uʍop ǝpᴉsdn sǝʇᴉɹʍ ʇI
Hi.
I am coming off two injuries, Achilles on the left and piriformis on the right. The piriformis is much better but the Achilles is lingering a bit. I know shoes are about the individual and whatever works best for you, but in YOUR OPINION and/or past experience with injuries, which do you prefer, a support shoe or a neutral shoe? Again, I know enough now that what works for you won't necessarily work for someone else, I am just looking for opinions from experienced runners like yourselves. I am going to the LRS today to pick his brain about it and I think I am getting a new pair of shoes. I just don't know what kind...
Thanks in advance.
KillJoyFuckStick
Neutral
You people have issues
Super B****
It depends on the injury, I think. I know that when my knee hurts from ITBS, the more minimal, the better... but when it hurts from PFPS, it feels "better" with more support. (A problem since I've now got both ITBS and PFPS...)
But even when I say "more support," it's still neutral. I've never worn a support shoe in my life, I don't think. I guess this wasn't very helpful. Sorry!
chasing the impossible
because i never shut up ... i blog
Stability shoes have helped me run with ITBS for 4 years but shoe type had nothing to do with the actual injury itself or my piriformis and achilles injuries.
The root cause of all three were weak ass hips and a lack of flexibility.
I still run in support shoes because I have not built the requisite strength to run the mileage I do without them, but if you have a neutral gait you should run in neutral shoes as stability shoes only mask the real issue.
I have high arches which exacerbates the problem with my ITBS otherwise I would be in neutral shoes as I should be.
I am an admitted shoe whore so take this for what its worth. Like you said, everyone is different and shoes are a personal thing.
I am a slight overpronator so of course when I started running I was put in a support shoe. After a couple years of running, and educating myself, I switched to neutral shoes. I did this because I would have these odd pains occasionally on the inside and outside of my feet. Now, did they go away because I built my mileage and got out of the "beginner" stage or was it because I switched to neutral shoes? Who knows.
All things being equal (no medical issues, doctor's orders, etc.) I am a proponent of neutral shoes. Let your feet run naturally. Also, I long ago noticed the wear patterns on my shoes are different between my left and right foot. I decided it works for me and I'm going to go with it.
I also think there are benefits to rotating different models of shoes which, in theory, can cause your feet and legs to adapt and strengthen. I recall reading a article or two about this theory. I have three shoes (Nike, Adidas, Hoka) in rotation for training runs and a different Nike model for races and speed work. Heel-toe drops range from 4mm to 9mm. The only thing that is the same is that they are all neutral models.
One thing about your piriformis (and I've battled that) - I think it is something that can be helped by stretching and not sitting for hours a day. The sitting part can't be helped for a lot of us though. I started doing a lot more post-run stretching and using a roller when it was at its worst for me. I am also going to start paying attention to doing a bit more strength work as I get older. O.K., let's be honest...I'm going to start some strength work as I do basically none today. I know I am weaker on my left side than I am on my right side and this caused some hip problems for me this spring. My doctor gave me some exercises and I believe that I'm going to need to pay attention to this if I want to maintain or improve. Find a doctor who is a runner/athlete by the way. It makes a lot of difference.
I think that far too often, the worker in the LRS hears the word "pronation" and thinks it's a bad thing. In reality, pronation is your body's natural shock absorption mechanism. I am not convinced that every worker at a LRS can distinguish between normal pronation and over pronation even with a slow motion video. For that reason, I almost always think that someone should try neutral shoes and stick with them unless it becomes clear that shoes (rather than overtraining or something else) is the problem
I also have three different types of shoes. I use 11.5 ounce Asics Nimbus for my easy and long runs. These are just about the most cushioned shoe on the market and, at age 52, I think I need that cushioning on a daily basis. As you age, you simply aren't as flexible as you were when you were younger and there is nothing you can do about it. But, in addition to those, I have 7.5 ounce Adidas Adizero Adios 2.0 that I use for tempo runs, marathon pace runs, and races longer than 5K. I also have 3.5 ounce New Balance MRC 5000's that I use for track work and short races. I think that regularly running in different shoes strengthens my support structure.
Short term goal: 17:59 5K
Mid term goal: 2:54:59 marathon
Long term goal: To say I've been a runner half my life. (I started running at age 45).
I tend to get tight calves, shin pain, and posterior tibial tendon / ankle issues. I always thought I needed MORE support and I was afraid to try a less supportive, lower drop shoe. But strangely, my 4mm drop minimal support shoes seem to help these issues and my maximum support Brooks Adrenalines seem to aggravate them.
Healed Hammy
Shoes, see above.
With regard to the achilles, let me offer my perspective. I suffered from tender Achilles on both feet for my last MRT cycle, they hurt to touch; forget pressing on the sides of the back of the heel (unless you were my kid and wanted me to give you something). After tearing my hamstring and taking 5 months off, I resumed running. Conveniently my Achilles pain was gone, thanks to the long layoff. I have tight calves, and I immediately went into stretching mode. I would stand on a step while brushing my teeth, and hold a dropped heel position for a good 1-2 min. Did this 2 times a day on a semi-regular basis. Now being back running for 4 months, I have no pain. So in my case I attribute the tight calves (along with some stick rolling) as the probable cause and then solution to my tendinitis. YMMV.
From the Internet.
I get PT pain in overly supportive shoes too. I started off in neutral shoes and switched to shoes with just a touch of stability after my whole shin splint saga (I strengthened the offending weak hip and foot and still had a bit of internal knee rotation that was controlled with a very minimal amount of stability) and that's where I still am now - rotating Asics DS Trainers, Adidas Adizero Tempos, and Mizuno Wave Sayonaras. They're all working well for me so I have no motivation to switch anything around now.
Jack, I have to echo LRB - most injuries we get as runners can be traced back to localized weaknesses and/or flexibility issues. I wouldn't go changing shoes and expecting it to have a long-term effect on injury rate.
I have been running in Altras for over a year and haven't had any achilles/shin/calf issues ... prior to that I had run in Brooks Pure Flows but still had occasional achilles pain.
My experience was similar to Fuzzy, except super slower. I started with support shoes (being a pronator) but turned to neutral shoes after a few years. I have also run with racers and stuff but lately, due to my hallux rigidus (toe arthritis) I am running with more support (still neutral) than very light shoes, because if not, I'm super sore after runs (thank you, damn toe).
My selection right now favors Hoka Cliftons, as light as my trusty Mizuno Sayonaras. Ask me on Sunday how sore I am then.
And, just to clarify, I have all the shoes....
Damaris
As part of the 2024 London Marathon, I am fundraising for VICTA, a charity that helps blind and visually impaired children. My mentor while in law school, Jim K (a blind attorney), has been a huge inspiration and an example of courage and perseverance. Please consider donating.
Fundraising Page
...And, just to clarify, I am the true definition of a shoe 'ho.
FYP
Thanks, everyone. It sounds like I will try the neutral type of shoe, though I don't know which one. I usually try on 8-10 pair before I decide. Later I check running warehouse for the clearance sales.
LRB and Lauren: I have been working on my core strength at home and am considering doing some beginners yoga or cross fit training twice a week. A massage every six weeks or so also seems to help. I am not the most flexible person in the world so every little bit helps.
What about the Hokas? I am looking at some on Running Warehouse and it says they are neutral. The sole is almost two inches thick so it that just for more cushioning? That is not for support?
Hip Redux
I don't find them very supportive - it really is mostly cushion. I find supportive shoes are more rigid, where Hokas are more flexible than you'd expect.