Masters Running

1

Consoling a downhearted speedster... (Read 293 times)

HermosaBoy


    So, my speedster of a son had a race that he called his worst F$cking race ever. I beg to differ because it was still faster than my mile PR. Angry However, given that many of you are much more experienced than I am with running (I never ran track or XC), I thought I would solicit your advice. Background... KeeMan has a tendency to get out hard the first lap (or the first mile in a 3200) and then relax a bit so he can kick at the end. Today he decided to try to go out hard and hold on. His 1600 PR is 4:47 and 3200 is 10:11 (both from last year). He has not surpassed either of those this year. So, his goal going into the 1600 race was sub 4:40. I told him to not worry about splits -- just get out and compete. 1st lap comes in 1:08 -- a bit ahead of goal and he is in 3rd place. 2nd lap comes in 1:07 -- still in 4th place 3rd lap -- comes in 1:20 Surprised He was in fifth through into the backstretch and then it looked like a gorilla climbed on his back. 4th lap -- comes in 1:18 -- the gorilla is now carrying a piano and I am surprised that he was faster than lap 3. He got passed by quite a few over the last lap and a half -- not usually the case for him. Afterwards, he was VERY disappointed. I told him that I was very proud of him (sent him a text of that again while driving home) and tthat he needed to look back at the race and learn from it. I suggested that he needs to come up with the following: What did I do good -- I suggested that he got out and competed and that his first 800 was only 5 seconds off his 800 PR. What could I do better -- He complained of "stomach" distress for the last lap and a half. I suggested that he needs to look at what he ate and how he "cleared the pipes" to see if there is something he can do to minimize risks. What else? I have been doing my best to not coach him during the season (at his request), but would welcome input from others. THANKS!

    And you can quote me as saying I was mis-quoted. Groucho Marx

     

    Rob

    Teresadfp


    One day at a time

      Wow, Rob, your son is a LOT like mine. His 1600 PR is 4:41. His goal is 4:30. He ALWAYS goes out too fast, and tries to hold onto the pace but usually can't. There are a couple of kids on his team who are faster than he is, and he's always trying to keep up with them. I don't know what to tell him, either, except to keep on training and he will improve. He's only 15, so he's got time! It sounds as if both our kids are very driven! I will be interested in any advice, also!
        Hermosaboy, I think your instincts serve you well here and you have already focused on the key factors----your speedster got out there, ran hard and while the strategy didn't work, he toughed it out. I also told my father not to coach me when I was in high school. He couldn't resist especially when I was running shorter distances like the 800 or even a leg of the mile relay. He was a great sprinter in college, so he was always on the last curve with his booming bass voice. I am so glad he ignored my request and still treated me like his first born son! Confused He did something for me that I still try to draw on today and that was to focus on getting over the "bad" race as soon as possible. I think for young runners the memory of that awful race or awful lap comes back to haunt them and the fear becomes reality in every subsequent race. I was a jack rabbit starter and my father and my high school coach worked with me on tucking in behind the leader and finding the pace groove and then going for the kick (okay, sometimes I forget that lesson). Anyway, keep telling him he's loved and that you are proud---especially when he says to shut up or worse. And maybe get him to race a 400 or 800 as a time trial---separate from his race schedule. The focus on the PR within the mile is great. Helping analyze the details, what he ate, how he slept and all that will help too. He needs to push this race aside and keep working toward the next goal. He may have hit a plateau for a bit and will need to work through that before the next break through. I always tried to race well and win for my father. He told me to run for me and then he would be proudest. I feel for him and for you and also know you'll make it through. No over-dwelling---just moving forward now. Karin/CNYrunner
        evanflein


          I have the same problem with my son. DS1 is very fast, has a natural gift that I wish he'd work to develop. But he just stores it away and brings it out when he wants to. In the past, that's worked for him pretty well. He did the mile race last year though and crashed and burned second half. Rather than determine what he needs to do to get better, he pouts and says "I hate running! I suck!" and gets defeated. DH just gets mad at him and yells at him to not be a baby, but that doesn't seem to help matters much (duh). A lot of this stuff they just need to learn for themselves. You can guide and make suggestions, but the determination needs to come from within. You've given good suggestions for things he needs to work on and think about. I'm sure he's thinking hard about it. Unlike my son, yours seems driven to perform and improve, so even though it seems like he's not paying attention, he really is. Don't be surprised if he doesn't ask for more info or help soon, or you'll just see him come up with some ideas/plans on his own to try next time. Good luck.
            Rob, What is Keeman's training look like. As my coach loves to tell me you get what you put in. Having a better understanding of what keeman is doing ie: intervals, tempo, distance etc..cross training, etc...could provide us with a better benchmark for analyzing strengths and weaknesses. You were also smart to discuss food intake with K as young ones tend to wolf back some crazy stuff and although their stomachs can handle better than ours, it can still be an issue. If you could provide some of this I would be happy to give some additional feedback. Tall

            Recent Best times: None recently

              ...no advise here//........but The Good Ones are always dissapointed with a Bad Showing.... I have a feeling he'll be looking for PayBack on his next race...... (you GOTTA be Proud of a kiddo like that)

              ..nothing takes the place of persistence.....

              Teresadfp


              One day at a time

                Good timing for this thread - my son came home after his meet today pretty disappointed. It was 75 degrees, and the other two fast boys on the team didn't run the 1600.This wasn't a big meet, so there was no one close to him. He went out too fast (as usual) and finished in 4:44. His 3200 time was 10:30. He thinks it was the heat and lack of sleep that hurt him most. We're trying to help him learn to be more efficient doing his school work, but he still stays up way too late. CNY, your suggestions were helpful - I had a good talk with him.
                  If he hasn't improved since last year I have a strong suspicion that he's running too hard, too often.
                  Age 60 plus best times: 5k 19:00, 10k 38:35, 10m 1:05:30, HM 1:24:09, 30k 2:04:33
                    I just had to chime in--the 2 questions you gave him--what did I do good? what could I do better? are remarkably close to how I handled new attorneys in legal services. I'd go with them to their first court appearances, always high anxiety time. When they finished, we'd go out for coffee and I'd ask them to name 2-3 things they did well, and then we talked about 2-3 things they could improve upon. They always wanted to start with how much they messed up, how unsmooth they were, etc. Even though they were adults, I insisted we do this. Often, I had to coax to get them to see they'd actually done many things quite proficiently. Many-to-most have since told me they appreciated the lesson and they still do a similar check even after years in practice. Track wise, I never ran track or XC, like you. Just wanted to say this framework is one I find useful and that should stand your son well in any number of future pursuits. A.
                    Masters 2000 miles
                    HermosaBoy


                      Rob, What is Keeman's training look like. As my coach loves to tell me you get what you put in. Having a better understanding of what keeman is doing ie: intervals, tempo, distance etc..cross training, etc...could provide us with a better benchmark for analyzing strengths and weaknesses. You were also smart to discuss food intake with K as young ones tend to wolf back some crazy stuff and although their stomachs can handle better than ours, it can still be an issue. If you could provide some of this I would be happy to give some additional feedback. Tall
                      Well, his training has been less than stellar in my opinion. I can't believe how low his mileage is, but there is good quality. He is averaging 20 to 25 a week with a 4 to 7 miler on Mondays (if no meet the next day). The rest of the days are either easy or specific track work or tempo runs. I am trying to avoid 2nd guessing his coach and trying to coach him myself. At this point, I am just going to encourage him as much as until the end of the season. This summer, we will look at what he did well, what he can improve and how to get ready for XC in the fall...

                      And you can quote me as saying I was mis-quoted. Groucho Marx

                       

                      Rob