Forums >Racing>2018 Sub-3. No rules. Run.
RIP Milkman
Mikkey you may as well take down your 5 k PB enroute to sub 38 and kill 2 birds with one stone
Wow I didn't even notice that. That's a gimme, and one of those European gimmes, not American.
5K: 16:37 (11/20) | 10K: 34:49 (10/19) | HM: 1:14:57 (5/22) | FM: 2:36:31 (12/19)
Mmmm Bop
My 5k (Parkrun) PB is 18:21 from 2010. My 10k PB is 36:52 from 2011 in July (I ran 402 miles that month) and hit the turn in 17:55. I think 5k is the one distance I can improve on!
5k - 17:53 (4/19) 10k - 37:53 (11/18) Half - 1:23:18 (4/19) Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)
Yes, but don’t tell Calbears.
I don't see a problem running sub 7 paces if your mileage is up to maybe 40-50 (I am talking my age group). But if you go to 60-70-80 mpw territory, your risk to get injured at some point with those paces is 100%. And what is more important/useful - sub 7 pace with 40mpw or 9:00 pace with 70-80-90 mpw? That a decision everybody makes for himself.
paces PRs - 5K - 5:48 / 10K - 6:05 / HM - 6:14 / FM - 6:26 per mile
Totally agree, higher mileage at 8/9min/mile pace has worked well for me in the past from 10k to marathon with minimum speedwork. But there are people on lower mileage/faster paces getting great results.
Do you have abundance of examples of those people and those great results? (reasonable age group please). I don't see it worked out very well for the guy whose "inner" you were going to use. Despite all the sub 7 paces all the time.
I mentioned Marky Mark and faster paces because I’m going to focus on 10k for the next 6 weeks and he’s had great results up to the half distance. Mike Orifice (can’t remember his RW screen name) is an example of fast pace/low mileage runner, also Multi 22. And Lola who was posting earlier this year (she ran a great marathon on low mileage)
Well, there is a huge difference between marathon and HM - but you know that. I know plenty of people who beat me in HM by 4-5 minutes, run less mileage but none of them have a better FM time. Don't know anything about Marky Mark's HM results but his FM PR is just not too good for a runner who trains at sub 7 all the time - something is definitely wrong - until he only targets shorter races, of course. Mike Orifice is like 30 years old And as far as I know he used Pfitz 70-85 plan for his PR race - definitely not low mileage plan . Multi too - for his PR race in LA his max mileage week was 107 (!!!) miles. Don't know about Lola - but she might be just a outlier with natural talent.
Mark has never claimed to be training for a marathon with his current approach and has specifically said if he ever did it again, he would increase the miles and slow down. But his 1:15 half is one of the fastest on this entire board, and he really is only training for HM and 10ks at this point. There's something to be said about how he's training, plus he has the HR data to back up that it's not crazy fast.
And he is in 35-39 age group. Then it's OK - there are plenty of even older guys running that fast in training - Multi is one of them
No change in my forecast for Sunday's marathon in PA.
62ish at the start, rising to 70 at the 3 hour mark with 91-99%+ humidity the whole time. Goal is 3 hours or bust.. do not care what happens if I don't make my goal, except it would be nice to be in one piece to try again with cooler weather but a more difficult course (possible other marathons in 2 or 5 weeks after).
I have arranged to have support at miles 6,12,18,22 . Suggestions on what I should have her provide? Cold liquids from a cooler is a given, and I may even take handheld bottles the whole time to keep the temperature down. I'm trying to decide if it would be better to have a dry towel or a soaking wet towel.
Thoughts? My cold is not gone, but it is trending better so I think it will be gone by Sunday, so I want to give this a shot.
5k- 18:55 (2018) 10K- 39:04 (2017) Marathon- 3:00:10 (2018)
Sling - Good luck with the heat. I think a cold wet towel will be better than a dry one. Perhaps have some ice as well. 60s is warmer than ideal but I don't think too warm to go after your goal.
JT - Funny you say all systems go since that what I say to myself when I go for a short shake-out run a few hours before the marathon. I think I'm ready and the weather looks pretty good. Forecast is mid-50s, light rain and a nice tailwind. I'd prefer high 30s with no rain but I think the rain should help keep me cool.
slingrunner - I ran in mid 60s temps in Boston 2014 and PR-ed by almost 3 minutes comparing to CIM I ran in December (at 50s temps). Boston had all those long water lines (LA actually had longer water lines ) and I tried to grab as many water cups as possible and pour over my head - most of the times I managed to grab at least 2, sometimes 3 cups of cold (or not so cold by the end of the race) water - helped tremendously. At your support points I would have cold "drink: and caffeinated gels. Ideally (in future) I would try not to depend on support - all I need from races is water. I carry gels on my body - usually take one right before the start and then have 4 more - taking each every 5-6 miles. I run all my long runs without water and gels. I may try gels once of twice during training cycle just to make sure I will be able to consume and tolerate them during a race but then I run 20+ miles runs without water and gels. I have water fountains on my route but I avoid them on purpose - I may feel worse than I would if I take gels and water but I strongly believe in saying - "train hard fight easy" (it's a little bit different in Russian but the meaning is close). Worked just fine - marathon race is a celebration for me comparing to all hard waterless training . So, yes - water cups pouring over your head and gels. Oh, yes - if you have support points make her have cold water bottles and pour over your head in addition to what you get at race aid stations. And remember - don't ever stop while getting support/water/gels - don't break the rhythm - ever - better miss the water cup than going back or stopping. Never!
Good luck! And just try to adjust to temps and don't allow negative thoughts enter you head before and during the race!
Thanks Cal and Madison. Gels have never worked for me, but beans at least early on. I train fairly similarly... I usually just eat 10 beans or so on a 20 miler and maybe 4 water stops, but it tends to be like very hot for many of my long runs so no water seems dangerous. Impressive what you do.
The people in my life seem to always be willing to support me in marathons, and how can I say no? Even my ex girlfriend comes out of every year on her bike to help, although this year I'm traveling so that doesn't work.
I will have her dump water over my head!
I will go for 3 hours. Tracking is very minimal for this race...just an update at mile 18 and the finish, but it is available at
https://results.chronotrack.com/event/results/event/event-44220 Don't know bib yet, but search David Love
Update around 10AM eastern Sunday, and hopefully before 11AM. I only run by stopwatch, but I'd like to be at least 2 minutes ahead of 3hr pace by the 18 mile mark, with warmer temperatures and some uphills waiting at the end. There is also a real chance that I might not complete the marathon, or I even exit before mile 18, to preserve my body. I've never quit any of my marathons or ultras, so this would be pure strategy.
Slingrunner -- Is it possible to have several of your ex-girlfriends spaced every 5 miles along the marathon route to dump water on you? That would be truly amazing! Good luck on Sunday. Are you fully recovered from your cold? BTW, I know a David Love, but he doesn't look like a 3-hour marathoner.
All Sunday racers -- Good luck!! If you can post a link to a tracking site, and bib # or other info, that would be cool. Otherwise, I'll look forward to reading race reports here.
me -- My cold is still bothering me, although I was finally able to get out and run today for the first time since Sunday. I am stupidly optimistic that I will wake up Sunday morning feeling great. The weather forecast for Twin Cities is almost ideal: 44 degrees, cloudy, winds 6-8 mph (slight headwind near the end of the course). So if I feel decent, I'll shoot for sub-3. If not, I might run it and bail early, somewhere around mile 17 or so. There is another marathon in Minnesota 2 weeks later, so I might save myself and try again then. The training has gone so well for me this summer that I'd hate to have it all be for nought.
Madison: Good luck this weekend! That forecast sounds pretty good; hopefully if it rains it will just be light.
Sling: Good luck at Steamtown!
Subdood: That sounds like a reasonable plan. I hope you have that miraculous, great feeling Sunday morning. But if not you can go after it in another 2 weeks.
Any predictions for Chicago? Rupp, Farah, or someone else? I predict an East African will win, both the men's and women's races. Just not sure who it will be. Another question: between Rupp and Farah, who will win? Not sure about that one either.
2:52:16 (2018)