Swimmers

1

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RunFree7


Run like a kid again!

    I don't have any clue on how my times are or how to get my kick to be better. 

     

    I was doing easy 50m laps at 1:30 ish between 16 - 32 laps (800m - 1600m) and when I push myself (50 m intervals) I am in the 59 second range.  I know I am not fast but am I really slow?

     

    Also when I use the kick board and try to kick my way down the lane I go nowhere and I mean nowhere.  Not sure what I am doing wrong.  I am trying to point my feet and take short kicks.  I don't care to use the kick to much as I want to save that for the Bike and run but man when I try I should at least be able to go down the stupid lane just kicking right. 

      2011 Goals:
      Sub 19 5K (19:24 5K July 14th 2010)
      Marathon under 3:05:59 BQ (3:11:10 Indy 2010)
    Slo


      It takes time !  The speed will come.

       

      You haven't been swimming long right?.......Making imporvements in swimming comes is a series of small break thrus....and it just takes time in the water.

       

      I can not stress enough the importance of getting one on one lessons if you can. Else read, watch and emmulate everything you can. If you see a swimmer that looks fluid......try to see what they are doing. Including watching them under water.

       

      Re; the Kick.....I honestly worked with a guy who would go backwards when he kicked. He had this kick like he was peddaling a bike. Practice two things.....get your toes pointed to the wall, not the floor and pretending your legs have a steel rod that goes from your heal to your ass. In other words...they don't bend. Practice kicking this way (From your hips). Once you get some forward movement then you can relax your knees a little bit.

       

      It may help to use fins. Something else to consider......

      protoplasm72


        I agree with slo_hand.  A few technique improvements and you'll probably get significantly faster quickly.



        For your kick you are most likely bending your knees to much.  What muscles get tired when you do a lap kicking only?

        Son, when you participate in sporting events, it's not whether you win or lose; it's how drunk you get. -- Homer Simpson

        ironTriKev


        IronMan ;)

          I totally agree with the kick asessment.  It really comes from the hips.

          Tri-Kev Here are my favorite links:
          My "kick @ss" running club ;)

          Swim 2.4 miles.
          Ride 112 miles.
          Run 26.2 miles.
          Then brag for the rest of your life.
          -Commander John Collins, Ironman Triathlon creator

          RunFree7


          Run like a kid again!

            You guys rock it is so great to have a support group for swimming.  I know I have a lot to learn about swimming.  I am not a complete noob to swimming and can swim comfortably for as long as I want but I don't think my stroke is very efficient at this point.  Actually I know it is not.  I posted more about this on the general forum because it is also about the new watch that I purchased for swimming. 

             

            Someone asked about my muscles and how they felt after kicking a lap.  Since I go nowhere I don't ever finish a lap and I get to embarrassed to keep trying.   I quit pretty quickly.  It is really pretty sad.  I will keep trying and have been using the fins.  I think they will help in time.  I will do training laps on Friday and know I need to work with the fins and kicking the whole lap.  I think the 50 m intervals will help with that. 

             

            Do you think since I am doing this for a tri that it is a really bad thing not to be kicking the whole way?  I know it slows momentum some, especially since I do it at the worst possible moment (taking a breath) but I was thinking it might not be bad since I am mainly using them to keep a float. 

             

            No matter what though when I do kick I want it to help me as much as possible.

              2011 Goals:
              Sub 19 5K (19:24 5K July 14th 2010)
              Marathon under 3:05:59 BQ (3:11:10 Indy 2010)
            ironTriKev


            IronMan ;)

               

               

              Do you think since I am doing this for a tri that it is a really bad thing not to be kicking the whole way?  I know it slows momentum some, especially since I do it at the worst possible moment (taking a breath) but I was thinking it might not be bad since I am mainly using them to keep a float. 

               

               

               

              For a tri I think the kick is mostly  to maintain body position, i.e. keep you flat on the water so that you legs are not hanging low and producing drag. 

               

              When swimming in a tri (and mostly during practice) I have a pretty light kick, just enough to make me feel like my butt is riding on the surface of the water, that and keeping my head looking straight down seems to be enough to keep me flat.

              Tri-Kev Here are my favorite links:
              My "kick @ss" running club ;)

              Swim 2.4 miles.
              Ride 112 miles.
              Run 26.2 miles.
              Then brag for the rest of your life.
              -Commander John Collins, Ironman Triathlon creator

              Slo


                Heres my take on the kick. Based soley on my experience, reading and watching.

                 

                The leaner and longer you are the more important the kick becomes. The leaner you are the more your lower torso wants to sink. This is componded by your length. A lean 6 footers torso will sink lower than a lean 5 footer.

                 

                The whole minimize your kick thinking comes from conserving energy. Your legs contain your biggest muscles so less use of the legs = less energy consumed....simple enough. But if your legs are causing you more drag  because they are deeper in the water then how much energy are you saving by pulling them along? Regarding "saving" your legs.....I don't buy this. I've never come out of the water on tired legs....out of breath, ready to collapse but no weak legs.

                 

                If your a sinker then your kick is thought to actually be more effienct. Kinda like a boat prop in the water. A prop completely sumergered performs better than one with it's tips coming out of the water. When the blades come out of the water the prop cavitates. Your kick does the same thing. If your foot is breaking too much of the plane of the water your mixing too much air with the water and losing propulsion. Watch how deep sprinters swim and watch how hard they are kicking.

                 

                It's also taught that your kick is a very small part of the propulsion.....true but I wouldn't discount the overall effect of a good kick.

                 

                Kicking as it realtes to distance.

                 

                A sprint Tri is an all out effort.....I'm not trying to conserve anything.....I'm going to burn it all in the race. I'm throwing up a rooster tail !.........ok, the rooster tail may be exaggerating a little.

                 

                An Oly......A little border line....I don't swim all out but I don't come out of the water fresh either. It takes me a mile or two on the bike before I feel like I'm recovered. I also try to swim this as a negative split. I swim much harder in the final 3rd than I do in the first 3rd.

                 

                A Half.....Here I am conserving energy. My kick is greatly reduced.....to the point of being nothing more than a stablizer.

                 

                I've never done a full but it would be the same as a Half.

                 

                Bearcat.....If you can have someone shoot a video of you doing a kick drill and put it on Youtube I'll bet we can tell you exactly what your doing....or not doing.

                ironTriKev


                IronMan ;)

                  Yup, totally agree with Slo-hand, good points!

                  Tri-Kev Here are my favorite links:
                  My "kick @ss" running club ;)

                  Swim 2.4 miles.
                  Ride 112 miles.
                  Run 26.2 miles.
                  Then brag for the rest of your life.
                  -Commander John Collins, Ironman Triathlon creator

                  RunFree7


                  Run like a kid again!

                    Bearcat.....If you can have someone shoot a video of you doing a kick drill and put it on Youtube I'll bet we can tell you exactly what your doing....or not doing.

                     

                    I'm going to take you up on this!  I've been wanting to do this.  I want to also do this with my swim stroke. 

                     

                    Thanks for all of the great information.  I have a marathon in May and then a OLY Tri in July.  So I have time to get that kick figured out. 

                      2011 Goals:
                      Sub 19 5K (19:24 5K July 14th 2010)
                      Marathon under 3:05:59 BQ (3:11:10 Indy 2010)