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Wingz wants to run a HM without getting hurt... (Read 503 times)

Wingz


Professional Noob

    Hi, gang. I see some familiar faces here. My running background: I started running in Sept '05, using a greatly extended and modified version of the Couch-to-5K program. It took me about half again as long to reach the end of the program as was designed since I was very heavy and out of shape. I ran run/walk intervals with a group for a while, but dropped the group to strike out on my own with heart-rate training and increasing mileage. The group was not ambitious enough for me. In October of '06, I ran my first half-marathon. I trained for it by using a modified verson of Higdon's Novice plan. I added in more running instead of cross-training because I was addicted. I peaked at just under 29 miles per week, and with a few long runs of 9 and 10 miles before the race. During the race, I developed pain in my IT band for the first time. I finished the race, hobbling, in 2:59:46. My second attempt at the HM distance, I followed a looser trainig schedule, averaged in the high teens in miles/week, DID do crosstraining, and had a longest run of 11.8 miles. During the race, I developed IT band pain. I finished the race, hobbling, in 2:50:43. The most miles I've averaged has been mid-20's for a period of about a half year. My highest ever mileage week has been 33, back in March of '07. Since my May '07 HM, I've been hit wih injuries and illnesses and have not been able to maintain any kind of base. In addition to the IT band, I have sprained ankles, had some mysterious foot pain, had swelling and tenderness in my knees (especially the left, which had ACL surgery back in 2004), and have most recently been having fun with pain on the outside of my hips which I suspect is connected to my IT band troubles. My perception is that I am injury-prone. Over the last few months, I've been working with a HRM to try to bring my training pace UP to 70% - 80% of my max HR (as measured during a 5K race). I have a tendency to drift down to around 60% when I'm not thinking about it. I've noticed some increase in speed from this training, and recently dropped about 1:30 off my 5K PR, bringing it down to 32:15. I have an ultimate goal of being able to run a marathon. My experience with the half, though, has taught me that I am nowhere near where I need to be in order to even start training for that goal. Before I can run a marathon, I MUST be able to run a half-marathon without injury during the race. There's no way around that, because it really HURTS to try to run with an IT band flare-up! REALLY hurts!

    Roads were made for journeys...

    Wingz


    Professional Noob

      I have set my sights on a November half-marathon. There are two that I'd be interested in doing, both on 11/9. So that's my current goal. I have reached the fairly obvious conclusion that I was not well-enough prepared for my last two HM attempts. I suspect that if I increase my mileage and maintain that higher level in addition to bringing up a long run, I should be able to run a HM without injury. I cannot currently fathom wanting to run more than 40 mpw. When I was up around 25-30, I was really enjoying myself and wanting to run more. I stopped it due to injury during the HM. So I've decided that a best-goal for weekly mileage for me would be 40 mpw. My current bias is towards having a long run distance of 13 miles. I have read that older runners benefit from having their long runs only every other week. While I am only 36, my history of injuries and general deconditioning leads me to believe that I too would benefit from a biweekly long run. In a nod to the psychological barrier that is the round number, I'm thinking I should maintain 20 mpw for a period of time (like a month) and 30 mpw for a similar period of time. I have very little experience with fartleks, tempo runs, and have never set foot on a track. Since I understand that it is generally a bad idea to increase miles and intensity at the same time, I think that I would be best served by NOT including these things in my proposed plan. My goal is to run it, finishing without injury. McMillan says I should be able to complete it in around 2:30. I think I have a good chance at that IF I CAN DO SO WITHOUT INJURY! I obviously am not trying to break any speed records. I just want to be able to train without getting hurt, and to race without injury. With that in mind, here's what I came up with:

      Roads were made for journeys...

      Wingz


      Professional Noob

        Weektotal mileslong run
        1136 (my current long-run length)
        214none
        3176
        418none
        5206
        620none
        7207
        820none
        9228
        1025none
        11279
        1230none
        133010
        1430none
        153011
        1630none
        173012
        1831none
        193313
        2034none
        213613
        2238none
        234013
        2440none
        2540none
        26Half Marathon!

        Roads were made for journeys...

        Wingz


        Professional Noob

          A runner friend of mine is suggesting that I use my non-long run weeks to include a bit of tempo work. I am afraid to do that because 1) I have very little practice judging my speed (albeit, this could be an argument for including tempos), 2) I am afraid that it would be too much intensity for me, and 3) it seems to me that it'd sort of defeat the purpose of making the long runs every 2 weeks, by including a more stressful workout on "easy" weeks. What do you think?

          Roads were made for journeys...

          Wingz


          Professional Noob

            I know that a 25 week training plan seems a bit extended and overdone. Unfortunately, I know that my training becomes erratic when I'm not following a plan. I have to be able to juggle workouts within a week due to school and a work schedule that changes from week to week. But having a weekly structure is very helpful to me.

            Roads were made for journeys...

              Wingz! Good to see you round these parts. I'm right there with you on needing a plan to help get things done. I think your goals and limits for mileage sound great. The plan you've laid out looks good, too. I would make one change to it though. Don't not do a "long" run. On your off weeks, just have a "not so long" long run. I think you will build much better endurance this way. I also totally agree that the best way for you to meet your current goals of getting to the finish line injury free and sub 2:30 is to simply run more miles - for now.
              The most miles I've averaged has been mid-20's for a period of about a half year. My highest ever mileage week has been 33, back in March of '07.
              This is great! I think we use different first day of the week settings - because that looks like a 40 mile week to me.
              I cannot currently fathom wanting to run more than 40 mpw.
              Just sayin'. Cool
              Since my May '07 HM, I've been hit wih injuries and illnesses and have not been able to maintain any kind of base. In addition to the IT band, I have sprained ankles, had some mysterious foot pain, had swelling and tenderness in my knees (especially the left, which had ACL surgery back in 2004), and have most recently been having fun with pain on the outside of my hips which I suspect is connected to my IT band troubles. My perception is that I am injury-prone.
              I agree with your perception. Perhaps your IT band problems can be corrected with some flexibility and strengthening exercises. I'll bet you could find several good threads on ITB exercises in the main forums. I got past my hamstring problem last year by doing maybe a half dozen weight sessions of maybe 10 minutes each and then adding hills into some of my runs. YMMV with the ITB - just giving an example of how a pretty small time investment can pay off. You said the hip pain came on recently. What is recently? Only on longer runs? Also, are the ankle and foot problems going on now or are all in the past and only the hip pain is current?
              A runner friend of mine is suggesting that I use my non-long run weeks to include a bit of tempo work. I am afraid to do that because 1) I have very little practice judging my speed (albeit, this could be an argument for including tempos), 2) I am afraid that it would be too much intensity for me, and 3) it seems to me that it'd sort of defeat the purpose of making the long runs every 2 weeks, by including a more stressful workout on "easy" weeks. What do you think?
              I disagree with your friend. After you address your injury, then I agree with your friend. I totally think tempo runs will fit into your off weeks without defeating the purpose of your long run spacing. Tempo runs are the only work out that I never miss in my plans. But we can discuss this more later.

              When it’s all said and done, will you have said more than you’ve done?

                I know that a 25 week training plan seems a bit extended and overdone. Unfortunately, I know that my training becomes erratic when I'm not following a plan. I have to be able to juggle workouts within a week due to school and a work schedule that changes from week to week. But having a weekly structure is very helpful to me.
                I've discovered that if I don't have a plan of some sort - I don't run. I think you are on the right track.

                When it’s all said and done, will you have said more than you’ve done?

                Wingz


                Professional Noob

                  Wingz! Good to see you round these parts. I'm right there with you on needing a plan to help get things done. I think your goals and limits for mileage sound great. The plan you've laid out looks good, too. I would make one change to it though. Don't not do a "long" run. On your off weeks, just have a "not so long" long run. I think you will build much better endurance this way. I also totally agree that the best way for you to meet your current goals of getting to the finish line injury free and sub 2:30 is to simply run more miles - for now.
                  So if I'm understanding you right, you're saying that if I had a long run of, say, 8 miles one week, the next week I would do a "not so long" long run of, say, 6 miles, and then the week after that do a 9 mile, and then the next week do another 6. For example? Only the hip pain is current. It's not enough to change my stride, but it does sometimes make me groan at the start of a run. It's been going on for, I dunno, maybe a month and a half? It's on the outside of the hips, feels like a tendon (as opposed to muscle or inside the joint), and is tender to mash on. It's on both sides. I can feel a stretch when I cross my legs at the desk, and I wonder if that's not contributing to it. I also forgot to mention that my current "crosstrraining" is taekwondo (TKD). That and trail running are the sources of my twisted ankles. It has been the source of some of my knee woes. TKD training is almost exclusively anaerobic, requiring short bursts of lots of power. It's not exactly the best compliment to running, but I love it so much that I'd not dream of quitting...

                  Roads were made for journeys...

                    So if I'm understanding you right, you're saying that if I had a long run of, say, 8 miles one week, the next week I would do a "not so long" long run of, say, 6 miles, and then the week after that do a 9 mile, and then the next week do another 6. For example?
                    Yes. Exactly.
                    Only the hip pain is current. It's not enough to change my stride, but it does sometimes make me groan at the start of a run. It's been going on for, I dunno, maybe a month and a half? It's on the outside of the hips, feels like a tendon (as opposed to muscle or inside the joint), and is tender to mash on. It's on both sides. I can feel a stretch when I cross my legs at the desk, and I wonder if that's not contributing to it.
                    Possibly. I remember reading something about that. Glad to hear that it's just the hip at the moment. I have no advice - but definitely something to look at while looking at flex/strength work for the ITB.
                    I also forgot to mention that my current "crosstrraining" is taekwondo (TKD). That and trail running are the sources of my twisted ankles. It has been the source of some of my knee woes. TKD training is almost exclusively anaerobic, requiring short bursts of lots of power. It's not exactly the best compliment to running, but I love it so much that I'd not dream of quitting...
                    I, of course, knew this. Big grin Something I've done to help with ankle strength is a core board. This has helped my balance - lower leg strength - and core muscles. I don't do anything real regular with it anymore - but I keep it in the game room. It's been forever linked to Guitar Hero. I just attempt to stand on the core board while I play.

                    When it’s all said and done, will you have said more than you’ve done?

                    btb1490


                      Just popping in to wish you good luck!
                      Wingz


                      Professional Noob

                        Thanks, Bob & Mike. Smile I tried to do my long run today. Key word: tried. I'd chosen one of my favorite trails today since the weather was so nice and I wasn't pressed for time. (Trail runs always much slower than on the road!) I got maybe 2 miles in to my 6 mile run and started feeling pain and tightness in my left knee. It wasn't just the IT band area, so I went a little longer to see what shook out. What shook out was more IT pain. Right knee. And a very long and uncomfortable walk back. This year, most of my IT band troubles have showed up while I was trail running. I don't know what it is - the unevenness of the trails, the rocks underneath the pine needles, the constant hills, or perhaps just a structural weakness in my legs that isn't letting me run the well. Last year, trails weren't an issue for me, but this year they are. Black eye So... modifications needed... 1) Don't run anything over 2.6 miles on trails (there's a 2.6 mile and less-hilly one that's been good to me) unless I've been specifically and carefully working up to it. 2) Game plan for injuries... if it's a small ache that doesn't stop the run, just repeat the two week cycle of long run/easy week that I'm on and don't progress until I can complete the two weeks without discomfort. If it's something more significant, take a few days off running, drop back 2 extra weeks, ice, and vitamin I until I've not had any pain for several days. This does mean, of course, that I most likely will not be ready by November. Sad The good thing about winter in the South, though, is that there is an abundance of long races. I'll find another, closer to when I'm ready. Unfortunately, my reality is such that my goals must be flexible... Undecided

                        Roads were made for journeys...

                        Wingz


                        Professional Noob

                          If it's something more significant, take a few days off running, drop back 2 extra weeks, ice, and vitamin I until I've not had any pain for several days.
                          Looks like I need a few pre-plan weeks... Roll eyes I've not been able to keep anything consistant for a while. Maybe I'll shoot for 10 next week instead of 14... Roll eyes

                          Roads were made for journeys...

                          Scout7


                            I was sidelined last year with pretty nasty IT pain. I wouldn't feel it until I started to run, then it came up pretty quick and painful, and hurt for a while afterwards. I ended up in PT for it, and did a number of exercises and stretches. I still get stiffness in it, but have found that a foam roller on the outer thigh works wonders for that. Stretches from RT These I used For exercises, I did the sideways walk, foot-to-foot, in a crouch, with a resistance band tied in a loop around my ankles. Also, stood on one foot, bent over to touch a cup, then back up again. Some work on a balance board doing squats.
                              HEY JANELLE!!!! *waves* Looking forward to sharing your journey!!

                              Your toughness is made up of equal parts persistence and experience. You don't so much outrun your opponents as outlast and outsmart them, and the toughest opponent of all is the one inside your head." - Joe Henderson

                              Wingz


                              Professional Noob

                                Scout! Long time no talk! Thanks for the links. I'll definitely be looking into that. Hi, Pam! Big grin

                                Roads were made for journeys...

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