Thanks Spaniel. Lots of wise stuff there, as always. Your sub-31 experience is a good one, and I'm going to keep reminding myself of that.I am terrible at mentally approaching things whether they be running, climbing, skiing, working, existing so it's definitely something I need to improve. Failure is something I do expect, and I don't mind it as such, I do mind letting people down, and sometimes that becomes interwoven with goals. Equally I can sometimes feel the blinkered, "I am going to fail" mentality when it needn't be there. I understand the fear in things that could be more risky (climbing, mountaineering, skiing) but less so in running...but in all of those it is still far better to assume success (with a reasonable level of realism and concern for safety where my or someone else's life could be at risk). Having said that, I can have days where the focus is right and I will push on. I just don't know what turns that on. Trial and error may find it. Feeling like I've done the work helps, as does a sense of competition (even if I don't like admitting that).As for the confiscating front. Sod that. If anything is going to make me change my attitude that is probably going to work. You can come over here and drink the whisky, but no loss of penguins and no confiscation.My choice is going to be to put some effort in, or punch myself in the throat. Both could hurt, but only one will be rewarding. To begin with, it will be something simple, 1-2 minutes faster, 1-2 slower...repeat. The odd tempo and/or fast finish. I've been here before, but it got lost somewhere in the build-up to the 30 miler and never came back due to laziness and then feeling like I was ill, then laziness/fear of getting all hurty hurty and tired. Skiing will screw with it, but after that I can come back, and not wuss out. The next few weeks are a bit of a mess in terms of getting in running due to trips away, but maybe that's a good time to break old routines a bit. Goals with that are just to put in the effort right now. My 5k PB at the moment is 23:44 or something like that (from my one and only 5k in 2010) and my 10k PB is 49:36 (my one and only 10k, again in 2010). Those need beating at some point. I'd like a sub-22 5k and a sub-45 10k at least. Those might sound slow, but not to me, and the 5k sounds harder than the 10k, but both are things I can push for only if I put in the work.In terms of entering races, that might happen too, even if the 10k is just as a tempo in a race environment (again). In the immediate future I just want to build a bit of confidence that, if I commit (and don't get injured), I can see progress (other than in my ability to stubbornly get out the door and run miles for the sake of miles).
"Don't walk in front of me; I may not follow. Don't walk behind me; I may not lead. Just walk beside me and be my friend."
Self anointed title
I'd like a sub-22 5k and a sub-45 10k at least. In terms of entering races, that might happen too, even if the 10k is just as a tempo in a race environment (again).
I'd like a sub-22 5k and a sub-45 10k at least.
In terms of entering races, that might happen too, even if the 10k is just as a tempo in a race environment (again).
Am I allowed to quote this in the UK group?
MTA: Damn. You've already done it. Well done Hoppity!
http://www.parkrun.org.uk/oxford/
Tomorrow's Saturday.
A list of my PRs in a misguided attempt to impress people that do not care.
When you called yesterday I was actually enjoying my first treadmill run over lunch at the new company gym facility. That should help with some goose eggs. It will be better when the January-ites filter out.
Just saw this. Hot damn. There's gonna be some good racing this year.
Oh and Hop - here's what I found out about the "pain" of a workout or a race. It sucks but the high you get when you finish and know you finished the right way is way better than the sucky part. I almost hurled on that mile stunt but two minutes after, when I started breathing again, I was jacked. That's the feeling that drives me to push through the pain.
"He conquers who endures" - Persius "Every workout should have a purpose. Every purpose should link back to achieving a training objective." - Spaniel
http://ncstake.blogspot.com/
Feeling the growl again
Sunburst June 2 in South Bend. Only one shitty hill at 23. The rest is pretty flat and its not crowded. I'm looking at it for a BQ.
Sunburst June 2 in South Bend. Only one shitty hill at 23. The rest is pretty flat and its not crowded.
I'm looking at it for a BQ.
Unfortunately I have a work trip in Chicago 5/31-6/4. It's the same timeframe every year, which is why I've never looked at that race harder.
I'm looking at March or mid-May. Bayshore is 5/25 but lodging is always expensive and a PIA there as it's Memorial Day weekend. Heck, hotels in Traverse are likely already sold out.
"If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does. There's your pep talk for today. Go Run." -- Slo_Hand
I am spaniel - Crusher of Treadmills
South Bend is 1.5 hours from Chicago. Race starts at 6 am. You'll be done by 8:30. Drive over, crash with buds - run and drive back by noon Chicago time. Finish on the 50 yard line at ND stadium
http://www.parkrun.org.uk/oxford/ Tomorrow's Saturday.
Yeah. That has been on my "to do" list for a year or so! The Abingdon one (which is about 5 miles away) has been on it even longer, but has been cancelled due to flooding. Not going to get there the next few weeks, but will attempt to go for a bimble around the course in February or early March (this will involve me getting my arse in gear to drive there, or just sucking up and running or cycling there).
As for the confiscating front. Sod that. If anything is going to make me change my attitude that is probably going to work. You can come over here and drink the whisky, but no loss of penguins and no confiscation.My choice is going to be to put some effort in, or punch myself in the throat. Both could hurt, but only one will be rewarding.
Hopefully my tongue-in-cheek post was taken in the appropriate Hurtlocker context. I've already got plenty of penguins though I will admit I thought the solar powered one was pretty neat.
I'm looking forward to seeing that sub-22 happen.
Well I at least had a workout this week - which makes a change
+1.
I've declared my ankle/peroneal issues over, so...nothing too spectacular or intense, just a reintro to speed: 2 miles up, then 5 x 3min on/off @ 5:27 / 7:30, then 12 min cooldown.
Funny how much longer the 3 mins @ 5:27 felt than the 3 mins @ 7:30...
Come all you no-hopers, you jokers and roguesWe're on the road to nowhere, let's find out where it goes
Will Crew for Beer
I think it's funny that you people's recovery paces are faster than my interval pace.
First week of quality workouts for my spring HM training. 10x400m at 7:42 pace with 400m recovery on Tuesday then a short tempo run at HM goal pace (8:20) on Thursday. Both felt reasonably hard, but didn't wipe me out.
Hoppity, how are your injury issues? Have those all been resolved? If so, I bet you can run faster than a sub-22 5K. Of course, if you don't really want to race then don't. Run whatever way makes you feel good. I like to have goals and see my race time improves. That's what motivates me. To think that one day I might whoop C-R in a race gets me out the door. I had as many bad races as good races in 2012, but that's OK. The bad races just make me work a little harder. Goals are good, but they don't have to be to run faster or farther. It should be something that you want to accomplish for for yourself.
Oh, and +1 to that stuff Spaniel said.
Rule number one of a gunfight, bring a gun. Rule number two of a gunfight, bring friends with guns.
I am terrible at mentally approaching things whether they be running, climbing, skiing, working, existing so it's definitely something I need to improve. Failure is something I do expect, and I don't mind it as such, I do mind letting people down, and sometimes that becomes interwoven with goals. Equally I can sometimes feel the blinkered, "I am going to fail" mentality when it needn't be there. I understand the fear in things that could be more risky (climbing, mountaineering, skiing) but less so in running...but in all of those it is still far better to assume success (with a reasonable level of realism and concern for safety where my or someone else's life could be at risk).
Very little I can add to Spaniels' previous response, but ...
1. There are varieties of "fail" and "succeed" in running/racing. Putting yourself out there in a race and cratering -- because it was too fast after all -- is success, if going that hard was your race plan. Missing your time goal but running at your limit is success. Backing off when you're not sure you can hold the pace (or worse, because you just don't like the discomfort even though your legs aren't saying they're dying) is failure -- even if you hit your time goal! One thing to try is to have a specific process target, rather than a result target. Races take a while compared to something like a golf stroke; you'll be immersed in the process for a while anyway.
2. Something that's helped me keep going in workouts has been working with a coach. I'm not a fan of "coach accountability" motivating me to follow the schedule or hit the workouts -- I usually find that motivation inside myself. But not always. When I'm hurting midway through that 8x800 session and wondering if my times are going to start slipping, knowing he's going to log-stalk and see if I bailed helps me find the extra persistence to dive into the next rep, find the pace, and just do it. Don't know if "User Group accountability" would work the same, but it's a thought.
"I want you to pray as if everything depends on it, but I want you to prepare yourself as if everything depends on you."
-- Dick LeBeau
I think it's funny that you people's recovery paces are faster than my interval pace. First week of quality workouts for my spring HM training. 10x400m at 7:42 pace with 400m recovery on Tuesday then a short tempo run at HM goal pace (8:20) on Thursday. Both felt reasonably hard, but didn't wipe me out. Hoppity, how are your injury issues? Have those all been resolved? If so, I bet you can run faster than a sub-22 5K. Of course, if you don't really want to race then don't. Run whatever way makes you feel good. I like to have goals and see my race time improves. That's what motivates me. To think that one day I might whoop C-R in a race gets me out the door. I had as many bad races as good races in 2012, but that's OK. The bad races just make me work a little harder. Goals are good, but they don't have to be to run faster or farther. It should be something that you want to accomplish for for yourself. Oh, and +1 to that stuff Spaniel said.
WhoDat. Also agree about the recovery paces...the interval paces run by people in here are likely faster than my all out sprint. One day, one day!Injury-wise things aren't great, but they aren't terrible. I still have hip issues that go in to the leg, but they're manageable at the moment. I am not sure how they will respond to a change in pace etc, but there is only one way to find out. I'm not sure I want to race, but I think I can still have time goals for distances....I know that sounds stupid, but I think seeing an improvement in my pace at my tempo effort, or seeing improvements in interval paces (when I start those) will be a positive. I should really run a real 5k or real 10k for "real" times, but I have other fears associated with racing that aren't directly running, so it's almost preferable to just play with running at the moment and then deal with that later.It's good hearing that bad races are motivating and not the other way around.
Hopefully my tongue-in-cheek post was taken in the appropriate Hurtlocker context. I've already got plenty of penguins though I will admit I thought the solar powered one was pretty neat. I'm looking forward to seeing that sub-22 happen.
Of course it was. If I see any more solar powered penguins I'll see if it has the energy to swim and slide to you. I'm also looking to that sub-22...it could take a while to get there (given my all-out mile time trial in the summer...the one I did once and never tried again to meet my goal)...but working towards it should be interesting.
Very little I can add to Spaniels' previous response, but ... 1. There are varieties of "fail" and "succeed" in running/racing. Putting yourself out there in a race and cratering -- because it was too fast after all -- is success, if going that hard was your race plan. Missing your time goal but running at your limit is success. Backing off when you're not sure you can hold the pace (or worse, because you just don't like the discomfort even though your legs aren't saying they're dying) is failure -- even if you hit your time goal! One thing to try is to have a specific process target, rather than a result target. Races take a while compared to something like a golf stroke; you'll be immersed in the process for a while anyway. 2. Something that's helped me keep going in workouts has been working with a coach. I'm not a fan of "coach accountability" motivating me to follow the schedule or hit the workouts -- I usually find that motivation inside myself. But not always. When I'm hurting midway through that 8x800 session and wondering if my times are going to start slipping, knowing he's going to log-stalk and see if I bailed helps me find the extra persistence to dive into the next rep, find the pace, and just do it. Don't know if "User Group accountability" would work the same, but it's a thought.
This is all great. Thank you. I think whether I race officially or simply set personal time goals all this applies, and the process target would work well for me in that sense. I am very good at failing by not trying...but trying to pretend it is not a fail because I didn't try.User group accountability may well work for me. I don't know any coaches and would be too embarrassed to be coached "in the real world". However user group nagging and interaction could work well to stop me slipping in to old avoidance routines.
This is all great. Thank you. I think whether I race officially or simply set personal time goals all this applies, and the process target would work well for me in that sense. I am very good at failing by not trying...but trying to pretend it is not a fail because I didn't try.User group accountability may well work for me. I don't know any coaches and would be too embarrassed to be coached "in the real world".
I think that's a "skill" a LOT of people implement ... and not just in their running.
And you don't have to seek out Peter Coe! I work with Thunder, and it's an informal style (although still very important to me, and he knows it). He log-stalks, but it's not like he feeds me weekly schedules and we chat after every hard workout. Much more like I get a month at a time (after communicating about the upcoming month, races, goals, etc.), then I don't hear from him unless I ping him or I do something wonderful.
But I know he's watching. :-)
[MTA: iPad reveals my atrocious typing skillz!]