Low HR Training

1

my training (Read 534 times)

Pammie


    I've not been here for a while. Many apologies. It will be a year ago tomorrow (Monday) that i did my first and only marathon, it did not go well. Well not as i expected but that is another story. After that though i had been running regularly since June 2003 I just did not feel like it. I ran 31 miles in November, 13 in December and 24 in January. Not great Started running again in April not great (44 miles) but slowly built up since. But of course had a few niggles which disrupted training, hamstring, knee, ankle. So having gotten them seen to am back on the road again And From Oct 8th i resumed low HR training I'd done this thing before back in late 2003 and 2004 via the Hadd method did the Hadd tests a few times had a good year in 2005 (2004 was alright as well) but guess i wasn't running enough miles or something wasn't doing as well as expected This year i've started using whats been named the parker method (Heart Monitor Training for the Compleat Idiot) mainly sub 70% WHR for easy runs (sometimes called heart rate reserve) and above 85% for hard runs, but i'm not doing many of them at the moment want to build my miles up first. Ran 28 miles this week, not a great number but its getting there
    Pammie


      I have done a weekly fartlek session for the past 2 weeks and i do a 5km race once a month. A few things i have noticed , call them noticeable improvements if you like. My resting heart rate has gone done from 53 to 47. But this meant my easy runs were no longer 150bpm and under its now 148. Not that it matters most of my runs are around 138-142 bpm on average. And some of my miles are getting close to 10 minute miling at an easy pace with the odd one getting under 10 minutes. When i started i wasn't even breaking 11 minutes. My trouble though esp when racing cannot hold my heart rate high enough 170 is 85% for me and am guessing this is where my lactate threshold is about (without doing a lab test one can't be sure). My 5km races on average my HR avg has been 164-168. Where looking at my stats from a few years back it would be 10 beats higher and around 173 for 10km. I am hoping that this shows i have room for improvement and faster times


      Forever Learning

        Pammie, One thing - HR will trend down over time, well HRmax typically will. I am a little surprised your 5-K HR is that low. 70%HRR for me is 152 and I will hit 190+ during a 5-K. I did a 1 mile TT today (do one every 2 months) and HR averaged 187 and peaked at 193. My 1 mile times (while not the best test) have dropped almost 1 minuted per mile since my first test in February. Most of this was done with more volume and most of it below 70%HRR and the occasional tempo run. I will certainly continue to focus on my recovery days to stay under 70% and for my easy days under 75%.
        Pammie


          Thanks JWU42 You're right about theHR in the 5km i know i should be able to get it higher, , guess it comes down to training, the right training. Guess when i came back last April i really didn't spend enough time building a base and maybe did speedwork too soon, hence the niggles Any ideas on sessions to get the HR higher in races? Your 1 mile TT sounds good i did do one though months ago, maybe i should do them more regular. Do you do them on the track or the road? Cheers again Pammie


          Wasatch Speedgoat

            Hi Pammie.... I always say that your first priority should be more miles rather than speed. The pace will come down in time. Take my past training for example...In the winter of 1981, I did nothing but run to and from work, 5 miles each way at nothing much faster than a walking pace. For me then it was probabaly around 8:30 miles. That Spring I ran PR's at all distances, including a 4:55 mile up to a sub 2:50 marathon....alll on base work! I was running at or near 100 MPW then, so that's the reason. Run as much as you can for a good period with no racing. If all you can fit in is one run a day, run for as long as you can....but be sure the pace is really easy so you don't get the injuries. Also run on trails if you can or any softer surface. Bill Rodgers today at 58 says he is still running because he always stepped onto softer surfaces whenever possible. After you have been running as much mileage as you can afford for 6 months, say over the winter...start doing a 3 mile tempo run in the middle of one of your runs. You don't need anymore than 10% fast miles, so that would be if you are running 30 MPW. I think you can drop that number to 5%, but only if you are running 50 MPW or more base work. I basically do no speedwork, just run every day usually around a 9-10 mpm pace on trails and i just ran a 1:42 half marathon on a hot day. I also ran a 21 minute 5K not long ago and I'm 56 year's old. I have a marathon next weekend and think I will be somewhere between 3:30 and 3:40. Look at my signature below....it was written in the 50's and still stands today! It is Hadd...Maffetone...even Lydiard, who says to run a lot of base work before you even think of speed. Van Aaken used to say to keep your HR between 130-150 BPM, depending on your age and this was before HR monitors existed....he was well ahead of his time and had olympians in his stable of athletes. Above all, have fun...remember we are "recreational" runners Wink Steve
            Life is short, play hard!
            Pammie


              Thanks Steve all that does make sense. I have read a lot of that before mostly in that big Hadd Document. I even managed to get a copy of Slow Burn (Stu Mittleton) amongst other books on the subject. I have no worries about running a lot of miles at an easy pace and would be quite happy to do that. Only thing i don't think i can keep it up without a regular race. Would even one race a month usually do a monthly 5km in Hyde Park (London) which i do lookforward to i would find it hard to not race for months on end. Anyway i will give this a try Many thanks Pammie


              run-easy-race-hard

                I'm still in basebuilding phase and still hitting PRs. Haven't added a lick of speedwork or tempo yet. 4 new PRs in the last few weeks, 3 of them in the same race - all distances. Got my 2 mile time down to 12:20 from 13:40 since starting, marathon from 4:03 to 3:09, half from 1:48 to 1:31 (which was hit in the first half of the PR marathon), 10 miles from 77:30 to 68:30 (first 10 miles of the marathon), 10k from 48:40 to 42:24 (first 10k of the marathon PR). I must admit, I never thought I'd break 3:10 without speedwork or tempos, but it happened. I certainly didn't think my time in the 2 mile would really improve.
                Pammie


                  formationflier thanks that is well impressive. A big massive well done. I maybe doing a marathon next April (24 weeks) so this looks like the way i will be going


                  Wasatch Speedgoat

                    Great discussion.... Jessie congrats on the new PB...I'm sure you still have a lot of improvement there, but it will slow down eventually. You ought to tell the group about your training. I've seen your log, so know that you do, do a lot and a lot of diversity, which only helps. Pammie....be stubborn and consistent. Slow Burn is a fantastic book. Also go to Letsrun.com and do a search for Van Aaken and read some of those discussions. One guy (Vladimir) trained under Van Aaken in the 60's and tells of his unusual training. One for instance was what they called Hell Day where they would go out every other hour of the day and run for one solid hour, then come home and rest....do that for 24 hours! He said most of his training was at 10 mpm and he was an Olympic marathoner. Here's one discussion: http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?board=1&id=619879&thread=619851 and my favorite: (It's real long) http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?board=1&id=1199612&thread=1150796 Best of luck! Now i have to go watch that show on the marathon on PBS! Big grin Steve
                    Life is short, play hard!


                    run-easy-race-hard

                      Great discussion.... Jessie congrats on the new PB...I'm sure you still have a lot of improvement there, but it will slow down eventually. You ought to tell the group about your training. I've seen your log, so know that you do, do a lot and a lot of diversity, which only helps.
                      Indeed, I'll have to hit the limit sooner or later! Hopefully more on the later side. For those interested, here's my training log: http://www.coolrunning.com/cgi-bin/log/display.cgi?u=leitnerj;s=jesse Here's my marathon history (there are a few informal marathons missing); http://mm.littlemarathon.com/MyMarathons.asp?ManiacId=188 And here are my results from all of my recent races: http://www.midmdtriclub.org/view_member.php?memid=67
                      Pammie


                        Thanks guys That "hell day" is something else i don't think idd be trying tht just yet Smile But certainly lots of easy running. I've had a look at the links will read through it when i have a bit more time but it all looks interesting
                        Pammie


                          A little mini break through today i wasn't expecting it as legs felt a bit tired. But just run just under 6 miles avg pace was 10:07 but its the first 2 miles that were great 9:41 and 9:44 that included slowing down to a stop due to an approaching dog. I'm not normally that fast!! on an easy run (entire run 67%whr) In recent runs have done the odd mile around 10 minute pace This is great isn't it. Not elecrrifyingly fast but things moving in the right direction


                          run-easy-race-hard

                            Yup, that's a nice little progression. Moving in the right direction and certainly not a miserable pace! I remember being at slower than 12 min/mile for a quite a while! I really had an extreme exercise in patience and apparent futility.