Sub-4 Marathon Group

Hanson & Pfitz Discussion (Read 381 times)

jedigunnie26.2


BQ in 2013

    it's all part of the cumulative fatigue factor and they say it feels like the last 16m of your race not the first 16. I'm very excited to work with this plan.

     

    I think part of it also has to do with being recovered enough to hit your paces hard enough on speedwork days.  The other part of it is that Hansons has you running your LR faster - at basically GMP+30 seconds, for the whole thing.  I think that takes more out of you than doing 20 at easy pace.

     

    I don't know that I could run 20 at 9:06 on Sunday and then hit 3 miles of 5k paced stuff (7:20) on Tuesday and then do up to 10 miles at MP (8:30) plus wu/cd on Thursday.  But if I were doing it at easy pace, that's a different story.

     

    PR's - 5K - 20:15 (2013) | 10K - 45:14 (2011)  | 13.1 - 1:34:40 (2013)  | 26.2 - 3:47:47 (2012)

     

    2013 Goals - 3000 miles (940m May'13) | sub20 5k | sub 43 10K  | sub1:35 13.1 | sub 3:15 26.2

     

    2013

    Saginaw 5k - 1/19/13 - 20:15 PR

    Chambersburg Half Marathon - 3/9/13 - 1:36:22 PR

    Frederick Half Marathon - 5/5/13 - 1:34:40 PR

     

    Up Next:

    Shippensburg Fair 5k - 7/27/13

    RnR Philadelphia Half Marathon - 9/15/13

    Philadelphia Marathon - 11/17/13

    onemile


      hehe now I'm getting scared Joking

       

       

      I'm starting to think Onemile and me are the same person... Or if I were female, I would be Onemile (just not as pretty Big grin.)


      Bad Ass

        Which is why I'm not sure Hanson is for me. I understand the strategy but I was more responding to other comments about 3 hours being the maximum anybody should run. I disagree with that. In his plan, it makes sense because of the hard workouts.

         

         

        I think part of it also has to do with being recovered enough to hit your paces hard enough on speedwork days.  The other part of it is that Hansons has you running your LR faster - at basically GMP+30 seconds, for the whole thing.  I think that takes more out of you than doing 20 at easy pace.

         

        I don't know that I could run 20 at 9:06 on Sunday and then hit 3 miles of 5k paced stuff (7:20) on Tuesday and then do up to 10 miles at MP (8:30) plus wu/cd on Thursday.  But if I were doing it at easy pace, that's a different story.

         

        Damaris, Marathon Maniac, Ultra Runner

        Next:  RnR Country Music Half Marathon

        Blog

        "The most powerful weapon on earth is the human soul on fire."


        Bad Ass

          I can attest onemile is pretty; I cannot attest as to Cbus' physical attributes but if his avi is any indication, they do not look anything alike. Joking

          Damaris, Marathon Maniac, Ultra Runner

          Next:  RnR Country Music Half Marathon

          Blog

          "The most powerful weapon on earth is the human soul on fire."

          onemile


            Actually, it might be exactly the reason why Hanson is for you.  You obviously have the endurance from all the long runs that you've been doing for the past few years.

             

            I don't think the Hansons plan fits the way I want to run but I think you improve the most when you step outside of your comfort zone and change things up.

             

            Which is why I'm not sure Hanson is for me. I understand the strategy but I was more responding to other comments about 3 hours being the maximum anybody should run. I disagree with that. In his plan, it makes sense because of the hard workouts.

             

             


            Bad Ass

              I agree in part. Until I'm capable of finishing a tempo run without having an asthma attack, I will not feel ready to tackle Hanson. I did finish 4 miles @ HMP without any issues, so I'm getting there.

               

               

              Actually, it might be exactly the reason why Hanson is for you.  You obviously have the endurance from all the long runs that you've been doing for the past few years.

               

              I don't think the Hansons plan fits the way I want to run but I think you improve the most when you step outside of your comfort zone and change things up.

               

              Damaris, Marathon Maniac, Ultra Runner

              Next:  RnR Country Music Half Marathon

              Blog

              "The most powerful weapon on earth is the human soul on fire."


              Bad Ass

                Forgot to say that I like Hanson because of the high mileage.

                Damaris, Marathon Maniac, Ultra Runner

                Next:  RnR Country Music Half Marathon

                Blog

                "The most powerful weapon on earth is the human soul on fire."

                onemile


                  That makes sense except Hansons doesn't really include any tempo paced stuff.  There are 5k paced intervals and then later on longer intervals at MP-10 seconds per mile. But they are not continuous tempo runs.  And nothing as long as 4 miles. It's more like 3x2 miles at MP-10 seconds per mile.

                   

                  I agree in part. Until I'm capable of finishing a tempo run without having an asthma attack, I will not feel ready to tackle Hanson. I did finish 4 miles @ HMP without any issues, so I'm getting there.

                   

                   


                  Bad Ass

                    I know but last time I did Daniels last year, I realized that too much fast running affects my asthma, which is why Pfitz fits me.  It has gotten better, but after any hard effort my breathing capacity goes down and I cough a lot for a few days.  Too much of that and the attacks start. Ni don't feel as strong yet.

                     

                    That makes sense except Hansons doesn't really include any tempo paced stuff.  There are 5k paced intervals and then later on longer intervals at MP-10 seconds per mile. But they are not continuous tempo runs.  And nothing as long as 4 miles. It's more like 3x2 miles at MP-10 seconds per mile.

                     

                    Damaris, Marathon Maniac, Ultra Runner

                    Next:  RnR Country Music Half Marathon

                    Blog

                    "The most powerful weapon on earth is the human soul on fire."

                    DetroitTigerFan


                      What do you all think of Hanson's tune up race position?  they kind of shy away from it where it's more integral in the Pfitz plan - so what are all your thoughts on this ?

                      PB's     10K 47:15 (9/13)     HM 1:45 (9/13)     M 3:57 (10/13)

                      Running Blog   http://davesdigitaldestinations.blogspot.com/


                      Canuck

                        Honestly, I'm kind of ignoring their don't race too much during training point.  I don't think it is that hard to work around races in training, and doing what I'm doing, which is 4 races in 17 weeks of training really isn't that big a deal.  Racing every couple of weeks on the other hand might be problematic.  Races provide valuable feedback on your fitness level and excellent training stimulus - I consider the HM race 4-5 weeks before the full to be pretty essential as it helps you set a realistic goal for your marathon.  Shorter races are easy to work around - i.e. in a couple of weeks I'm doing a 15K race on Sunday.  The only difference in my week is moving the easy 8 miles scheduled for Sunday to Thursday and  then doing the 15K race instead of 9 miles with 6 @ MP.

                        PRs: 47:54 (10K); 1:46:36 (HM); 3:50:52 (FM)

                        Recovering from injured knee (PCL/Lateral Meniscus)

                        onemile


                          I think they just don't want you to disrupt your workout schedule too much.  I'm planning to do two races.  A 15k near the end of the 5k paced stuff and a half marathon 4 weeks before my marathon.


                          Smashy!!!

                            What do you all think of Hanson's tune up race position?  they kind of shy away from it where it's more integral in the Pfitz plan - so what are all your thoughts on this ?

                             

                            I'm with Zoe and Onemile. I don't race a whole lot, but I definitely plan on doing a fall half. Even though they caution against disrupting the schedule with races, they also give you guidelines on how to modify the week to fit in a race.

                            PRs: 21:35 (5K); 1:46:46 (HM); 4:30:46 (FM)

                            jedigunnie26.2


                            BQ in 2013

                               

                              I'm with Zoe and Onemile. I don't race a whole lot, but I definitely plan on doing a fall half. Even though they caution against disrupting the schedule with races, they also give you guidelines on how to modify the week to fit in a race.

                               

                              ^This. I like do ing a tune-up Hm before a full in a cycle. Not a lot of shorter races if marathon training as I like to keep it focused on marathon training.

                              PR's - 5K - 20:15 (2013) | 10K - 45:14 (2011)  | 13.1 - 1:34:40 (2013)  | 26.2 - 3:47:47 (2012)

                               

                              2013 Goals - 3000 miles (940m May'13) | sub20 5k | sub 43 10K  | sub1:35 13.1 | sub 3:15 26.2

                               

                              2013

                              Saginaw 5k - 1/19/13 - 20:15 PR

                              Chambersburg Half Marathon - 3/9/13 - 1:36:22 PR

                              Frederick Half Marathon - 5/5/13 - 1:34:40 PR

                               

                              Up Next:

                              Shippensburg Fair 5k - 7/27/13

                              RnR Philadelphia Half Marathon - 9/15/13

                              Philadelphia Marathon - 11/17/13

                              DetroitTigerFan


                                Thanks everyone for the thoughts on tune ups. I had another question for you. This one is in regard to training paces.

                                 

                                The Hansons book is pretty straight forward in my opinion with regard to paces.  For those of you using Pfitz, how are you determining your training paces?  Once you know your current performance, are you simply using the McMillian calculator, or running solely by the heart rate intensity goals spelled out by Pfitz, a combination of things, or something else..  Thanks !

                                PB's     10K 47:15 (9/13)     HM 1:45 (9/13)     M 3:57 (10/13)

                                Running Blog   http://davesdigitaldestinations.blogspot.com/