Forums >Off the Beaten Path>Why Is the Republican Field So Extreme?
MoBramExam
I think the incentive system is upside down but how do you change that?
Good question. I was in the private sector (financial services) in the late 80s - early 90s. Started to see the shift then. It started to become less about "making" a profit, and more about "showing" a profit. With my company, there was nothing long term in the new strategy and they were gone by 1993ish. Three CEOs in about as many years during this period doing what they were incentivized to do...grow it so big so fast it collapses under its own weight.
Feeling the growl again
Some like to sit around smugly blaming the poor for their laziness, their inability to save, and their unwillingness to work hard enough to raise themselves from poverty.Some like to sit around angrily blaming the rich for the greed, and inequality of our country.Personally, I like to partake in both camps equally: blame them all, that's what I say.In the end what I suspect is that we're going to get hung by our structural dependence on vast overspending, by our structural dependence on a two-party system (both parties of which are hugely committed to vast overspending), by the spiralling costs of healthcare, by our inability to consider letting people suffer and die (instead of spending ourselves into oblivion "saving everyone at all costs"). The general feel-good, patriotic anthem song of "at all costs" is certainly part of our undoing, in my mind.We want to beat people up in wars, no matter the cost. We want to save every baby, every sick person, every cancer patient, no matter the cost. We want to give everyone a chance to get back on their feet economically, no matter the cost. We want to save our banks, our car companies, our steel companies, our high-tech defense contractors, no matter the cost. We want to help, even coddle, our old, and sick, and infirm, no matter the cost. We want to keep our oil firms strong, no matter the cost. We want to invest in alternative energy, no matter the cost. After all, it's our money to print.
Some like to sit around smugly blaming the poor for their laziness, their inability to save, and their unwillingness to work hard enough to raise themselves from poverty.Some like to sit around angrily blaming the rich for the greed, and inequality of our country.Personally, I like to partake in both camps equally: blame them all, that's what I say.In the end what I suspect is that we're going to get hung by our structural dependence on vast overspending, by our structural dependence on a two-party system (both parties of which are hugely committed to vast overspending), by the spiralling costs of healthcare, by our inability to consider letting people suffer and die (instead of spending ourselves into oblivion "saving everyone at all costs"). The general feel-good, patriotic anthem song of "at all costs" is certainly part of our undoing, in my mind.We want to beat people up in wars, no matter the cost. We want to save every baby, every sick person, every cancer patient, no matter the cost. We want to give everyone a chance to get back on their feet economically, no matter the cost. We want to save our banks, our car companies, our steel companies, our high-tech defense contractors, no matter the cost. We want to help, even coddle, our old, and sick, and infirm, no matter the cost. We want to keep our oil firms strong, no matter the cost. We want to invest in alternative energy, no matter the cost.
After all, it's our money to print.
Well done, AP. I would agree with all of this.
"If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does. There's your pep talk for today. Go Run." -- Slo_Hand
I am spaniel - Crusher of Treadmills
Bravo, AP!
AP gets my vote for post of the year for that one.
"He conquers who endures" - Persius "Every workout should have a purpose. Every purpose should link back to achieving a training objective." - Spaniel
http://ncstake.blogspot.com/
Prince of Fatness
Spaniels said it better than I but if being responsible to live within one's means is being a douche then where does one go next in the conversation.
I don't think that anyone is saying that living within ones means is being a douche. I think that you know that. There probably is a little naiveté involved. I say good for the kid. Good attitude to have. But I don't think that he / she realizes that it is not that simple. We all are tempted to go into debt. Money is dangled in front of us all of the time. Some are better than others at resisting. I also think that there is also some hypocrisy in our society. We are encouraged to spend, carry a debt, etc., and then are chastised for taking it too far and having to be bailed out.
As for all the CEO hatred, that one certainly almost sounds like envy in some cases.
My problems with the CEO's is mainly the whole golden parachute thing. You do your job, fine, whatever you are paid, you are paid. But you run a company into the ground with your incompetence, then you should pay the price just like everyone else in the company that you fucked over. I think that the golden parachutes enable a behavior that should not be enabled.
Not at it at all.
Nice rant, AP.
Why is it sideways?
I don't understand why AP gets to rant without solution (blame everyone?), but if the protesters in Wall Street decide to rant, they are called whiners.
Is it because he's doing it on the internet instead of getting off his hiney and joining others with whom he might agree on some things and disagree on others?
The tensions in our culture that AP points out are simply tensions between our ideals and our realities. The bad form of this is hypocrisy. The good form is called aspiration.
It seems to me that people are very mindful of costs of some things and the benefits of others, but evaluate costs and benefits in ways that are more in line with their own needs, problems, and interests. That's where the conflict comes in.
Finally, while it is true that "printing more money" will not solve our problems, it is also true that generating velocity in the economy to address these problems of health, employment, war, etc. is not simply a matter of cutting costs, saving money, or balancing the budget (though these may be factors.)
(Also, does that college kid in the picture think that the protesters are angry about having to take personal responsibility? Strange take on the protest, seems to me. Interesting also that he wants to identify himself with the 1%--as if the 1% wealthiest people were the only ones capable of personal responsibility.)
(And spaniel, I would like you to tell me where I said that the point of the protest was not to have any goals. I said that the point of the protests was to get us talking and thinking about our problems, even if we don't yet have the solution. It seems to me to have accomplished this goal, as evidenced by this thread. [Maybe what you need is less coffee, not more.])
(And spaniel, I would like you to tell me where I said that the point of the protest was not to have any goals. I said that the point of the protests was to get us talking and thinking about our problems, even if we don't yet have the solution. It seems to me to have accomplished this goal, as evidenced by this thread.
General post was well put; but I'm only going to address this last point because it happened to be what I was thinking about on my run this morning, not so much to disagree but just to throw in a thought.
I think that maybe it is an important point of the protest not to have simple started goals becuase by leaving the discussion open it allows threads like this and discussions in general to examine so many different issues and create a much more interesting discussion.
This might not be intended by the protesters but if they weren't out there all I would be thinking about right now would be training for a winter marathon instead of all the issues related to banking, ecconomic mobility, government regulation, bailouts etc.
Ostrich runner
Spaniels said it better than I but if being responsible to live within one's means is being a douche then where does one go next in the conversation. I get the medical issues, we are there too, but being frugal in other areas and putting away just in case helped weather most of that storm for us. Life throws you all sorts of crap but did you do something when things were good to prepare for when things aren't? Not a personal question Beef but a general one.
Don't get me wrong, my reaction to the occupy whatever people has been the same. I had a lot going for me even when I was down, many and probably most do not.
http://www.runningahead.com/groups/Indy/forum
That's not what I said, if you'd bother to read it and comprehend rather than shrug the chip off your shoulder. But I know it is hard for you to stop and really think long enough to understand before the knee-jerk reaction sets in.
Of course, as Jeff has covered, maybe their point is that they don't have a coherent point?
Hey Jeff - think Weimar Republic when you wonder if you can print your way out of trouble. And just to stir the drink. Enjoy. http://mobile.twitter.com/search?q=%23YouMightBeAFleabagger
Where did I say that we could "print our way out of trouble." I said we couldn't.
I just don't get the endless personal attacks. I am only, always, trying to defend and articulate points that I have made. In this case I responded to a post that explicitly attributed an idea to me that I didn't feel was adequately stated. You said you needed more coffee to understand it. I said your needed less and I explained my view. Somehow this means it is hard for me to stop and think?
I will admit that I have a knee-jerk reaction to your constant mischaracterization of my ideas and relentless personal attacks. They suck. You should quit. Maybe one day you will succeed in running me off. Maybe one day I will succeed in ignoring you. Until then, we probably deserve each other.
/back to your regularly scheduled program.
Dave
Mostly because he doesn't ascribe to the sort of "They" mentality expressed by Occupy Wall Street.
AP gets it. They is everyone. No one gets a pass on being "They".
We all own the problem.
I give him a pass because he at least tries to coherently describe the problem instead of figuring out who to blame.
MTA: As the personal attacks, I'd like to state that this community is richer because of both Jeff and Spaniel. Oh crap, I said richer, now we're all them.
I ran a mile and I liked it, liked it, liked it. dgb2n@yahoo.com