Forums >Racing>Sub 1:30 Half Marathon in 2020
RIP Milkman
I've stated my love for the Takumi Sen as well. I agree though with distance, I wouldn't even use it for a 10K. I do think it works very well for a 5K though and definitely the mile. It's really firm, but I like that when running faster paces: I need more "connection" with the ground and "feel". When you run in the Vaporfly, there is absolutely zero feel with the ground.
DW - forgot to comment on your post. I hope it actually is something beneficial! I asked this a while ago but not sure I got a response: I thought you signed up for some 10K a while ago where you had to fly somewhere, is that happening (or maybe already happened and I missed it)
5K: 16:37 (11/20) | 10K: 34:49 (10/19) | HM: 1:14:57 (5/22) | FM: 2:36:31 (12/19)
The main reason I may have worn pink shoes is that they would usually be on special
Jmac ok you have me wondering if I should use my Zante pursuits for the 10k. I will do some tempos in them.
55+ PBs 5k 18:36 June 3rd TT
" If you don't use it you lose it, but if you use it, it wears out.
Somewhere in between is about right "
Mother of Cats
I've stated my love for the Takumi Sen as well. I agree though with distance, I wouldn't even use it for a 10K. I do think it works very well for a 5K though and definitely the mile. It's really firm, but I like that when running faster paces: I need more "connection" with the ground and "feel". When you run in the Vaporfly, there is absolutely zero feel with the ground. DW - forgot to comment on your post. I hope it actually is something beneficial! I asked this a while ago but not sure I got a response: I thought you signed up for some 10K a while ago where you had to fly somewhere, is that happening (or maybe already happened and I missed it)
Yup - for me the Takumi Sen is a 5K and under shoe. My 5K and mile PRs are both in that shoe. It's a bit awkward when you heelstrike, but feels amazing when you are on your toes. If I'm 200m from the finish and trying to outkick someone, that's the shoe I want on my feet.
Jmac - the 10K is the Fargo 10K in North Dakota in late August - I'm flying from DC to MSP (which is very cheap on Delta) and then driving from MSP to Fargo, which doesn't look that much further than the drive from MSP to Duluth. So, just crossing my fingers that the race goes and that there are no travel restrictions/mandatory quarantines imposed for Virginia, Minnesota, or North Dakota.
I also just entered the Mankato Half-Marathon in mid-October in Minnesota. My hope right now is to do a marathon either the weekend of November 7-8 or the weekend of November 14-15. If the latter, I'll stick with the Mankato half (three weeks from the marathon); if the former, I'll drop to the Mankato 10K as a tune-up since there will only be two weeks in between. If all my hopeful November marathons are cancelled, I may swap to the Mankato Marathon.
Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.
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3 months til Masters
Hi DW-
MSP to Fargo is a pretty long drive that goes on forever. Just interstate and nothing to look at after the first hour. It is about 2x as far as Duluth. That said, it is a really well run event. I'm still planning on running the Mankato Full marathon, so if you are in town that weekend we will have to say hi. My brother lives 10 min outside of Mankato so I'll be staying with him and his wife.
2023 Goals
Marathon Sub 2:37 (CIM) 2:41:18
10k Sub 35:00 (Victory 10k 34:19)
5k Sub 16:00 (Hot Dash 5k in March (16:48), Brian Kraft in May (16:20), Twilight 5000 in July and August (16:20/16:25 Both heat index 102-103F)
Sub 1:16 Half Marathon City of Lakes Half Marathon 1:15:47)
Sub 56:30 in 10 mile (Twin Cities 10 mile, Canceled due to weather, 56:35 as a workout)
2024 Goals
Sub 2:37 Marathon
Sub 1:15 Half
Sub 34 10k
Sub 16 5k
Hi DW- MSP to Fargo is a pretty long drive that goes on forever. Just interstate and nothing to look at after the first hour. It is about 2x as far as Duluth. That said, it is a really well run event. I'm still planning on running the Mankato Full marathon, so if you are in town that weekend we will have to say hi. My brother lives 10 min outside of Mankato so I'll be staying with him and his wife.
Google maps says just under 4 hours - does that sound right to you? I've done long and boring before. Two years ago I drove from Topeka to Collyer, Kansas (3:30) and then turned around that same day and did Collyer to Kansas City (just under 4:30). It was a LONG time on I-70. I just catch up on NPR.
Sounds about the same as DC to Virginia Beach also, now that I think of it.
Plan is to fly/drive Thursday morning, hang out Friday (since the flight/drive will take something from me), race on Saturday, and drive/fly home on Saturday post-race. Flight back to DC leaves at 5:45 pm.
That's great DW and DP that you have some races on the horizon.
DW I'm 10k ing in August too so we will have to share some 10k workouts.
A 4 hour drive after flying??? I thought I was crazy for flying to San Fran for CIM and driving 2 hours to get to Sacramento. This is next level. I admire your dedication to racing. I think I'm okay without any racing this fall. If it's still nothing in the spring, I will fly anywhere to race.
OTOH, if you run your easy runs uptempo because you can't bear to have a certain pace show up on Strava, then that's a bad reason to run your easy runs that fast....
This is precisely the reason I don’t have Strava and don’t post all my workouts on FB. I can’t see any value, for me, in sharing exactly what I’m doing with the masses. It just invites subconscious competition and Unsolicited and differing opinions as to what I should be doing.
800m: 2:20.3 (2015) | 1 Mile: 5:13 (2016) | 5K: 18:32 (2010) | 10km: 39:55 (2012) | HM: 1:28 (2013)
When I read everyone’s race reports and pacing talk, I marvel. I am notoriously terrible at pacing. I think JMac said that if the beginning of his race is faster than the middle, something has gone terribly wrong. This is pretty much what I do every time I race, even when I try really hard to be patient. It’s very frustrating and I think it’s the reason I prefer the shorter distances, with my favorite being 800m. In that and the mile there can be at least some benefit of going out quickly. And my body is built more for speed, so it’s my natural default - it always feels like I’m going too slow when I try to be smart about pacing and the anxiety about going too slow limits by ability to reign it in. I have had some good races, but as someone said earlier, those have almost always been when I wasn’t particularly focused on time or place so I just let it come to me.
The other thing I notice in your race reports is the keen awareness of racing others. I know the competition is one of the points of racing, but I tend to diminish the importance of placing in a race because I am focused on my own time, getting a PR, or just working on some other part of my racing. I can always rationalize a bad result. I guess that makes me a shitty competitor, huh? I think I like training more than racing.
Intl. correspondent
Watson - thanks for the race report, perfect pacing by you, I’m sure it felt great to be kicking at the end.
Keen - I plan on following whatever the coach tells me to do haha.
Darkwave - finally we have some milers on this board who will understand the anaerobic impact as well. I was really feeling like I was running in place the last 400 haha.
Here hopes your niggles diminish.
Piwi - Awesome picture, I love to see these races you run in someone’s backyard
Kimba - you can always embrace the shorter distances. I'm sure you'd have a blast in the local track tournaments in the 800 and the 1500/mile. That should also help you out now that you have a lower mileage.
Also I think you should never ever again run a workout with other people haha.
I also have the problem of fast starts but because I'm a FIERCE competitor. To me what works sometimes is to look at the watch 5x during the first kilometer until I lock the pace down. Once I've locked in the pace then it's a smooth ride. It's hard to gauge pace at the beginning because there's too much people around.
me - I'm slowly recovering from the mile time trial, it always feels like I had a strong strength workout afterwards.
Somehow I'm feeling my hamstrings (lower near the knee) very tense for the first time ever. I did notice I have some stronger hips lately due to the strength training, not sure if that triggered the next weak link and that is the hamstrings.
PRs: 1500 4:54.1 2019 - 5K 17:53 2023 - 10K 37:55 2023 - HM 1:21:59 2021
Up next: some 800m race (or time trials) / Also place in the top 20% in a trail race
Tool to generate Strava weekly
And it's why I have Strava. There are quite a few newer runners on my team who are pretty insecure about the pace of their easy days. So...by posting mine, I figure I make them feel better. There is no shame in a 9 or 10 minute mile on an easy day. Or in what would normally be superslow track work out splits on a very hot, windy, or frigid day.
Jmac - remember, I'm the person who drives a bit over 4 hours from Virginia to Pittsburgh to race a road mile, and then turns around and drives home the same night. Or hops on the 2:10 am Amtrak up to NYC to race in Central Park. So...possibly I'm a bit crazy.
Competition v. time focus. Something I've noted repeatedly is that those who are focused on time tend to have more difficulty reining in the starts of their races or their workout paces than those who focus on competition. My hunch is that, when you are focused on competition, it's easier to take a long-term strategic view of the race or the workout. When you are focused on time, every split is a success or failure.
Flavio - could the tight hammies be lingering muscle tension from the race?
Lol, flavio, you're right about not working out with people. I have been doing some work-outs on my own during the comeback and have commented to my husband that it's so much better for me because I can't succumb to the peer pressure of running too fast! I can really focus on how I feel rather than trying to hit some arbitrary pace. And you're right about embracing the shorter distances. You can see from my PRs that I am better at shorter distances. My 5K PR is from 2010, my mile PR, which is way better than my 5K PR, is from 2015 -- I was 40. So, I have been embracing the shorter distances for several years. It was only when I first joined this group that I was contemplating returning to the longer distances. I had been out of running for long stretches since 2016 due to surgeries and injuries, so speed seemed like a distant goal; I thought I could build myself back up by building base, building aerobic strength, racing longer distances, and then cutting down to the short fast stuff again. Alas, that whole plan got muddled for various reasons, and now I have no idea what I am doing! Lol. I really have no goals right now; I'm just enjoying running and doing varied work-outs for the enjoyment of it.
DW, definitely no shame in going slow. And conversely, no heroism in going fast when it's not warranted. In fact, if I boast to any of my running friends, I'm usually boasting about a run wherein I actually maintained the prescribed slower pace! That's more noteworthy for me given my history of being an idiot and blowing my load early. And I agree with you about outcomes yielded with time-focus vs. competition-focus. But, just because you're right about it doesn't mean I do the right thing! Lol. I often go into a race thinking I'm going to race other people vs. race myself, but it rarely ends that way. I'm just not disciplined enough. And as I said, I can rationalize any outcome, including getting beat by people because I made a stupid mistake. My main rationalization is that no one really cares about my result except for me, and I'm not a professional runner so my job security isn't dependent upon my race times, so if I want to be undisciplined, make stupid mistakes, and have sub-par long distance race times, so be it! Don't get me wrong, I wish I could be more disciplined; but at the end of the day I just love to run and physically push my limits, so that's what motivates me more.
Good luck in your upcoming race! I can see that you really love to compete, so I hope it's not canceled at the last minute so you can burn those competitive juices!
That drive always takes longer. I part cause it takes a while to get out of the cities and suburbs and also traffic near st cloud. With no stops I would say at least 4:05....with a stop about 4:15-4:20....unless you completely miss morning, lunch, and/or evening rush hour...of course traffic is pretty low right now so you could make record time.
Also some part of 94 will be under construction...due to weather...some part of the 200 mile stretch will be in need of repairs. I encourage you to go...just factor in an extra 15-40 min.
Google maps says just under 4 hours - does that sound right to you? I've done long and boring before. Two years ago I drove from Topeka to Collyer, Kansas (3:30) and then turned around that same day and did Collyer to Kansas City (just under 4:30). It was a LONG time on I-70. I just catch up on NPR. Sounds about the same as DC to Virginia Beach also, now that I think of it. Plan is to fly/drive Thursday morning, hang out Friday (since the flight/drive will take something from me), race on Saturday, and drive/fly home on Saturday post-race. Flight back to DC leaves at 5:45 pm.
JamesD
Darkwave/JMac (and anyone else) - Do you have any suggestions for minimizing the impact of a long drive on a race the next day? The October half I’m aiming for is about 4 hours away, on a Saturday morning. My plan is to drive over early Friday afternoon, probably stopping to loosen up once along the way. DW is coming with me and may drive, as I assume being a passenger is easier on the legs and less mentally tiring than driving to an unfamiliar place. I don’t usually run the day before a race, as the few times I’ve tried, I’ve been flat the next day, but I’ll probably walk parts of the course (which includes a stretch on a polo field that I want to check out). Anything else I should keep in mind?
Kim - I’ve read that there’s a slight advantage to running the first mile in a 5K a little faster than the rest, so don’t give up on that distance if you like to start fast.
Post-1987 PRs: Half 1:30:14 (2019); 10K 39:35 (2019); 5K 19:12 (2017); Mile 5:37.3 (2020)
'24 Goals: consistency, age-graded PRs, half < 1:32
You guys know I love easy pace discussion. I don't know the order of my favorite discussions, but these are it:
- Easy pace
- Course certification
- Age grading
- Temperature plus dew point
Lately I've been running anywhere from 8:00 to 8:30. That's 2:00-2:30 slower than marathon pace. There is no shame in being slow on easy days. If anything, I've been getting anxious when I hit 7:45 pace. When I see 8:00+ tick off, I'm proud of myself. Of course, a lot of this is driven by the heat, but even during peak marathon training in the fall, I rarely run easy days within 1:30 of my marathon pace unless it's part of some long "easy" segment between threshold type work. Then I'll let it creep up.
James - If you're going to drive the day before, get it done in the morning. I actually like driving the day before, as I both enjoy driving but also find it tiring, which is great to get your energy levels down to fall asleep early!
Piwi - agreed with Flavio, always great to see what these park runs look like. Cannot believe that is a race.