Low HR Training

1

MAF in Static Bike to improve Running (Read 49 times)

RuiMei79


    Hi there. I tried 6 months of exclusive MAF running 1.5 years ago, but the results weren't significant. I was told it was maybe due to low volume.

    I'm trying to start again a period of base building, with exclusive MAF training. However, I can only run 2 times a week (55 to 60 minutes each).

    So I'm trying to complement it with static bike, another 2 times a week (25 to 30 minutes each -> 10 minutes warm-up, 10 minutes MAF, 5 minutes cool-down).

     

    Do you think this kind of training in the static bike will improve my overall aerobic condition, as if I was running more often? Or is it too little (or too short) to be significant?

     

    Thanks.

      Last winter I exclusively ran at MAF for my base training to improve my aerobic conditioning and I didn't see any real significant improvements until I was running 5+ hours a week.

       

      I think running at MAF and going on the bike at MAF will help, but I think you are still doing too little. You said you are only doing 10 minutes at MAF HR on the bike twice a week, plus your 2 runs. So really, in the entire week, you are only doing 2 hours and 20 minutes at MAF HR.

       

      I think you are going to run into the same problem as you did 1.5 years ago. You need to be able to dedicate more time during the week for your training. This is only my opinion though.

      -Pain is temporary, internet results last forever!

      http://www.runderfulmama.com

      BeeRunB


        RuieMei, it depends what your goals are. If you just want to stay healthy, then running twice a week and biking two times a week will help maintain better health. Studies out there show that 40 minutes a day of just walking is very good for you.

         

        If you're a racer and are looking for better race times or being able to run longer races, then this total volume of 3 hours a week, even with the bike, will not be enough to see the real gains needed. You might see some in the beginning but you'll soon plateau. If you are interested in better race times, and just having so little time to train, you might consider some intervals run at 90%MHR once a week during one or both of the runs. You run so little that you have ample time to recover, as opposed to someone running 70 miles per week who would add intervals into the training. During periods of low volume similar to yours I've tried this and seen aerobic improvement. You do get aerobic stimulus from intervals, though the danger comes from a high volume combined with the speedwork. It's a recovery problem. Plus, there is always a plateau point with intervals as well. At some point, more intervals or actual aerobic work is needed. Again, this is if you are thinking better race times.

         

        There are studies on interval training that show it is good for blood pressure, heart and weight control. So, if race times aren't your focus, and maximizing health and weight loss is, research  it. For example one study showed a significant improvement in blood pressure from an interval regiment of 4x 4 minutes at about 85-90% MHR with I think 3 minutes rest in between done 3 times a week. These are like how I do cruise intervals, same intensity. These can be done in three 45 minute sessions per week (including warm up and cool down).

         

        So, depends what you want out of it.

        RuiMei79


          Thanks for the replies.

           

          Soleful Runner,

          So you say 5 hours a week is the minimum to see a good progression (training MAF only). Unfortunatelly, at the moment I cannot dedicate this time to running / aerobic activities. But it's good to have a goal, if one day I'm able to put those hours I'll return to MAF only. Thanks.

           

          jimmyb,

          My objectives are staying healthy, keeping fit for Trail runs (30k - 50k), and possibly try to improve my best times (10k, HM, M). I only race about 2 to 3 times a year. At the moment I know I'm not putting enough time to prepare to a marathon, but I plan to run one later this year.

           

          I'm all about improving the aerobic system, using fat for fuel, and "Train Easy Race Hard". However, since apparently I cannot put the necessary hours to do a MAF-only regime, I wish to know which type of training will best improve my fitness and my times, by stressing my body a little bit more. I also do strength training at the gym.

           

          In my particular case:

          My MAX HR = Around 200

          My MAF HR = 144 -> 72% MHR

          My Marathon HR = 150-155 -> 75-77.5% MHR

          My 10k record = 175-180 -> 87.5-90% MHR

           

          So should I do something like this each week (if I run 3 times)?

          - 2 MAF runs, 1 interval run

          or

          - 1 MAF run, 1 (MAF+10) run, 1 interval run

          or

          - Forget MAF

           

          What would you recommend?

           

          Thanks

          BeeRunB


            I can say what will be the best thing for you and your goals. Experiment, keeping in mind your health and that your speed at MAF should be progressing. You have ample recovery time, but you should still ease into the experiment and keep tabs on the body and aerobic speed. If the speed is improving at MAF, then that means your aerobic system is improving. I'm not sure how such low volume and interval-based training translates to performance in marathons and ultras.  There is always the mental aspect of the race; long runs help in this regard. Perhaps, you should research if anyone has done well in an ultra on low volume interval training. Good luck.

             

            P.S> The Furman University FIRST training is a three day a week training, with two speed days and one long run day. People have found success with it. So that's one program that points in the direction of lower volume and more intensity. Google "FIRST training"

             

            Thanks for the replies.

             

             

             

            jimmyb,

            My objectives are staying healthy, keeping fit for Trail runs (30k - 50k), and possibly try to improve my best times (10k, HM, M). I only race about 2 to 3 times a year. At the moment I know I'm not putting enough time to prepare to a marathon, but I plan to run one later this year.

             

            I'm all about improving the aerobic system, using fat for fuel, and "Train Easy Race Hard". However, since apparently I cannot put the necessary hours to do a MAF-only regime, I wish to know which type of training will best improve my fitness and my times, by stressing my body a little bit more. I also do strength training at the gym.

             

            In my particular case:

            My MAX HR = Around 200

            My MAF HR = 144 -> 72% MHR

            My Marathon HR = 150-155 -> 75-77.5% MHR

            My 10k record = 175-180 -> 87.5-90% MHR

             

            So should I do something like this each week (if I run 3 times)?

            - 2 MAF runs, 1 interval run

            or

            - 1 MAF run, 1 (MAF+10) run, 1 interval run

            or

            - Forget MAF

             

            What would you recommend?

             

            Thanks

            Gdawginhtown


              Should one's MAF number be the same for biking and running...?

               

              In order for me to hit 140, I would have to:

              • Bike at a hard effort (20.5-21.0 mph @ 90 rpm).
              • Run at an easy effort to run (11:15/mile).

              I'm new at MAF but the above run effort would be all day while the biking would be good for an hour or two.

              Did I miss a chapter or two in regards to biking and MAF...?

              BeeRunB


                Should one's MAF number be the same for biking and running...?

                 

                In order for me to hit 140, I would have to:

                • Bike at a hard effort (20.5-21.0 mph @ 90 rpm).
                • Run at an easy effort to run (11:15/mile).

                I'm new at MAF but the above run effort would be all day while the biking would be good for an hour or two.

                Did I miss a chapter or two in regards to biking and MAF...?

                 

                It's the same for all activity. That doesn't mean you always have to get your HR up to MAF. If it feels too stressful to ride at MAF, then ride at a lower HR.  The aim is to get faster at MAF (aerobic speed), or even at a lower HR if you're using that. So, if you're currently at 11:15 per mile running during an MAF test, you want to get that number to the 10:00's, then the 9:00's, or whatever your potential is. Always making sure to listen to your body. Dr. Phil has mentioned a few times here and there that he has seen some athletes get so fast at MAF, that longer workouts become stressful, so they lower the ceiling some, and do what he calls "aerobic intervals." Using MAF for the fast parts and 10 beats lower for the rest intervals.

                 

                Remember to let your aerobic speed and how your body feels be your guides. If your aerobic speed is improving through the aerobic base phase, anaerobic training, and racing, and your body feels good with no sickness or injury---then good. If your aerobic speed begins to decline, and if you start to get injuries, colds and other respiratory infections, are feeling exhausted, have continual dead legs----then not good and you probably need to work exclusively below MAF for awhile (return to base phase) and cut volume. Rebuild. Get healthy, and get the aerobic speed improving again.

                 

                That's the simplicity of the program. Health first is what it is about.

                Gdawginhtown


                  Thanks for the feedback.

                   

                  I'll just need to experiment with this bike thingy.

                  I do a monthly century @ 18.5-19.0 mph with a HR around 130 bpm.

                  I do intervals during the week to hit 100 miles for the week but rarely ever over 130 bpm.

                  Maybe all of my biking sessions are already MAF-ish...?

                   

                  Still trying to figure this all out but greatly appreciate the feedback.

                  Babrivin


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                    sophy67


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