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Sub-3:30 Marathon in 2012 (Read 1502 times)

MJBarry


King of wishful thinking

    Work always makes sticking to a plan pretty tough so the weekend will probably the key part of any schedule. I like the idea of doubling Saturday distance on the Sunday building up to a 10/20 weekend as has been suggested. I'm toying with the idea of doing a 40 mile race later in the year to mark my 40th birthday. I've been told the best training is back to back long runs over the weekend so this should be a gentle intro to that.

     

    I'm going to try a tempo 5k on Saturday morning to gauge post marathon fitness.

      Count me in for 2012!

      2013 Goals

      • 5K-20:00
      • 10K-44:00
      • 1/2 Marathon-1:38
      • Marathon-3:30
      • Complete 50 Miler

       

      Julia1971


        That's a great marathon time, and the *right* way around compared with your other race PRs. There seem to be a lot of people who run slightly faster for a half, but are 10-20 min slower for the full. Is this down to total weekly mileage, I wonder? Were you following the 18/70-85 plan to run 3:27?

         

        The half time in my signature is from September.  So, it's representative of the fitness I've lost the last couple months.  It was rather sad realizing I was at a point where I was running a half at a slower pace than I was running a full 6 months earlier.

         

        I did follow the Pfitz 18/70-85 for the 3:27.  I had done the 50-70 mpw plan the year before (3:38) and wanted to try the harder plan.  I ran 50-60 mpw over the summer/fall to build my base before starting it.  Still, the plan was tough.  I think the toughest part was that there aren't any days off in the plan.  It ends up being a lot of laundry over 18 weeks.

         

        ETA:  In case you were wondering about the 10K time, it was from my "fitter" days but I was hung over.  Smile

        Run the mile you are in.

          Perhaps if Trent ever gets over his PF, he will make a run at this.


          HobbyJogger & HobbyRacer

            Perhaps if Trent ever gets over his PF, he will make a run at this.

             

            On a conveniently local park course, that he can get in for free?

            It's a 5k. It hurt like hell...then I tried to pick it up. The end.


            Prince of Fatness

              Maybe.

              Semi-retired.

              heather85


                The half time in my signature is from September.  So, it's representative of the fitness I've lost the last couple months.  It was rather sad realizing I was at a point where I was running a half at a slower pace than I was running a full 6 months earlier.

                 

                I did follow the Pfitz 18/70-85 for the 3:27.  I had done the 50-70 mpw plan the year before (3:38) and wanted to try the harder plan.  I ran 50-60 mpw over the summer/fall to build my base before starting it.  Still, the plan was tough.  I think the toughest part was that there aren't any days off in the plan.  It ends up being a lot of laundry over 18 weeks.

                 

                ETA:  In case you were wondering about the 10K time, it was from my "fitter" days but I was hung over.  Smile

                 

                Try running a 5K at notably slower pace than the full - was there. But it wasn't even on the top 10 of slowest 5ks I've done in my running life (or even post first year running life) so I knew/know I can get back.

                 

                My PR is 3:40 but I was sick before hitting the start line (no, really).  I'm not even there now.  Losing the extra weight is going to help a lot, though.  Also - figuring out fueling.  I lost 5 minutes in portopotties in my PR marathon (and so many others) so if I can figure that out it will help.

                 

                I am not sure what race I will be targeting yet.   I am thinking about using Pfizinger 18/85+ but it depends on where I am when I get to time to start training.  It's slightly higher mileage than my previous PR training cycle.


                Consistently Slow

                  OK, stop terrifying me with the 250+ monthly mileage. Shocked It was hard hitting 45 -50 mph. I need to drop 8 minutes on a fast course with prefect weather. Hey , no one said it would be easy.  Heading out the door for  nearly 2 hours. Bye.

                  Run until the trail runs out.

                  2013***1500 miles

                  50 miler

                  Race Less Train More

                   

                  Ana Trason  "Living Her Life"

                  "The Marble in The Groove"

                   

                  unsolicited chatter

                  http://bkclay.blogspot.com/


                  hairshirt knitter

                    OK, stop terrifying me with the 250+ monthly mileage. Shocked It was hard hitting 45 -50 mph. I need to drop 8 minutes on a fast course with prefect weather. Hey , no one said it would be easy.  Heading out the door for  nearly 2 hours. Bye.

                     

                    I know! Crikey, some of those plans are *tough*. I think overall mileage is the simple truth though.

                     

                    At our kind of level, improving *generally* as a runner, by consistent mileage and a bit of pace work is going to bring race times down at all distances, not only marathon. Smart consistent running at a low enough mileage level that you don't get injured or burnt out. I imagine that that is going to hold true through sub-3:15, after that I suspect that it's down to good genes and pushing the injury risk?

                     

                    Overall mileage though has to be high enough to give you the confidence to handle running long at pace. Key sessions for me seem to be:

                     

                    1. 'theshold' - tempo run with some or all at or near goal marathon pace, which becomes your mid-week longish run and through which you learn what your gmp currently is.

                     

                    *edit* actually, this isn't threshold at all - getting confused with current 1/2m training! Should have read:

                     

                    1. 'threshold' - tempo run with some or all at or near half-marathon pace, about 10km

                    2. 'gmp' - goal marathon pace, which becomes the mid-week longish run

                    3. 'V02max' - 400-1600m intervals with shortish recovery - not so hard, or so many, that you knock your pan in

                    4. 'long' run.

                     

                    Everything else can be recovery easy pace.

                     

                    What you think?

                       I think overall mileage is the simple truth though.

                       

                      Smart consistent running at a low enough mileage level that you don't get injured

                       

                      Overall mileage though has to be high enough to give you the confidence to handle running long at pace.

                       

                      What you think?

                       

                      From someone with similar age, mileage and PRs, your lines echo what I've experienced. 

                       

                      Pfitz 18/70, plus starting with a bigger base, made a big difference over Pfitz 18/55 for me.  But I overdid it mid-cycle, got injured and had to cut back for the last 6 weeks.  Still squeaked out 3:39+.  I think 3:30 could be in the cards if I can learn how to better balance the mileage/intensity/injury factors.  Essentially the same thing you're saying. 

                       

                      Oh - being more serious about the cross training, especially core, seemed to make a big difference too.

                       

                      Do you know the feeling I know? When your legs have disappeared, and there is only your heart, your lungs, and your eyes skimming disembodied through the air? - Jeff

                        AXes -- how would you rate Flying Pig?  (And don't be a homer about it!)  I'm casually looking for a late-spring marathon -- maybe -- and that one's on my short list, based on what little I know of it.

                        “Everything you need is already inside.” -- Bill Bowerman

                        xor


                          The pig is a fun course with great aid, lots of spectators, significant hillage in the middle, and nice down-ish miles at the end.  I've never done well with it as a Go Fast, but I know people who have.

                           

                          Good expo and swag.  And the bridges in Cincy are fun to see (and you run over a couple of them)

                           

                          xor


                            Oh, and I'm in.  One last time.

                             

                            Boston.

                             

                              AXes -- how would you rate Flying Pig?  (And don't be a homer about it!)  I'm casually looking for a late-spring marathon -- maybe -- and that one's on my short list, based on what little I know of it.

                               

                              Basically what SRL said. I've only run it once and am not a homer, but would add/emphasize: Great crowd support. It rained this year and they were still out by the thousands. Early hills are big but not that bad. Late area of desolate highway, though downhill, was worse. Nice bonus of Red's ballpark located at the start meant real bathrooms galore. If I was doing a spring marathon, I'd do it again. Others on here have more experience with it and gave me advice last year. Not sure but maybe BCR and Trent? MTA: oh and the cops tased and cuffed a naked runner. So keep your shorts on.

                               

                              Do you know the feeling I know? When your legs have disappeared, and there is only your heart, your lungs, and your eyes skimming disembodied through the air? - Jeff

                                Oh - being more serious about the cross training, especially core, seemed to make a big difference too.

                                 I think so too.  I'm shopping online for a used exercise bike as I no longer have my gym membership.  I lost 8% body fat in 6 weeks (and only 4lb!) when I was doing 30 minutes of strength training 3x per week, and biking for 90 mins a week.  If you're 125 pounds, such a body fat reduction is really noticable.  Now I'm the same weight, with the extra fat, it's real perty.  I swore that my intended speed increases with my running required a lot less effort and that I'd keep it up, but I didn't.  My next marathon didn't incorporate this, and I believe this is partly why I struggled through it. 

                                 

                                This will be my 5th, so my plan would be a culmination of lessons learned.  I'll call it the Gen-3:29 plan  :-)

                                 

                                Weekly tempo (7 mi+ @ 7:30 or less) OR long/short intervals, alternating. 

                                Three 10+ runs per week (2 is likely because of my schedule, we'll see)

                                Long runs up to 20 miles

                                Long run once a week is at least 15mi, no 10 then 16, then 10 then 18, then 10 then 20.  I think that was a bad plan, no running on tired legs, this is where you really improve

                                Hills every couple of weeks

                                 

                                As far as when to start, I'm theoretically already training for my April Boston appearance.  I have to train through snow coming up here and I want to have a strong base and tempos of that speed/distance already doable before I officially start (12 weeks before).

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