Swim Bike Run

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Swim Deaths... (from SlowTwitch) (Read 72 times)

    As many of you likely know, SlowTwitch is doing a week long daily delivery of the issue of dying during the swim portion of a triathlon.  Day 2 is out, and for those that don't subscribe to the SlowTwitch Facebook feeds or go to SlowTwitch regularly, take a read of the interesting articles.

     

    Part 1: Exit the Swim Alive

     

    Part 2: Safe in the Water

    2019 Goals:

    #1: Do what I can do (250+ training days, 300+ aerobic hours).

    #2: Race (Hurt the Dirt 1/2 marathon - 4/27, Grand Rapids Tri 70.3 - 6/9, MSU Gran Fondo - 6/22, ODRAM - 8/10, Michigan Titanium 70.3 - 8/18, Grand Rapids Marathon - 10/20)

     

      As many of you likely know, SlowTwitch is doing a week long daily delivery of the issue of dying during the swim portion of a triathlon.  Day 2 is out, and for those that don't subscribe to the SlowTwitch Facebook feeds or go to SlowTwitch regularly, take a read of the interesting articles.

       

      Part 1: Exit the Swim Alive

       

      Part 2: Safe in the Water

       

      I'll have to take a look.

       

      I've got to say these swim deaths boggle me. Perhaps that's because I'm such a slow swimmer I never seem to exert myself.

      dmfitz2


        Interesting reads....I'll be sure to follow the remaining posts.  If anything, there's some great advice with the mental side of preparing for the swim.  Thanks for posting!

        Fitz

        ___________________________________________________________

        00:20:20 5k (2008)

        1:47:00 Half Marathon (2009)

        4:00:45 Marathon (2011)

        2013 Goals

        Steelhead 1/2 Ironman 8/4/13 (6:32:24)

        Sub 4:00 Chicago Marathon 10/13/13

         

          2019 Goals:

          #1: Do what I can do (250+ training days, 300+ aerobic hours).

          #2: Race (Hurt the Dirt 1/2 marathon - 4/27, Grand Rapids Tri 70.3 - 6/9, MSU Gran Fondo - 6/22, ODRAM - 8/10, Michigan Titanium 70.3 - 8/18, Grand Rapids Marathon - 10/20)

           

            Part 3: Can RD's Impact SCD in Tri?

             

            Lot's of good recommendations in there. As a newbie it was eye opening just how full contact the swim was for me last summer. The bumping and contact at the start was expected. I certainly could have taken a wider angle to the first buoy.

             

            What really surprised me was when I got to about 0.8 to 1 mile into the swim and swimmers from the wave behind, clearly experienced (hotshots in the article), started swimming right over me when it wasn't so crowded. I'm very comfortable and have a lifetime of experience "playing" in the water but what about the next swimmer? Perhaps they just learned how to swim recently to try tri. Perhaps they aren't very strong. They could have out there for a long time having started several waves ahead.

             

            I do understand racing at a high level on the track has similar contact with spiking, bumping, etc.. but don't tell me a 4:30 miler has any intention or need to spike or bump someone they are passing that happens to be running a 9 minute mile.

             

            I can't draft, make erratic maneuvers or make contact elsewhere so why is this acceptable when unnecessary other than to gain a second at best? I do understand it's part of the sport as it currently is. When I enter a race I'm accepting that. I just don't find it cool at all.

             

            All that blabbering above... I doubt this is the real problem with swim deaths. I do think it's a potential safety issue, especially if people are tired.

               

              What really surprised me was when I got to about 0.8 to 1 mile into the swim and swimmers from the wave behind, clearly experienced (hotshots in the article), started swimming right over me when it wasn't so crowded. I'm very comfortable and have a lifetime of experience "playing" in the water but what about the next swimmer? Perhaps they just learned how to swim recently to try tri. Perhaps they aren't very strong. They could have out there for a long time having started several waves ahead.

               

              I do understand racing at a high level on the track has similar contact with spiking, bumping, etc.. but don't tell me a 4:30 miler has any intention or need to spike or bump someone they are passing that happens to be running a 9 minute mile.

               

               

              This completely pisses me off about triathlons. I want to run these people over when they are walking and taking up the middle of the road on the run. On the bike, I have to go around them and they have to ride on the right, sure. On the run though, I can't tell you how many times I've had to weave in and out of people walking 3-4 people across the street. Same rules should apply as the swim. I should be able to "run" over them the way I get "swam" over. Thats all I got for today Smile

                For me, I recognize before I swim that it'll be rough and it'll be tough.  I do not take swimming lightly.

                 

                I like what they said about swimming in a manner that you're not in oxygen debt.  There'll be times when you'll need to skip a breath and go from your race desired 2 stroke breathing to an unexpected 3 stroke breathing for a segment.  If you haven't trained for it, it would be tough.

                 

                Not mentioned in the article specifically, but still relevant.... For my ironman, for the first 20 minutes or so, I had people right behind me that were pushing my leg down with their arm stroke.  It wasn't their fault, as they had someone behind them pushing their leg down.... Likewise, I was pushing the leg down of the people in front of me.  (When legs go down, the head goes up).  In race preparation, I knew that would happen, and I wasn't alarmed or annoyed.  I really didn't think they were being pricks.  They couldn't help it.  I chose not to race the swim, and only swim the swim.


                I told my family that if I came out of the water in less than 1:10, I would be in big trouble throughout the day.  I also told them if I came out in more than 1:25, I either swam too far (zig zag) or it was a much tougher swim than I imagined.  I came out in 1:23, and it was tough and I zig zagged.

                2019 Goals:

                #1: Do what I can do (250+ training days, 300+ aerobic hours).

                #2: Race (Hurt the Dirt 1/2 marathon - 4/27, Grand Rapids Tri 70.3 - 6/9, MSU Gran Fondo - 6/22, ODRAM - 8/10, Michigan Titanium 70.3 - 8/18, Grand Rapids Marathon - 10/20)

                 

                  The author did spend some time talking about the start, how people go out too fast and how it's crowded and steps to try and mitigate that. I think it's just in human nature for some people to go out too fast. I'm not sure a few words at the start of a race will change this. There's lots of adrenaline at the start of any race and it can take skill and experience to have the confidence to keep yourself in check.

                   

                  I sign up expecting plenty of contact and a chaotic start. I learned a few things last summer that I'll try to employ next summer to mitigate some of it. What I was ranting about was the unnecessary contact that occurs in the second half of a race by the more experienced swimmers or those dead set on having the fastest swim split long after the initial chaos is over. You are a much better swimmer than I am so perhaps you haven't experienced this little "surprise." Putting all the young studs in the last waves doesn't help matters.

                   

                  ...going further off topic ... starting at the back was a big negative for me. It's no fun having to pass so many people all day long. If the put me in the last wave of Boston I wouldn't run it. I'd find another race.

                   

                  Back to topic... In college I took kayak lessons. My teacher also taught rock climbing and would often remind us that kayaking was much more dangerous than rock climbing. When he took people rock climbing he was always in control. When he took people river kayaking he wasn't in control at all. I guess the same is true with tri. When you in the middle of a boiling mass of bodies and something goes wrong (ie. heart issue) there is little or no control on anyone's part. It's the last place anyone wants to be at that point.

                   

                   

                  For me, I recognize before I swim that it'll be rough and it'll be tough.  I do not take swimming lightly.

                   

                  I like what they said about swimming in a manner that you're not in oxygen debt.  There'll be times when you'll need to skip a breath and go from your race desired 2 stroke breathing to an unexpected 3 stroke breathing for a segment.  If you haven't trained for it, it would be tough.

                   

                  Not mentioned in the article specifically, but still relevant.... For my ironman, for the first 20 minutes or so, I had people right behind me that were pushing my leg down with their arm stroke.  It wasn't their fault, as they had someone behind them pushing their leg down.... Likewise, I was pushing the leg down of the people in front of me.  (When legs go down, the head goes up).  In race preparation, I knew that would happen, and I wasn't alarmed or annoyed.  I really didn't think they were being pricks.  They couldn't help it.  I chose not to race the swim, and only swim the swim.


                  I told my family that if I came out of the water in less than 1:10, I would be in big trouble throughout the day.  I also told them if I came out in more than 1:25, I either swam too far (zig zag) or it was a much tougher swim than I imagined.  I came out in 1:23, and it was tough and I zig zagged.

                  AmoresPerros


                  Options,Account, Forums

                    I've never done an open water triathlon, and I've read about all the jostling and people swimming over each other.

                     

                    That makes me wonder, do some people fight back?

                     

                    I'd think that there has to be quite a low ratio of referees to swimmers, so they can't see everything that happens above water, never mind below water.

                     

                    In water polo, there are fewer swimmers compared to referees, and players still routinely get away with physical shenanigans under water - at least in my experience.

                    It's a 5k. It hurt like hell...then I tried to pick it up. The end.

                    dmfitz2


                      Is there any way to practice open water conditions in a pool setting?  I've thought about having a training partner swim directly in front of me so I can practice drafting as well as having them swim right on my heels so I get used to being crowded.  I've also contemplated getting very dark tinted goggles to impair my vision as much as possible, even thought about closing my eyes for a certain number of strokes every lap just so my body can adapt to no sight under water.

                       

                      Obviously, there is no alternative to practicing in open water conditions, but there has to be some pool modifications that can be used to at least help the transition a little...right??

                      Fitz

                      ___________________________________________________________

                      00:20:20 5k (2008)

                      1:47:00 Half Marathon (2009)

                      4:00:45 Marathon (2011)

                      2013 Goals

                      Steelhead 1/2 Ironman 8/4/13 (6:32:24)

                      Sub 4:00 Chicago Marathon 10/13/13

                       

                        Is there any way to practice open water conditions in a pool setting?  I've thought about having a training partner swim directly in front of me so I can practice drafting as well as having them swim right on my heels so I get used to being crowded. 

                         

                        I'd like to know where you swim if this ^^^ doesn't happen from time to time? At my local YMCa they usuallt have ywo lanes open and have to share a lane with a swimmer or two quite often so if I know the other person is close to my pace, we agree to circle swim and draft off of each other.

                         

                        The pain that hurts the worse is the imagined pain. One of the most difficult arts of racing is learning to ignore the imagined pain and just live with the present pain (which is always bearable.) - Jeff

                         

                        2014 Goals:

                         

                        Stay healthy

                        Enjoy life

                         

                        dmfitz2


                          Hasn't happened once yet.  I swim @ LA Fitness, 4 lane lap pool.  I hope i'm not jinxing myself, but there is always at least one open lane.

                           

                           

                          I'd like to know where you swim if this ^^^ doesn't happen from time to time? At my local YMCa they usuallt have ywo lanes open and have to share a lane with a swimmer or two quite often so if I know the other person is close to my pace, we agree to circle swim and draft off of each other.

                           

                          t

                          Fitz

                          ___________________________________________________________

                          00:20:20 5k (2008)

                          1:47:00 Half Marathon (2009)

                          4:00:45 Marathon (2011)

                          2013 Goals

                          Steelhead 1/2 Ironman 8/4/13 (6:32:24)

                          Sub 4:00 Chicago Marathon 10/13/13

                           

                            I'm surprised the Part IV hasn't come out yet.  I'll keep watching for it, and post the link when I see it.

                             

                            Amores, yes, there are jerks who make things personal when it's not personal (just like some of the threads here on RA Smile... ).  Contact is inevitable.  I've never run across anybody like that during a race though.  I've even given my Canadian accented "sorry" mid stroke on occasion.

                             

                            dmfitz2, I like the idea of the dark goggles and training aids.  I've struggled with spotting too often in open water.  Although I believe in a 25 yard pool with ropes on the sides of each lane, you'll hardly feel the "freedom" that you're trying to simulate with the dark goggles.  For the drafting, I've seen triathlon teams do drills with 4 equally paced athletes going toe to finger.  The lead swimmer leads 50, and then rests as the 2nd swimmer takes the lead and the former lead swimmer joins in at 4th.  I've seen them do a 10 - 15 minute continuous drafting drill that looks pretty slick.

                            2019 Goals:

                            #1: Do what I can do (250+ training days, 300+ aerobic hours).

                            #2: Race (Hurt the Dirt 1/2 marathon - 4/27, Grand Rapids Tri 70.3 - 6/9, MSU Gran Fondo - 6/22, ODRAM - 8/10, Michigan Titanium 70.3 - 8/18, Grand Rapids Marathon - 10/20)

                             

                              For sighting I've read a tip where if you have access to a pool that doesn't have lane dividers or a pool that will let you move them during low attencence time, you can have a buddy or lifeguard stand at one end otf the pool and move to different spots on the deck as you come off the opposite wall. That way when you come up after the push off, you have to look for the person and change your direction to swim towards them.

                               

                              The pain that hurts the worse is the imagined pain. One of the most difficult arts of racing is learning to ignore the imagined pain and just live with the present pain (which is always bearable.) - Jeff

                               

                              2014 Goals:

                               

                              Stay healthy

                              Enjoy life

                               

                                2019 Goals:

                                #1: Do what I can do (250+ training days, 300+ aerobic hours).

                                #2: Race (Hurt the Dirt 1/2 marathon - 4/27, Grand Rapids Tri 70.3 - 6/9, MSU Gran Fondo - 6/22, ODRAM - 8/10, Michigan Titanium 70.3 - 8/18, Grand Rapids Marathon - 10/20)

                                 

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