Is it all just a marketing Sham? (Read 1698 times)

You should, of course, apologize for calling me elite. Cuz that's just silly. Elitist-without-the-elite? Probably? Prick? Well, yeah. Here's my point: respect the distance. All marathoners know what it means, and all marathoners at one time or another have paid the price for not heeding that advice. And this original post annoyed me because it smacked of disrespect. Somebody who's never actually run a marathon goes out and runs an easy training run and then posts something that more or less calls into question the basic physiology of glycogen depletion. It sounded like - hey, marathons are easy! I was grumpy. So sue me. Marcus G got the main point I was trying to make: if you run slow enough - compared to YOUR ability - you won't hit the wall. Or you won't hit it until much later. Duh. As he said, that's ultramarathoning. And I can't believe Trent hasn't already posted his epic book on the subject. (He'd also have some interesting stuff to say on what its like to run a marathon, even slow, without the right hydration and nutrition, since he's had to do it when marathons fall on the Jewish Sabbath). While I was intentionally being a grumpy prick in calling Backstretch's run "really slow," the truth is that it really was slow - for him. If his 10k PR is accurate, he ought to be able to get close to a 3:40 marathon. And based on his mileage and consistency, I'll bet he can. (Or could ... if he respects the distance). That was my point - not that it was a slow pace by some objective standard. He went on a training run a full minute plus slower than his MP. And then wonders if the scientists got it all wrong and its all silly marketing. To which I giggled and then frowned grumpily.

OK - Here is my (light hearted) take - MAIL MAN SURVIVES IN DRIVE-BY SHOOTING A local mailman, Mr B. Stretch, had a lucky escape earlier today when he was saved from serious injury by a passer by. An eyewitness Mr I.B. Kiddin gave us this exclusive account - “I had just finished feeding my polecats when I heard an almighty commotion out in the road. I looked out and saw a car being driven at high speed with what appeared to some kind of simian at the wheel. As he passed he lit rip at the mailman with an automatic handgun through the open window of the car and with a screech of tyres fled the scene. If it had not been for the quick thinking of that fellow throwing himself in the way I dread to think what might have happened” The passer by who was believed to be on vacation from England was unavailable for comment at the time of going to press. Another neighbour, Mr Slight Lee de Ranged suggested that the incident was the work of a shadowy group that had a training camp in the local swamp. He went on – “We have seen a few of these incidents lately and I believe these apes are being indoctrinated into a cult and trained to do their bidding by some very bad men.” A friend of Mr Stretch who declined to be named believes that he has incurred the wrath of some very influential people by making wild claims about a new training programme he has devised. “Big companies are worried – jobs and profits are at stake and they want Mr Stretch silenced” Tonight someone purporting to be the assailant has posted on a little known website apologising to the innocent bystanders and challenging Mr Stretch to “put up or shut up.” Another member of the gang has also posted some of their beliefs, which advocates the use of the supplements that Mr Stretch has challenged and rejected. In a further astonishing development tonight it appears that the Englishman was no innocent bystander. Communications from London lead us to believe that he was in fact an agent that has been trying to infiltrate the group for some time. Little is still known about them but it is believed the sighting of a ‘Comet’ triggers these attacks. So far the agent has only been able to communicate with the group by using the trigger phrase ‘elitist prick’ and his investigations are still ongoing. Meanwhile Mr Stretch is being stoical about the attack. When asked if he had been injured at all he replied – “Hell No! I get my ass bitten every other day in this job. I’ll be back tomorrow pounding my lonely beat”

Good think you've got this whole marathon deal figure out on your first try. You should write a book and share your expertise with the world. My suggestion for your first chapter: "Obvious Stuff 101: If You Run Really, Really Slow, You Won' t Find The Wall." Send me royalties if you use that, mmm-kay?

yeah, this guy should try truly racing a marathon, not just doing a marathon-length easy run, and then come back and say that there was no wall

OK - Here is my (light hearted) take - MAIL MAN SURVIVES IN DRIVE-BY SHOOTING A local mailman, Mr B. Stretch, had a lucky escape earlier today when he was saved from serious injury by a passer by. An eyewitness Mr I.B. Kiddin gave us this exclusive account -

I literally just dribbled coffee out my nose laughing. That hurts. That was good. I'd call it "brilliant," but you goofy British types use that word way too much and in all the wrong places. So "coffee-out-the-nose-ha-ha" will be my word(s) of choice. One correction: one thing I didn't make clear to Mr. Stretch was that he arguably has a point if he's talking only about the high-tech products. Not that I don't love me some Gu, but a handful of pretzels or salted potatoes or an orange slice can usually serve as well as the hyped products. And God's greatest gift to runners, proof that he actually exists and loves us, is - of course - the banana. So clearly the simian in question doesn't work for the Cult of Accelerade, but is actually an agent of the Dole fruit company, Banana division. Also, apes don't use handguns. They fling poop. And WTF is a "tyre?" What is wrong with you people?

The "wall" is there. Run faster, you find it sooner. Run slower, you find it later. Think it's not there? Keep running. You'll find it.

Good think you've got this whole marathon deal figure out on your first try. You should write a book and share your expertise with the world. My suggestion for your first chapter: "Obvious Stuff 101: If You Run Really, Really Slow, You Won' t Find The Wall." Send me royalties if you use that, mmm-kay?

I'm starting to see the benefits of going slow. Do you use the standard 180-age formula? Do you use other metrics?

Fine. Here goes. Fuel for the Run, Fuel for the Race Energy Sources ....... Glycogen is the primary energy source used for fight or flight type activities, which means it is the primary energy source used when running hard. When you run above 80-90% of your maximum effort, your body is burning almost entirely glycogen to fuel the effort. Below that, your body starts using the second energy source, which is fat....... ...........Well, even if you carb load absolutely perfectly (and most of us do not), when you finish loading, you then go to bed and sleep. When you wake up marathon morning, your body has used up as much as 25-30% of your glycogen just keeping you alive overnight. .

The two points above seem to contradict each other. Why aren't we burning fat while sleeping instead of maybe as much as 30% of our fight or flight stores? Thanks for your sincere reply Trent, alot of information to digest, I'll have to reread it several times to fully understand it. Chris UK - I agree with Jake- Too funny man- You must be a writer- You've got a great imagination! Jake- I obviously would be just elated if your time predictions for myself were correct, but there is no way. Sub 4hrs is do-able though. I'll have all next year to shave off another 15 minutes. I really wasn't offended either. I took your comments, as I would when guys are just sitting around ribbing each other. Obviously the great majority of people around here know more about running than I, but I still think very few people are capable of burning up ALL their glycogen. I guess in my mind it is something like, yes you can burn 1 lb of fat running 26.2 miles. Problem is can you run 26.2 miles. Yes it is possible to burn all your Glycogen but you have to have the ability to run at 90% of your MAX speed for 20 miles..........which is another different thing in my opinion. It would be interesting if there was a stat on what pecentage of long distance runners have actually bonked.

Well two weeks previous I ran 25 miles and took a handful of gummie bears and a gu at about 18 miles, I didn't feel ant different. Two weeks before that I went 20 miles for the first time I took 1 gel and 1 gu and a handful of gummie bears the only thing I noticed is I had to fight off taking a dump for the last mile and was never so happy to arrive at my mom's house just in the nick of time. Albeit I wasn't running my hardest on any of the aforementioned runs.

Better yet, run two real marathons as hard as you can. One with gels and Gatorade and a decent breakfast, one without. Compare what happens. An experiment of one. Let us know the results.

LOL- Why not I'm already in the Scotia Bank Toronto Waterfront Marathon September 28th I'll just do the three week taper again and then run the Toronto Marathon October 19th. I was thinking about doing both anyway