutes.  

                  scottydawg


                  Barking Mad To Run

                    Definitely not qualified to give any marathon advice, since I don't do them, so will let the other advise you on your fade, etc....still dang impressed by your speediness though!  Congrats on your marathon!

                    "Do what you can, with what you have, where you are." Theodore Roosevelt

                       

                      So my only advice is to skip the spring marathon and wait until fall to shave off those 9 minutes.  

                       

                      I predict approximately zero chance of that happening!

                      Dave

                      tracilynn


                          Great job!  Congrats on another PR. Your marathon time progression looks really nice.

                        ~~~~~~~

                        Traci

                         

                        happylily


                          This RR is full of awesome and I cannot see anything wrong with how you trained and then executed your race. You ran exactly like I would have done it myself, except faster. (wait... did I just insult you? ) Seriously though, one (or two at most) more training cycle and you have that BQ. Congratulations, Baboon!

                          PRs: Boston Marathon, 3:27, April 15th 2013

                                  Cornwall Half-Marathon, 1:35, April 27th 2013

                          18 marathons, 18 BQs since 2010


                          delicate flower

                            Thanks for all the comments!  Very much appreciated.

                             

                            Klompus, the MP miles helped me, no doubt.  I'm looking forward to seeing you train for The Ave.

                             

                            DaveP, I'll be working on the speed over the next couple of months.  I ran five HM's this year and only knocked 24 seconds off my time.  I know I can do a lot better than that.  And wtf is NTAWKAAT?  Google didn't help.

                             

                            fourouta5, no worries about the FE.  I was hoping to meet Kristin10185 but just couldn't meet up.  It's tough at a big race when you've got other people with you.  I saw the leaders pass when I was around mile 16.  The lead runner had quite a big lead...had to be at least a minute.  I thought for sure he'd win.  Btw, looking forward to your RR.

                             

                            onemile, the spring marathon keeps me busy during the winter!  And if I can't knock off nine minutes, maybe I can at least shave 16 seconds??  Big grin

                             

                            lily, thanks!  Honestly, reading your reports has helped me just appreciate the finish time, however you manage to get there.  If you are satisfied with your race and your time, that's what's important.

                             

                            Hog, LRB, workinprogress, Scotty, Tracy:  Thank you!

                            <3

                            Docket_Rocket


                              Congratulations!  Not sure if it was that bad of a fade, though.  I do agree with some of the suggestions already given, except that maybe you were not ready for 3:18 at this point?  Not sure.  I think you paced well and there will always be a fade whenever you race the marathon to the best of your ability.

                              Damaris

                               

                              As part of the 2024 London Marathon, I am fundraising for VICTA, a charity that helps blind and visually impaired children. My mentor while in law school, Jim K (a blind attorney), has been a huge inspiration and an example of courage and perseverance. Please consider donating.

                              Fundraising Page

                              LRB


                                And wtf is NTAWKAAT?  Google didn't help.

                                 

                                That's something between the dailies peeps, you should check us out in your spare time.