?? for those who have used Galloway (Read 1535 times)

I used the Galloway program. Like any program, it's not for everyone. Being a fast marathoner does not, in any way, make a person an expert on what particular program will work for an unknown person. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but as a disabled person, I also object to the use of the word "retarded" in this situation. Retardation, like any other disability, is not a laughing matter and the term should not be used to describe a strategy you disagree with. In addition, as a disabled person who has used the Galloway program with success, I do not appreciate my strategies being called retarded by anyone, even a faster runner. Like it or not, it works for some people.

My training partner wants to run rather than run/walk - is this possible? It seems crazy to me to run 2 - 3 X 4 mi a week and then a long run that peaks at 26 mi! OTOH, she's a lot younger than I am, more naturally athletic, and has a job that keeps her walking about 10 mi per shift. My plan is to go along on the 3 - 4 days a week that Galloway specifies, but add my own longer runs 2 days a week. This is for Disneyworld '09. I'm currently at a bit over 25 mpw but ramping up to 30 - 35 mpw where I'll probably stay until we start ramping up in June (for me, up to 54 mpw). Arla

Yes, getting 70% of your weekly mileage on your long run seems a bit nuts. I am not sure whether or not that is exactly what Galloway recommends. I can say it is frustrating to hear what Galloway recomends when I know sure as sheet that he did not do that crap himself. He happened to have trained with a more traditional high mileage plan, with plenty of intensity. And it worked. Really well. Go figure. I do know a fellow who probably averaged 1.5 runs a week. The only run he did consistently was the long run. He was fantastically talented, in my opinion. He ran a 3:02 on that "training", having previously done a 4:00 and 3:30 marathon on maximum long runs of 10 and 13 miles, respectively. A year after that marathon, based almost entirely on his talent, with a maximum long run of about 13 miles, he ran a 3:04 marathon. It disgusted me that he could run so well on so little training. I really don't know anyone else anywhere who can do that. If you want to finish a marathon well and without hurting yourself, just run as much as you conveniently can, and as often, with some good long-runs in the 3 hour or 20 mile range. It's not that complicated. You'll be OK. If you want to find some kind of shortcut... start praying for good genes. One thing I hear from you that is very smart - you are starting early. You will do just fine. Don't wait. Train now.

Arla (my favorite name! ;o)): Well, if I say what I'm about to say, which I'm going to say it anyways (;o)), Willamona is going to yell at me (and that's why I like her!)... Some folks (most of them) like to see a cookie-cutter schedule and try to follow it blindly. Everybody is different; not just height, weight, length of legs, etc...but also background of activities (not necessarily just running) and life style as well (as you said, Arla, like in the case of your friend) and you'd have to accommodate your training accordingly. I post this somewhere on the other thread(s) but I prescribed my wife very similar training program for her first marathon--a super long run on weekend, somewhere around 80% of total weekly mileage, and only a few other easy jogs during the week and, boom, sub-4 marathon! Okay, I should say it a bit differently; to be honest with you, I don't necessarily think 3:50 is that terrific. She basically "survived" marathon; but that's fine--that's what she wanted. She was very similar to your friend's situation; her job was quite demanding at the time and, I don't know if it amounted up to 10-mile but, she was on her feet a lot. Anything that required more running than what she did might have tired her out too much. She was a classic "jogger". Sure, she'd run up to 2-hour but probably twice before she thought about running a marathon. With that background, she did a 10-week program. Now that's not a long time; but I didn't want her to "burn out" mentally so, with her background, I figured 10-weeks would be good enough to keep her mentally enthused while she would build up to 3-hour gradually. This is pretty much Galloway's concept. Now, Jeff is a very nice guy and he is very knowledgable of what he's talking about. I fully understand that he didn't do what he preaches but you've also got to realize that the situation is quite different. You're talking about Jeff Galloway the Olympian (what time did he run? 28:10ish for 10000?) vs. people who want to run/survive a marathon for the sake of saying they've run one (nothing wrong with that!). He's not trying to produce another Olympian; he's accommodating people who want to run a marathon from (almost) zero. For that, in my opinion, he does know what he's dealing with. Pretty much the only thing I disagree with him is that he believes the longest run should be beyond marathon distance (I can't remember if he pushes that idea to everybody) whereas I feel 3-hour is enough regardless of how far it might be. Now, I've written this somewhere else again but, if I coach someone to become a marathon runner, I would approach it very differently. But we're dealing with people who are currently running somewhere around 20~30MPW and want to run a marathon in May (or whenever). I happen to believe that motivation is a very important part of running. If someone comes to me and tells me that his/her goal is to run Twin Cities Marathon this fall and he/she just started running a few months ago and now about 20MPW; well, most likely, I would see if it's attainable or not and, if the person is a healthy young person, I would try to accommodate his/her wish as much as possible. I may not do so and may try to recommend to shoot for Grandma's (June) if the person is, say, 50-year-old who had never done anything active. So my short answer (after going on and on and on...) to your original question, Arla, would be YES (sure, why not! ;o)). Now, the only concern I might actually have is the fact that she "walks around 10-miles everyday". That's a lot of walking (whatever she does). To me, that much walking would tighten my legs up so badly. In such case, the best solution to loosen them up would be a nice easy jogging. If she comes home and complain about tight muscles in her legs, I would prescribe some easy jogging--even 15 minutes a day--just to loosen up. Don't even consider that as "training"; but just loosening up. On the other hand, if that much physical activity at the end of the day is absolutely tire her out (note they are different feelings); I would just keep it couple of days of easy jogging of 2~3 miles during the week and concentrate on weekend's long runs as originally planned. Such life style does make a big difference. I've heard of this one guy who was a world record holder for a couple of events. He claims he never used weight training. Well, he's a carpenter and carried heavy bricks up and down the ladder all the time! Life style DOES make a difference. On a different note; I've read an article about something like "2:40 marathon with 20MPW training". It turned out, the guy who advocate this program was a former world class runner who had thousands of miles under his legs over years. Background does make a difference as well.

Nobby, EXCELLENT post. So many people overlook who the audience is for some training pgms. Pretty much the only thing I disagree with him is that he believes the longest run should be beyond marathon distance (I can't remember if he pushes that idea to everybody) whereas I feel 3-hour is enough regardless of how far it might be. I think I remember some of his programs might only go as far as marathon distance and not overdistance. I can't remember if I've seen any shorter. Now, I've written this somewhere else again but, if I coach someone to become a marathon runner, I would approach it very differently. But we're dealing with people who are currently running somewhere around 20~30MPW and want to run a marathon in May (or whenever). I happen to believe that motivation is a very important part of running. If someone comes to me and tells me that his/her goal is to run Twin Cities Marathon this fall and he/she just started running a few months ago and now about 20MPW; well, most likely, I would see if it's attainable or not and, if the person is a healthy young person, I would try to accommodate his/her wish as much as possible. I may not do so and may try to recommend to shoot for Grandma's (June) if the person is, say, 50-year-old who had never done anything active. Was this cut / pasted from an earlier post, like last summer or spring - so that Grandma's is farther away than Twin Cities? It sounds like you're putting the 50 yo, inactive person on the fast track to marathon in 5 months while the younger person who has been running gets a slower track - or maybe I'm reading / interpreting something wrong?

Galloway has some of the worst programs out there. They are a great formula for injury. Hal Higdon is a close second.

Just as Jeff Galloway himself will tell you, if you don't think his program works for you, don't use it. He has no qualms allowing runners to go for test drives using his plan. I know quite a few Galloway runners and the injury rate is much lower among us than when I'm talking to runners using other plans. That doesn't make his better. But I do feel much safer using Galloway. Fact of the matter is the injury rate in Galloway programs is very small. Thousands of runners have completed marathons, half marathons, 10k's and even 5k's using his plan whom otherwise may not have even began running at all. And yes, he has made money training people how to run injury free. I haven't noticed Pfitzinger, which is a great plan for those who use it, giving away his books and advice. If you don't like Galloway, don't use his plan. It's just not an issue with him or those of us who benefit from his training methods.

[hijack] GaReb770, some folks have inquired about you & probably would enjoy hearing from you... http://chrunners.net/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=431e5979ab7ce68588c20ec94505ba6a&topic=545.0 [/hijack]

Thanks Nobby, very reasoned thinking. Time on feet + young/athletic + learn to do long runs might well be a recipe for success. Still, I think I'll encourage her to use a few walk breaks (say, here's a drinking fountain...). FWIW, she's an emergency medicine resident - lots of fast walking interspersed with standing. A couple of the residents have been wearing pedometers and they're consistently getting around 10 mi a shift (not a surprise - they have 12 hrs per shift to complete the mileage). I'll ask her if she's stiff after a shift. Interestingly, all those residents wear these really hard-soled Dansko clogs, I tried some when I was feeling a bit of PF coming on, and voila! Fixed it. BTW, Nobby, I bought one of Lydiard's books, "Running with Lydiard". At first I thought "not much here", until I let the things he's written really digest. Lots of good stuff, it turns out. His description of how to use hills for resistance exercise is really helpful. Arla

I don't take a short cut like that! ;o) Do I??? No, I didn't in this case but thanks for pointing it out. You're right; my "recommendation" seems that way, doesn't it? I've meant Grandma's marathon in June NEXT YEAR! It IS possible for some to shoot for Grandma's this year depending on their background of training (like the case of my wife before she started training for her first marathon).

OK, got it. That makes more sense now. And make the 0 to marathon time about 1.5 years. Thanks. Yea, usually cut&pasted stuff usually has some indicators (italics, quotes, whatever), but it looked like you were sending us older folks running off the gangplank to the deep water. Just do it and get it over with.