Lance Armstrong appears finally to have run out of rope. (Read 2696 times)

xor


    This thread may soon run out of rope.

     

    Or not.

     

    As for Ironman not being worthwhile enough to continue (theoretical) cheating, I dunno.  Rising toward the top of that game... doesn't even have to be the top of the top... keeps his name fresh, adds to the legacy, and brings in new endorsement deals - good for him, good for livestrong.

     

    All of which is also true w/o cheating, if he's good enough to do it.

     

    Some folks say he is; others do not.

     

    At his age and with what he's been through, at some point some of this just doesn't add up to me.  Unless Ironman is full of soft athletes (it absolutely is not) or he really is a superman.

     

    I dunno.  I'm tired of this being in the news, although honestly I think this remains more relevant than Clemens because LA has tried to remain more relevant than Clemens.

     

    Then again, I have now interacted with Lance twice and I know a number of folks who have either professionally or just around-and-about Austin.  Almost all of us say, "yeah, in real life, he's kind of a dick".  It would be a lie to say that doesn't impact how I feel.

     

      I guess for me, it's like this. Lance had a chance to be a leader in his sport and work with authorities to clean it up. It wouldn't have been easy, but I think he could have figured out how to do this without damaging his reputation as a hard worker, a powerful athlete, and a cancer survivor. Imagine if he could have added "anti-doping crusader" to this list of accomplishments.

       

      You're assuming that he never doped up to get the point in his career where he could be the lead cyclist on a team and win his first Tour victory, then the second, third, fourth etc. How do you become the "anti-doping crusader" if you doped right along with the rest of them?

       

      The pain that hurts the worse is the imagined pain. One of the most difficult arts of racing is learning to ignore the imagined pain and just live with the present pain (which is always bearable.) - Jeff

       

      2014 Goals:

       

      Stay healthy

      Enjoy life

       

        You're assuming that he never doped up to get the point in his career where he could be the lead cyclist on a team and win his first Tour victory, then the second, third, fourth etc. How do you become the "anti-doping crusader" if you doped right along with the rest of them?

         

        I am not making that assumption. I think he could make the same case that everyone is making for him: I did it because everyone was doing it. That doesn't make it right, and I want to make sure the next generation doesn't have to.


        A Dance with Monkeys

          If you really think this is not big deal, how would you feel to learn that you came in 2nd in the biggest race of your life because the guy who won skipped a couple of miles but was never caught? Does that put it into perspective for you?

           

          I think that this is the heart of the point that Jeff was making early on last night to me before my internet blew out.

           

          I see that point.

           

          I do NOT however see why that makes it a good use of federal taxpayer dollars in an age when federal support for healthcare, research, education and infrastructure are being trimmed aggressively. People are literally out there dying because they cannot afford healthcare or because we are not discovering treatments for age-old and new diseases, but we should be putting our pooled money into making sure that a bike race is fair? Maybe, but I don't share that perspective.

            I think that this is the heart of the point that Jeff was making early on last night to me before my internet blew out.

             

            Nope, not really.


            A Dance with Monkeys

              Paula Radcliffe.  An athlete who ran a few truly outlandish and freaky performances -- much freakier than Lance -- yet I believe to this day was completely clean.  Why?  In addition to passing all tests she had them freeze extra samples so they could go back at a later date and test them again when the testing methodology had been improved.  That's a heck of a gamble for someone to take if they are dirty.  Since that time they've developed the HGH test, among others.

               
              Yeah, but by the NEW rules, she cheated because she ran in races that men also ran in.


              A Dance with Monkeys

                This is actually a very efficient way to spend money because if you can actually convict Lance Armstrong, a known doper, and strip him of his titles despite his fame, then you can discourage the practice of doping much more effectively.

                 

                Lance is a living symbol of the fact that up until now doping has been worth it. Cheating and encouraging others to cheat, distributing drugs to his fellow cyclists, and other illegal activities made him millions of dollars and earned him the adulation of people all across the world. 

                 

                This was the argument.

                  This thread may soon run out of rope.

                   

                  Yep. 

                   

                  Maybe we can talk about how his creepy fling with Ashley Olsen. 

                    This was the argument.

                     

                    A little bit like coming down hard on the Saints despite the fact that most people believe some version of the bounty system is very common in the NFL.  And I agree with the argument despite understanding why Lance may have done what he did and how much he means/has meant to a lot of people.  If you don't draw the line here it's a slippery slope, and you can argue that it's very much about protecting kids, just like football. 

                     

                    DoppleBock


                      For me ~ Marion Jones broke my heart - She had that crooked - infectious smile.  Seemed like an all american girl I just wanted to win ~ Damn Doper.   

                      http://a-big-horse.blogspot.com/ 

                      2013 Goals ~ Mar < 3:00, 5M < 29, 10k < 35  

                       

                        A little bit like coming down hard on the Saints despite the fact that most people believe some version of the bounty system is very common in the NFL.  And I agree with the argument despite understanding why Lance may have done what he did and how much he means/has meant to a lot of people.  If you don't draw the line here it's a slippery slope, and you can argue that it's very much about protecting kids, just like football. 

                         

                        At first I didn't get the comparison with the Saints, because they were hurting others. But, so was LA.  All those second place finishers will have the TDF crown drop to their laps, but that is not the same as breaking the tape, standing on the podium. He hurt others.  He took something right out their hands.  For the first time, I am actually angry with the guy.  

                        "If you have the fire, run..." -John Climacus

                          At first I didn't get the comparison with the Saints, because they were hurting others. But, so was LA.  All those second place finishers will have the TDF crown drop to their laps, but that is not the same as breaking the tape, standing on the podium. He hurt others.  He took something right out their hands.  For the first time, I am actually angry with the guy.  

                           

                          Hard to take away the podium moment and give it back to the guy who earned it. 

                           

                          In an infinite universe, the one thing sentient life cannot afford to have is a sense of proportion

                          http://htwins.net/scale2/scale2.swf?bordercolor=white&fb_source=message

                           

                           

                           

                          DoppleBock


                            At least Michael Phelps is just an "all Natural" doper (Maybe)

                             

                            I would suspect Mr Bolt is not "Lifetime" Ganja free either

                             

                            I gave up on having heros a long time ago.

                             

                            There are a few people I admire ~ But those people I admire for a specific reason and not the whole package. 

                             

                            I admire Lebron ~ How the hell do you keep your head on so straight and stay out of trouble having a gazzilion dollars and so much fame at a young age ~ I would have been dead before my 21st B-Day.

                             

                            I admire Ryan Hall ~ Having convictions so strong you don't give a shit of what other people think ~ You are going to do what you think you need to do.

                             

                            I admire Brett Farve ~ Giving your heart and soul into every game with reckless regard to your health or what tomorrow may bring (He was one screwed up man in earlier GB days  Winters. Chewy and Favre were man-slut party animals)

                             

                            I admire Both Nadal and Federer (tennis) - Federer for the exactness of a master technician,  Nadal for the energy and passion.

                             

                            I admire WG ~ For her extreme mental warefare abilities in getting you to continue slamming your head into the wall to finish on your feet.

                            http://a-big-horse.blogspot.com/ 

                            2013 Goals ~ Mar < 3:00, 5M < 29, 10k < 35  

                             

                              Maybe he left an incriminating donation at a French Red Cross outpost back in the day?

                              My wife says i have a short attention spanners are great, aren't they?