2019 Sub 3 hour marathon thread (Read 484 times)

JMac11


Benevolent Leader

    DW - great post and something I've always thought about. To me, marathon "pace" is fine at any pace, as it's almost more mental than physical in learning how to run a long time at a pace that gets progressively more uncomfortable. But how does this work with LT pace? Let's say it's one of those awful August days: 85 degrees with 75 DP. Your LT pace is normally 6:00, but due to the TDP, you need to run 6:20 in order to get the same "effort"

     

    Are you truly training at your lactate threshold at that point? Put another way, 6:20 may be a pace that you could only run in a 1 hour race, so it fits that traditional "tempo" pace definition, but are you failining because lactate is building up, or just because you are overheating? Anecdotally I know how much heat training helps us, but still something I never figured out.

    5K: 17:50 (6/19)  |  10K: 35:59 (3/19)  |  HM: 1:16:21 (3/19)  |  FM: 2:44:43 (4/19) 

     

    Next Race: Heart & Sole 5K (7/21/19)

    Andres1045


      Anecdotally I know how much heat training helps us, but still something I never figured out.

      You buy that? I never have. At least not long term. Any benefits you gain short term are lost by the fact that for the same effort you've had to run fewer miles at a slower pace. Over the course of a summer, I think you get a much better benefit being able to run more miles at the right intensity/pace instead of having to slog through heat and humidity, adjusting your pace.

      Upcoming races:  I dunno.

      Nimmals


        JMAC - Firecracker Its one fast race on Sunday evening I usually drive back from Boston early to do this race.  I will be running it next week. Its a David Katz course he does all Olympic courses, all marathon major. He did Breaking 2 course for Nike Kipchogue he is the best in the business.

         

        http://www.usatf.org/events/courses/maps/showMap.asp?courseID=NY09010DK

        https://theislandnow.com/news-98/david-katz-oversees-races-from-port-to-the-olympics/

         

        All long island courses are accurate race directors take shortcuts. Timers accept less if they dont have to verify. But the two course measurers on long island are two of the top ones.

        JMac11


        Benevolent Leader

          Good question Andres, I don't know. Maybe it's all psychological/anecdotal. It goes to my question around whether training at slower paces than your true LT/V02 max actually hurts you.

           

          Nimmals - I considered the firecracker, but why do they run it at 5 PM??? If they set that race off at 9 am, I'd be there. I ran it once when I was in college. Also I agree - we are lucky to have such great course measurers. I think the key is to find races that don't have any sort of turnaround points or places where volunteers can screw up. If it's around a couple of blocks, then the only they can botch is the start/finish line, which at least minimizes the chances for error.

          5K: 17:50 (6/19)  |  10K: 35:59 (3/19)  |  HM: 1:16:21 (3/19)  |  FM: 2:44:43 (4/19) 

           

          Next Race: Heart & Sole 5K (7/21/19)

          jayluf


            JTReeves - Yeah, doing both Berlin and CIM. Looking for a labor day weekend half to squeeze in as well. Any suggestions?

             

            Great to see cinnamon is doing Berlin as well! Any travel plans before/after? I think we're heading to Oktoberfest the morning after then onto Prague. Would be nice to meet up post race for a beer.

             

            DW - Good luck @ Grandma half this weekend!

              JTReeves - Yeah, doing both Berlin and CIM. Looking for a labor day weekend half to squeeze in as well. Any suggestions?

               

              Great to see cinnamon is doing Berlin as well! Any travel plans before/after? I think we're heading to Oktoberfest the morning after then onto Prague. Would be nice to meet up post race for a beer.

               

              DW - Good luck @ Grandma half this weekend!

               

              Jayluf: It's a bit far from you but the New Haven half is on Labor Day here in New Haven CT. It is the USATF 20k road champs as well but they added a HM a few years ago. Most people run the 20k but more and more run the half each year. I ran it in 2016 and 2017; it's a well organized race and a pretty good course; some hills around 9-10 mile mark but not bad. Here's the link for it: http://www.newhavenroadrace.org/

              5K: 17:55 (2017)    HM: 1:23:57 (2016)    FM: 2:52:16 (2018)

              Up next: Erie Marathon (Sept. 8)

              JMac11


              Benevolent Leader

                Jay - I would second JTs recommendation, if only because it's up north. I would never run a half even in NYC that time of year if you're looking for something to run well. Might even be worth it to check something in Michigan, etc.

                5K: 17:50 (6/19)  |  10K: 35:59 (3/19)  |  HM: 1:16:21 (3/19)  |  FM: 2:44:43 (4/19) 

                 

                Next Race: Heart & Sole 5K (7/21/19)

                darkwave


                Mother of Cats

                  Hey - checking in.  Ran 85:11, which was significantly off what I was expecting to run.  Not really sure what happened - didn't make any pacing errors, and left it all out there, and my legs are trashed now - quads got very tired the last 3 miles.  Temps were perfect - tailwind wasn't what was forecast, but that's really nothing to complain about.   Legs just felt like they didn't have anything more in them today.

                   

                  Coach and I will rehash, obviously.

                  Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                   

                  And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                  JMac11


                  Benevolent Leader

                    Good thing about having a coach. Could have just been an off day, but you know yourself more than anyone. Taper maybe? I always blame the taper... Anyway, still a good time!

                    5K: 17:50 (6/19)  |  10K: 35:59 (3/19)  |  HM: 1:16:21 (3/19)  |  FM: 2:44:43 (4/19) 

                     

                    Next Race: Heart & Sole 5K (7/21/19)

                    M_M_C


                      When was the last time you took some time off? Seems like you've raced a fair amount recently. May just be time for a good 'ole hard reset

                       

                      Hey - checking in.  Ran 85:11, which was significantly off what I was expecting to run.  Not really sure what happened - didn't make any pacing errors, and left it all out there, and my legs are trashed now - quads got very tired the last 3 miles.  Temps were perfect - tailwind wasn't what was forecast, but that's really nothing to complain about.   Legs just felt like they didn't have anything more in them today.

                       

                      Coach and I will rehash, obviously.

                      3K: 8:29.12 (2017)     5K: 14:56.59 (2016)     8K: 25:27 (2016)     15K: 54:46.2 (2019)     FM: 2:58:48 (2019)

                      darkwave


                      Mother of Cats

                        When was the last time you took some time off? Seems like you've raced a fair amount recently. May just be time for a good 'ole hard reset

                         

                        That's pretty much where I am.  I was going to take a break in a few weeks, but am considering moving it up.  I'll decide in the next few days after discussing with my coach.  (What I do in the next 48 hours will be the same regardless of whether I start a longer break now, so no need to decide this minute.

                        Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                         

                        And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                        Swim5599


                          DW that's still a solid effort

                           

                          Boyd insane 5k buddy

                           

                          Very easy week.  Groin a much better

                          Mon 6 8:15

                          Tue 8 with 8x1:00 on at T power 5:36

                          Wed 6 8:15

                          Thurs 6 8:15

                          Fri 6 8:15

                          Sat 6 8:15

                          Sun 6 8:10

                          HM: 1/17 1:18:53. FM: 12/18 2:46:04

                          Swim5599


                            DW that's still a solid effort

                             

                            Boyd insane 5k buddy

                             

                            Very easy week.  Groin is much better

                            Mon 6 8:15

                            Tue 8 with 8x1:00 on at T power 5:36

                            Wed 6 8:15

                            Thurs 6 8:15

                            Fri 6 8:15

                            Sat 6 8:15

                            Sun 6 8:10

                            HM: 1/17 1:18:53. FM: 12/18 2:46:04

                            M_M_C


                              Tough week for me, but managed to scrape together another 80. Pretty much did the same thing as last week minus a Tuesday WO.

                               

                              Mon - 60 minutes Easy

                              Tue - 30 min Easy AM, 50 min Easy PM. PM run was mainly just me running up and down the same hill for 20 minutes

                              Wed - 83 min MLR

                              Thur - 30 min Easy AM, 50 min Easy PM

                              Fri - 72 min Easy, 4x100m strides

                              Sat - AM WO (15 WU, 20 ET @ 5:36 /mi, 15 CD), PM 30 min Easy

                              Sun - 16 miles

                               

                              I expect next week will be easier, hopefully will be more adjusted to the mileage. Once I am comfortable for a week or two I am going up to 85.

                              3K: 8:29.12 (2017)     5K: 14:56.59 (2016)     8K: 25:27 (2016)     15K: 54:46.2 (2019)     FM: 2:58:48 (2019)

                              darkwave


                              Mother of Cats

                                Swim - glad the groin is better.

                                 

                                MMC -some good work this week.  What is "ET" work?

                                 

                                Here's my week:

                                34.5 miles, 8 "miles" of pool-running, and 1000 yards of swimming
                                M: yoga and 8 "miles" of pool-running
                                T: 10 miles, including a track workout of 1600, 2x1200, 2x200 in 6:20, 4:41, 4:39, 45, 43. Followed with 1000 yards recovery swimming.
                                W: 7 miles very easy (8:46), drills, strides, DIY yoga, some light upper body strengthwork.
                                Th: Travel and DIY yoga
                                F: 2 miles very easy (8:54) and DIY yoga
                                Sa: 2.5 mile warm-up, Garry Bjorklund Half in 1:25:11.
                                Su: Off (travel and porking out)

                                 

                                Also, my race report:

                                Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                                 

                                And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.