Masters Running

1

How to incorporate a "long run" into my routine (Read 25 times)

Notne


    Hi - I turn 60 in July, have been running fairly steadily for about a year, after taking 10 years off (ouch) after a very painful (and only) marathon (3:43, finished the last 3-5 miles bent over like Quasimoto because my back seized up, with a race finish temperature of 104.9 degrees F because of the resulting poor muscle mechanics … what a rich emotional experience!! ). Prior to that I'd run on and off since high school and been in half-way decent shape my whole life.

     

    I was hoping to get some advice please on how to start working some "long" runs into my routine as what I guess I am as a "masters runner" (am I using that term correctly?). Some boring details of where I am regarding running: I'm currently running every other day, 25-30 miles a week, with tempo runs of 10K most days at 8:30-9:00 minute miles, some slow days for 7 to 7-1/2 miles at around 10:30 minute/mile, and every now and then an extra day of hill sprints thrown in.

     

    Is there a rule for how to add long runs in? I think maybe I've read something like, "no more than 25% of your weekly run" … but that would be only 5 miles, less than what a typical run is for me since I only run about 4 days a week! I think maybe I've also read, "no more than 25% longer than your longest 'normal' run during the week", but that would be close to 9 miles, and I just want to make sure that isn't too much (I'm very concerned about injuring myself and losing ground while recovering).

     

    Do you guys have any strong thoughts as to the best way I should start working "long runs" into my schedule?

     

    Thanks!

    Tramps


      No one's responded, so I'll jump in even though I don't do long runs anymore due to meniscus tears and arthritis issues.

       

      Short answer: Always listen to your body, of course, but if you're already doing 7.5 miles comfortably, going to 9 once a week doesn't seem like a big deal to me.

       

      Longer answer: There's no written-in-stone rule but most marathon training plans advise that the long run stay in the 1/4 - 1/3 range of overall weekly mileage. However, people routinely ignore that, running 20-milers on much less than the 60-80 mpw that would suggest.

       

      But really, the types and lengths of runs you do are usually based on your goals. The 30 miles a week you're already doing is plenty for basic aerobic fitness. Why do you want to do long runs at all? Are you building up to race longer distances again?  Are you thinking of a long run as a way to add more mileage without adding another running day? Something else? That all matters in the overall mix of runs. At some point, if you're looking to add mileage, it may make more sense to add a day of running, rather than going too long on limited miles.

      Be safe. Be kind.

      Notne


        Hey, thanks Charlie Chaplin!

         

        Yeah, I'm thinking of maybe doing a half near year's ends, certainly not committing emotionally to it, but I think my love of running is probably going to take me there and adding some long runs seems reasonable, ***as long as I don't hurt myself***!

         

        Thing is, I can't remember how I trained 12 years ago when I ran a full, except I remember it was pretty much an every other day regimen even then.

         

        I think I'll do like you say, good advice to listen to my body, I'll maybe just add a mile on the weekends above and beyond what I'm used to during the week, keep it there for 2-3 weeks, then see about repeating and maybe after a few months adding two miles instead of one … something like that.

         

        I just wasn't sure if there were a magical "Masters runner" way of doing things. Funny how back then I just felt like "me", but now I'm all worried about things like injury and stuff like that.

         

        Thanks again, Tramps!


        an amazing likeness

          Just a list of random, poorly organized thoughts...

           

          1. Forget about all the various "rules" (like limiting long run to xx% of total miles)...these rules aren't based on much more than creating articles over and over...

           

          2. think in terms of workout time, rather than miles...build the time of your long workout, let the miles be whatever they may...you'll find the miles can vary due to environment, how fresh your legs are, etc...

           

          3. remember the purpose of a long run...it's about low impact, even effort miles...don't be a 'pace slave'...

           

          4. as you get older, recovery and getting your body to 'accept' the workout and incorporate it into improved fitness (rather than just being beat up by it) gets harder...and is individual. Find what works for you. If your long run impacts your workouts for the next few days, you've gone too far too soon...

           

          5. as to the specific in your question about "how' to do it...pick whatever day is best for you and start stretching that workout longer. Keep that pattern of having a longer workout in your routine. Over time (months), get to a pattern where you stretch that workout for a few weeks, then take it out of rotation for a week.  Build, build, fallback. Repeat...

           

          6. pay attention to what you do the day before and after your longer run. Personally, I don't skimp on the run the day before, I want to deliberately head out on my long run with a little fatigue in my legs. Day after is a good day for cross training...

           

          7. log stalk...pick a person or two here on RA who are seems to have goals somewhat aligned to your own and check out their logs...see what they do...pick up ideas and try 'em...but find what works for you...

           

          8. forget about the what strangers on the internet say is the "right" way...experiment...

          Acceptable at a dance, invaluable in a shipwreck.

          Tramps


            Ah, working up to a half. I see now.

             

            This isn't rocket science. There are many different routes that'll get you to success. You're smart to be cautious and work your way up slowly. Experiment a bit and you'll find a strategy that keeps you healthy and works for you.

             

            If you want some ideas and like to overthink things (I'm guilty) McMillan isn't a bad place to look. Even though he's marathon-oriented, his description for building your own plan (Step #6) is useful for any racing (count back from date of goal race, fill in key runs, etc.) Again, don't follow anything slavishly, just some food for thought.  And if that's too much to think about; don't worry about it. Just run.

            Be safe. Be kind.

              There are all kinds of "systems" incorporating a long run. Some of the most extreme are for people who work a lot and don't have much free time during the week, so their long run on Sunday is 50%+ of their miles. This isn't ideal, but it does work for some, and is better than the short long run described by the 25% rule. Some people have reported running just twice a week, a long long run on the weekend of 20+ miles and a short run of 5-6 on Wednesday. There's a difference between training to just finish a marathon/ultra, and training to reach performance potential, though. Us old people need longer recovery, so a "system" that only has 2 hard runs and 2 easy runs a week isn't bad, assuming you're doing cross training the other days.

              60-64 age group  -  University of Oregon alumni  -  Irreverent and Annoying

              Joe618


                I'd concur with the others here Notne.   You are in decent shape...I'd argue you could likely do a half marathon right now. 

                 

                I'd also recommend Hal Higdon's plans for the half marathon.   His will gently work you up to about a 11 or 12 mile long run three weeks before a HM.   He also has master's plans, with only four days a week of running. 

                 

                You have enough experience to take a plan and start doing it, to listen to your body and make adjustments.    You can over-think this stuff...just go run, like you are!!

                 

                Joe

                ________

                I have nothing particularly clever or profound to add as a tag to each message...I just like to run.   

                evanflein


                   

                  8. forget about the what strangers on the internet say is the "right" way...experiment...

                   

                  Ha, yeah, right... hey wait, that's us!

                  Big grin

                   

                  Seriously, you can get some good info/advice from these guys. Tramps is right on with the "listen to your body" thing. It almost sounds cliche, but you'd be surprised how many people don't do that.

                   

                  I also agree with Joe on looking at Hal Higdon's plans. I've used his plans for the marathon as the basis for my own so-called training. It's also true that as we get older, recovery takes on more importance. Or maybe it just takes more time. And don't go clearing acres of brush and trees or spend hours putting in the garden the day before long runs or races. I've done that stuff and can tell you it really does not help your performance. 

                  Notne


                    Thanks for the extra comments, gals and guys!

                     

                    I'll look into those references, thanks also for those. The HM, if it comes to pass, won't be till the end of the year, so plenty of time to just kind of run.

                     

                    I'm a little bummed yesterday and today, left lower knee pain. I'm not sure if it's from the long run 4 days ago (long, meaning a bit longer than my normal, but a lot hillier) … actually  I have a sneaking suspicion I bunged it up with that "stand up" challenge from the other thread. I feel really dumb about that if it's the case, but I just couldn't handle the idea that I couldn't do it 100% of the time, so I'd be trying it once or twice a day, and it hurts right there when I try it.  .

                     

                    But, in light of the new philosophy of life I'm trying to work with lately (I feel like Woody Allen, in Annie Hall?,  writing that!), it's neither bad nor good (def. not good!), it just is, and I'll work with it!

                     

                    If I were smart I think I'd take tomorrow off even though it's a running day (I run every other day). Vegas is giving odds I'm not too smart. We'll see!