Forums >Racing>2018 Sub-3. No rules. Run.
RIP Milkman
Weather - The amount you run upsets me (in a good way). Just cannot believe the volume you put up in a Florida summer.
5K: 16:37 (11/20) | 10K: 34:49 (10/19) | HM: 1:14:57 (5/22) | FM: 2:36:31 (12/19)
Mikkey that's a great week especially with the strength training. Do you find the strength training helps your running? I'm wanting to add some but only have so much time in the week for exercise. I'm also questioning how beneficial the 5M recovery days are vs doing something else.
SubDood those MP runs are brutal. I'm already dreading next weekend's 18 with 10 at MP.
JMac11 and Weatherboy80 I'm fairly new here but you guys seem to consistently put in big weeks. Not sure how you don't get burned out.
I was feeling like I had a pretty good week until reading some of these! Pretty good mileage (by my standards) but no real fast workouts. I'm trying to slow down my recovery days to 8:30 or slower but not feeling like I'm getting much benefit from that.
Weekly SummaryMonday, Jul 30, 2018 thru Sunday, Aug 05, 2018
Mikkey: That's a classic Mikkey week: an 18 and a 22 mile run the same week. Nice volume on 5 days!
Subdood: Big week and great job with the 12 @ MP; I can see how that would be draining!
JMac: Great week, glad you bounced back from the previous. I am amazed you can do your runs in late afternoon/early evening when it is SO hot! I struggle even in the early morning when the sun is still just emerging and temps are lower. Keep the faith that it will be worth it once the cool weather kicks in!
Weatherboy: Another great week; you're definitely the most consistent runner on this thread! As Jmac said it is mind boggling how consistent you are in that heat and humidity!
BGS: That looks like a solid week to me: nice MLR and LR.
My week was definitely better than last week. I was happy with a hard session Wednesday on a relatively comfortable morning (dew point of only 68) at least compared with what we have been having. We traveled to Michigan for a family reunion this weekend so Sat and Sunday runs were there, on flat terrain, so the pace was a bit faster than usual. Sunday's long run was in hot and humid weather, and despite hydrating as much as I could throughout (put down 60 ounces of gatorade!) I was feeling it by the end. I'm ready for fall to begin.....
2:52:16 (2018)
BGS - You say that I put up big weeks after you throw up a 70 mile week???
JT - Good week. How do you normally hydrate during the run? I run paths that have water fountains every mile or so, but curious how those of you without access to them deal. Do you use a belt, handheld, or something else?
JMac: Long runs are the only ones I bring fluids along for, and usually I bring the bottles with me and plant them at a certain point and loop back to get a drink at regular intervals. I may sometimes drive out beforehand to plant them if it's an out-and-back route, as otherwise it's too long to carry so much (especially with no upper body strength like me). I've never used a belt or handheld.
JMac- My water plan varies. Sometimes I'll loop around, occasionally I'll carry a handheld. During summer humid months I find that the bigger issue is needing to towel off during the run. My regular running route gets me my first water fountain 6+ miles from the start, so anything under 12 miles I have to do without.
Having to rearrange my pfitz schedule a bit since I was away and couldn't run for 3 days. Yesterday my run called for 7 w/ strides, and it was too hot, and I fell apart and had to walk briefly after the strides. Bounced back today though with 16 and 12@MP. I did that on the treadmill for my longest consecutive treadmill run without hopping off. Was able to complete it, at 6:49 pace. I ran it at a 1% downgrade since Steamtown has a downward slope. I was hoping that the air conditioner I bought for my garage would help more, but it was only able to take the temperature down to 71 running it overnight, and by the end of the run it was at 77.
5k- 18:55 (2018) 10K- 39:04 (2017) Marathon- 3:00:10 (2018)
Mmmm Bop
SubDood - Great week and I like the plan/actual table! Yeah don’t underestimate a long run at faster than easy pace and I know the feeling of trying to stay awake for the rest of the day!
JMac - I knew you would bounce back this week and that was a very impressive Thur workout!
Weatherboy - Great week with quality and volume....maybe put next up races in your sig line seeing as we’ve lost our OP. I have the memory of a gold fish.
BGS - High mileage without much speedwork is still good for marathons and 73 miles at an overall pace of Sub8 is impressive. 👍
You mentioned strength work.....I started doing it in late 2015 and ran a 2:51 in April 2016 (age 50)...averaged 76mpw for 16 weeks...and then I got greedy for NYC in the fall and averaged 89mpw for 16 weeks cutting back on the strength work and ended up losing fitness and just about scraped a Sub3. I do think it’s overlooked for a lot of runners...but the elites do it!!! I’m not sure what Mo Farah’s current routine is, but he was able to squat 200Ibs (1 and 1/2 times his body weight) prior to his 2012 Olympic performances. Anyway, Marky Mark is the strength training expert from the half marathon thread who just ran a 1:16 half....so maybe he can elaborate! 👍
JT - Very nice Wed workout and I like the 33 mile total for Sat/Sun which is a great endurance builder!
Sling - I always feel a bit guilty about posting treadmill workouts....but 1% downgrade 😂
Swim - C’mon, you are welcome back...we forgive you for not finishing that 1 mile race. 😜
5k - 17:53 (4/19) 10k - 37:53 (11/18) Half - 1:23:18 (4/19) Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)
Weatherboy - Great week with quality and volume....maybe put next up races in your sig line seeing as we’ve lost our OP. I have the memory of a gold fish. Swim - C’mon, you are welcome back...we forgive you for not finishing that 1 mile race. 😜
+1 on both of these.
I've been reading this thread and thought I'd throw my hat into the ring. I'm on week 4 of a Pfitz 12 week 70+ miles/week plan. I'll be shooting for 2:39:30 (PR) or faster at my goal marathon on October 7. Training is going well so far; this morning's workout was a 5 mile LAT which I did in 28:35.
Madison - welcome aboard! Please provide a bit of an intro. You can go to the first page or two of this thread to get an idea of what we are looking for.
SubDood - Great week and I like the plan/actual table! Yeah don’t underestimate a long run at faster than easy pace and I know the feeling of trying to stay awake for the rest of the day! JMac - I knew you would bounce back this week and that was a very impressive Thur workout! Weatherboy - Great week with quality and volume....maybe put next up races in your sig line seeing as we’ve lost our OP. I have the memory of a gold fish. BGS - High mileage without much speedwork is still good for marathons and 73 miles at an overall pace of Sub8 is impressive. 👍 You mentioned strength work.....I started doing it in late 2015 and ran a 2:51 in April 2016 (age 50)...averaged 76mpw for 16 weeks...and then I got greedy for NYC in the fall and averaged 89mpw for 16 weeks cutting back on the strength work and ended up losing fitness and just about scraped a Sub3. I do think it’s overlooked for a lot of runners...but the elites do it!!! I’m not sure what Mo Farah’s current routine is, but he was able to squat 200Ibs (1 and 1/2 times his body weight) prior to his 2012 Olympic performances. Anyway, Marky Mark is the strength training expert from the half marathon thread who just ran a 1:16 half....so maybe he can elaborate! 👍 JT - Very nice Wed workout and I like the 33 mile total for Sat/Sun which is a great endurance builder! Sling - I always feel a bit guilty about posting treadmill workouts....but 1% downgrade 😂 Swim - C’mon, you are welcome back...we forgive you for not finishing that 1 mile race. 😜
My bad buddy. Between the new job and my Garmin Connect issues I haven’t logged anything In a while. Put me down for 90 mile weeks the last two and this one will be 100. Had a double whammy yesterday. Short AM MP tempo, followed by 5x5:00 T intervals in the PM. Renato Canova s got nothing on me.
HM: 1/17 1:18:53. FM: 12/18 2:46:04
A little bit about me:
Male, 37, married with an 8 year old son. I live in Madison, WI, thus my username. I'm closing in on 40,000 lifetime miles and my next marathon will be #39. I first broke 3 at the 2002 Boston Marathon with a 2:55. I went through many years of poor/inconsistent training with some minor injuries (plantar fasciitis) until the end of 2009 when I decided to became more consistent. In 2010 I ran 200+ miles each month and broke 3 for the second time with another 2:55. In 2011 I ran 250+ miles each month and ran 3 marathons in a span of 2 months in 2:48, 2:41, and 2:39:31. The last is still my PR. Since then I've had a few injuries (tibia stress fracture in 2014 and a fractured ankle in December 2017 being the major ones) but otherwise have continued to run a lot of miles. I've broken 2:45 every year since 2011 except 2012 where I ran 2:50 in the furnace that was the Boston Marathon. I feel fortunate to still be out chasing a PR after so many miles and races. Most of my training is done by running to/from work and I have a stand-up bike (bionic runner) that I use quite a bit as well.
Madison - welcome board! Always good to get some really fast people in here. look forward to hearing from you more.
My week is done early. I am taking my annual golf trip this weekend, and I can't squeeze in any more runs. It'll force me to do 3 quality workouts next week, but shouldn't be a big deal. I've done plenty of 7 day stretches with 3 quality days in it (something like Sunday, Wednesday, Saturday), but it just looks scarier because it's occurring on a traditional Monday-Sunday period. Still getting destroyed by the humidity here. Wednesday's Q workout was total garbage, but I'm okay with it. 20 miler on Sunday, plus temps at 83 and dew point at 73 will do that to you. Just really can't wait for fall to come.
Weekly SummaryMonday, Aug 06, 2018 thru Sunday, Aug 12, 2018
My week is done early. I am taking my annual golf trip this weekend, and I can't squeeze in any more runs.
Is speed golf an option?
Re: hydration -- I've used waist belts for a few years. I like them -- Nathan brand is what I have. They always feel clunky and sloshy the first few miles, but maybe it's just me that is clunky and sloshy. Because after 2 miles, I start feeling pretty good, and the hydration belt is unnoticeable to me. Handhelds seem ok, but I feel a bit off-balance carrying them, especially when they are full.
madisonrunner: Fast AND from a really cool city! I am a Badger -- undergrad in the early 80s. I remember when the Badger Men and Women's XC teams won the NCAA titles at the same meet! Welcome!
Mikkey: I started doing some strength training about a year ago (strength and mobility, or SAM in my workout log). For me, it is important for injury prevention (perhaps more true for us over 50?), but there is a performance aspect to it, too. I do this stuff immediately following a run -- an easy routine on easy days (10-15 minutes of mostly core and flexibility stuff), and a harder routine after hard days (20 minutes or more, with squats and lunges and plyo exercises before finishing off with the same core and flexibility stuff I do on the easy days). Do you have a specific routine you follow? My thinking is that the extra 15-20 minutes is better spent doing this strength work, rather than running for the additional 15-20 minutes and not doing the work.
I am now in week 10 of the Pfitz 18/85. I was close to 80 mpw the last 3 weeks, and this week is a "cut-back" week, all the way down to about 70 miles, before a really big week (>85 scheduled) next week. (I never would have considered 70 a cut-back week in any prior cycle.) There was a VO2Max workout on Wednesday this week, the first one in the schedule so far. 6 x 800m @ 5k pace. The first repeat felt like death, the second was faster and felt a little better, the third was the fastest and felt great, and the rest got tougher (but not as bad as the first). Felt fantastic afterwards! There is almost a 2-week gap between the 1st and 2nd VO2 workouts, which seems odd to me, although the book downplays the importance of these workouts in a marathon training cycle. A 16 mile LR coming up on Sunday should feel relatively easy, but the following week has the big 24-miler. Kinda looking forward to that.
Hey all - just a slightly belated 'unlurk' here as it seems Mikkey was talking up my credentials re strength training! Had a good HM a week ago (just outside PB... but the course wasn't certified and had a few slow spots) and have regional 10km champs coming up this weekend - hoping to beat my PB. Been good following many of you on Strava too.
BGS: Re strength training, I think a couple sessions a week is pretty manageable and should have benefits for most runners, particularly in terms of back/core strength (enabling you to hold running form under fatigue), and leg strength (injury prevention and possibly some speed benefits too). For me 5 run days/week and 2 strength days is a good mix, but most of you are running higher mileage than me (I'm ~45-50 miles/week ATM) and so should probably give some thought as to how you best mix that in with your running schedule.
The key principles are:
If you have access to a gym, I've found the following is a good split:
Lower body: squats (3x6), deadlifts (3x6), calf raises (3x12), lunges (3x12), pistol squats (they're HARD but good - 3x6)
Upper body: bench press (3x6), chin-ups (3x12), standing shoulder press (3x6), cable flyer (3x10)
Then I'd do some core work both days, a mix of planks, side planks, ab crunches, lower back extensions, basically making sure you are getting the upper and lower abdominals, and obliques.
That's probably ~30 mins each and if you don't have access to a gym, you can substitute most of those with other exercises (e.g. swap push ups for bench press) or just do them without weights. Some of them require pretty good form too (e.g. deadlifts) so if you're just starting out, maybe swap some of the more technical exercises for something a little simpler.
3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)
10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)
* Net downhill course
Last race: Waterfront HM, 7 Apr, 1:15:48
Up next: Runway5, 4 May
"CONSISTENCY IS KING"