Just joined the group. Will be coming up to the race from St. Louis, Mo. This is my second - First was the Phoenix Rock n Roll in January. Am wondering if too much too soon as I am starting to get a little fatigued with 12 weeks to go. Am hoping to improve on my 3:58 but if it is like last year no way. Any advice or encouragement is welcom.

I am using the smartcoach on Runner's World which has me running 4 days a week for someone running 25 - 30 miles. Last long run was two weeks ago at a little over 13 miles (cut it a little short). The program builds up to 35 - 40 miles with three 20 mile long runs. This week's long is 16 and starting to dread it already as I am feeling a bit fitagued. The program for the Phoenix was a Hal Higdon modified with two 20 mile runs and longest weekly mileage was just over 40 --- this program is a little lighter in that it has 4 running rather than 5. Started running in November 2005 (45 pounds ago) to get in shape for my daughter's senior father daughter dance.

Welcome Phil. Not sure if you are new to RA, but I have found this site very helpful. Looking through the forums, I have found Trents comments right on target. Haven't meet him yet, but maybe I'll run into him at Betty's. As you might know from this forum, this is my first marathon. Looking for a 4 hour time. I'm also using a RW smart coach guide, but it has me running 3 times a week. Trent has suggested I get a 4th day in, maybe right before the long run, but I haven't managed the time yet. My program has 2 - 20 milers. Long run this week is 16. The program has me gradually increasing my pace on the long runs, initially 9:52 min, and now 9:40 min. At the end, I beleive it gets to 9:16 min. I tend to read to much, and have found a lot of conflicting information out there. I have a science background, and like to have things proven....but never want to lose sight that the most important thing is to have fun and enjoy the experience. Trent, I tend to do "progressive" runs, and finish the final 2 or 3 miles of my long runs near my Marathon projected pace. What are your thoughts - Long slow runs (get your body used to running a long time) versus running some at faster pace (train slow and you'll run slow). Phil, how did it go in Phoenix? Did you fade at the end, or feel pretty good?

Thanks for the good advice and encouragement --- think I will move my training a notch down with the two 20 mile rather than the three as I am starting to feel burned out. My time in Phoenix was 3 hours 58 minutes and change --- I was shooting for under 4 and was pleased. My 20 mile pace was around 8:40 and the last 6.2 were 10 minutes + never felt really bad just gradually was slowing down. Weather in Phoenix was close to ideal around 32 at the start and never got above 45 which turned out to be very comfortable for the run.

10K was 53:26; half was 1:52:54; 20K was 2:55:15 --- fell off quiet a bit in the last 6.2 but was tracking the miles and knew what I needed to get under 4 hour so may have let up a bit. It was interesting reading your experience with the pacers as I was thinking maybe a 3:45 pace group would work but don't need to go out at a 8:10 pace. I suppose the really important thing is to feel good about the race and the experience and the time takes care of itself. Thanks for all the good information.