Beginners and Beyond

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Best time for tune-up HM? (Read 80 times)


Muddling through

    Again, thanks for the opinions guys!  I would probably race the HM pretty full out, because I am just not good at holding back, so why set myself up for failure?  I recover pretty well, in that I can do easy runs the next couple days after a HM without a problem, but I don't recover so well that I could race it 3 weeks out.  I like LTH's idea of 8 weeks, because then you have time to make some training adjustments if needed, but I haven't found a doable HM at that time.  What do you guys think of 6 weeks?  Still time to recover and I could make a couple changes for the next 4 weeks if needed (I am pretty sure the Hanson taper is only 2 weeks).

    I think 3-6 weeks is a good time frame. Fitness changes in the last 6 weeks of a training program aren't going to be of sufficient magnitude to materially affect your choice of goal pace.  If you're using it to determine goal pace and not as a test run of the first half of your marathon, you shouldn't be holding back.

    2014 Goals: Run first trail ultra, first 100K, and see what I can do in a 24-Hour race

      Again, thanks for the opinions guys!  I would probably race the HM pretty full out, because I am just not good at holding back, so why set myself up for failure?  I recover pretty well, in that I can do easy runs the next couple days after a HM without a problem, but I don't recover so well that I could race it 3 weeks out.  I like LTH's idea of 8 weeks, because then you have time to make some training adjustments if needed, but I haven't found a doable HM at that time.  What do you guys think of 6 weeks?  Still time to recover and I could make a couple changes for the next 4 weeks if needed (I am pretty sure the Hanson taper is only 2 weeks).

       

      You said your full marathon is Nov. 2, correct?

      If so, this is 7 weeks before on Sept. 14.

      http://www.wvrr.org/bluesatthecrossroadshalfmarathon/index.html

       

      MTA: And it's fairly close to you if I'm not mistaken.


      Hip Hip Hooray

        So there you go, Ami. You have a choice of 3, 4, 5, 6, 8 and 9 weeks. Whatever you do, don't go with 7. No one likes 7. Big grin

         

        EDITED to include 9.

         

        THIS is why I participate in these forums.   The running education ...errrr,  the smart ass comments. lol

         


        Ball of Fury

           

          You said your full marathon is Nov. 2, correct?

          If so, this is 7 weeks before on Sept. 14.

          http://www.wvrr.org/bluesatthecrossroadshalfmarathon/index.html

           

          MTA: And it's fairly close to you if I'm not mistaken.

           

          Why, yes ma'am, you are correct on both counts!  Too bad that 5 minutes before I read this post, I registered DH and I for the Air Force half, which is the next weekend!  Thank you very much for the suggestion though!  Dayton is actually a bit closer but not by much.  Of course, had I registered for your suggestion, it would have gone against everything I learned on this thread, which was...don't go with 7!!!

          PRs:  5K 22:59, 10K 46:54,HM: 1:51:15


          Muddling through

             

            Why, yes ma'am, you are correct on both counts!  Too bad that 5 minutes before I read this post, I registered DH and I for the Air Force half, which is the next weekend!  Thank you very much for the suggestion though!  Dayton is actually a bit closer but not by much.  Of course, had I registered for your suggestion, it would have gone against everything I learned on this thread, which was...don't go with 7!!!

            But 7 is obviously the best time since no one suggested it.

            2014 Goals: Run first trail ultra, first 100K, and see what I can do in a 24-Hour race

            paulski66


            miscreant

              How is it going to help you determine goal pace if you run it as a tempo run? All the calculators assume a race time entered is from an allout race for the numbers to be valid.

               

              I thought the exact same thing. If you're not going to race it, it does you no good at all. Might as well do a tempo run in your neighborhood.

               

               

              I'm happy, hope you're happy too...

              happylily


                I agree. Time trials are supposed to be treated as races, unless you want to do a half as a practice for the full. But then, it can't be called a time trial.

                 

                Also, I usually run my tempo runs at somewhat faster pace than my HM pace. Is that wrong?

                PRs: Boston Marathon, 3:27, April 15th 2013

                        Cornwall Half-Marathon, 1:35, April 27th 2013

                4 years racing, 15 marathons, 15 BQs     

                Adam_McAllen


                Beer-and-waffle Powered

                  Also, I usually run my tempo runs at somewhat faster pace than my HM pace. Is that wrong?

                   

                  If you go by the "tempo should be about the pace you could hold in a race for an hour", then you're fine.

                  In the words of my late-coach : Just hang in there, relax... and at the end of a race anyone you see.....just pass them


                  Bad Ass

                    But how accurate would a time trial be?  You usually underperformed in a TT as compared to a race if I recall correctly.

                     

                    I agree. Time trials are supposed to be treated as races, unless you want to do a half as a practice for the full. But then, it can't be called a time trial.

                     

                    Also, I usually run my tempo runs at somewhat faster pace than my HM pace. Is that wrong?

                    Damaris, Marathon Maniac, Ultra Runner

                    Blog

                    "The most powerful weapon on earth is the human soul on fire."

                    happylily


                       

                      If you go by the "tempo should be about the pace you could hold in a race for an hour", then you're fine.

                       

                      Ok, thanks. I usually try to hit 15k pace for my tempo runs, up to about 7 mile long.

                       

                      Damaris, you're right. One should consider that the time trial was done while in training, therefore not entirely accurate. Pfitz will allow for a very mini taper if we choose a half as a time trial (but he usually recommends a 10k or 15k, instead).

                      PRs: Boston Marathon, 3:27, April 15th 2013

                              Cornwall Half-Marathon, 1:35, April 27th 2013

                      4 years racing, 15 marathons, 15 BQs     


                      Muddling through

                        But how accurate would a time trial be?  You usually underperformed in a TT as compared to a race if I recall correctly.

                         

                        I thought he was referring to using a race as a time trial to determine a goal race pace, not a solo time trial on a training run.

                        2014 Goals: Run first trail ultra, first 100K, and see what I can do in a 24-Hour race

                        Zentastic


                        Chasing Rainbows

                          It was a bad choice of words on my part.  I didn't mean that running a HM at a tempo pace could determine a marathon goal pace on its own, but it can help to determine the goal pace.

                          If I'm 3 weeks out from a marathon, I already have a pretty good idea what my goal pace should be, based on how my training has gone and any races I've run recently.  If I run a HM that close to a marathon, I run it at my estimated marathon goal pace and based on how that goes, I may adjust my goal pace up or down.

                          Of course it can be done as a tempo run in your neighbourhood but I prefer a HM to help prepare me mentally for the marathon a few weeks later.

                          The obstacle is the path. - Zen proverb


                          Finally PRed!!!

                            I like 3 or 4 weeks before. I don't have a problem recovering in time for the full if I race the HM 3 weeks before. But 4 weeks is nice because I can do my longest LR 3 weeks before.

                            PRs: 5K: 22:09, 10K:44:55, 15K: 1:10:35, HM: 1:42:49, M: 3:32:09

                               

                              Why, yes ma'am, you are correct on both counts!  Too bad that 5 minutes before I read this post, I registered DH and I for the Air Force half, which is the next weekend!  Thank you very much for the suggestion though!  Dayton is actually a bit closer but not by much.  Of course, had I registered for your suggestion, it would have gone against everything I learned on this thread, which was...don't go with 7!!!

                               

                              Glad you were able to find one. Especially with all the disparate inforamation given. Smile

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