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Heart Rate Help (Read 1048 times)

jicama


Did we win?

    I'm hearing (from markrice and heatherruns) that It's most likely that I'm running my easy runs too hard.  Yesterday's run felt easy at 150 BPM, so I'll target that for a while and see how I feel/perform.

     

    Now, about my half-marathon on 2/3.  I was figuring that this would be my peak week with 35-40 miles and I'd taper starting next week.  Could you recommend what I should be doing between now and my race?

    2014 races"

    Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb.8, 2:22

    Umstead Trail Marathon, Raleigh, NC, Mar. 1, 5:48

    Johnston Health Champions 5K, Smithfield, NC, 26:53

    Rattler Trail Half-Marathon, Sanford, NC, 2:52 (wow)

     

    2013 races:

    Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb. 2, 1:56:40 (PR)

    New River Marathon, Todd, NC, May 4, 4:59:32 (PR)

    Triple Lakes Trail Race (40 mile), Greensboro, NC, Oct. 5, DNF after 31 miles in 7:48

      Heart rate for runners just starting out is pretty high, and trying to keep it under a certain threshold is probably counter productive.

       

      A few years ago I could not run under 160 HR without walking, and could pretty easily take it up to 185-190 range. Yesterday's 2 X Mile workout my HR averaged around 165-170 for the fast portions, and definitely could not have run much faster unless it was a race. If I want to find out my Max HR now or try to take it up to 190 (I estimate my max HR is around 195-198), it will be a pretty hard workout (or have to try it when the temps are much higher). I usually run around 9:30 pace and the workout yesterday averaged 7:24 pace on soft and soggy dirt track, close to my 5K PR pace.

      markrice


      Geezer trying for speed

        I'm hearing (from markrice and heatherruns) that It's most likely that I'm running my easy runs too hard.  Yesterday's run felt easy at 150 BPM, so I'll target that for a while and see how I feel/perform.

         

        Now, about my half-marathon on 2/3.  I was figuring that this would be my peak week with 35-40 miles and I'd taper starting next week.  Could you recommend what I should be doing between now and my race?

         

        Sounds like a reasonable rate to pick for a while. As Happyfeet pointed out, those just starting often run into high (and inconsistent it seems) heart rates compared to where they will be after consistently exercising. If you find that it's just too easy, bump it up a little until it hits the right level of effort for you. HR in that way is still very useful in helping you run with consistent effort. Only after you have been going consistently for a while would I be concerned about max HR and resting. Your maxHR may change a little as you become more fit. Your resting will change more quickly.

         

        For a taper, you've already picked a 2 week taper. If you're following a plan, it likely outlines something for you. If not, I'd just lower mileage somewhat (not drastically though) and CONTINUE most of the intensity. So if you do intervals, while I don't want you to overdo them, continue doing them. Only the last few days would I reduce the intensity (but even then, short intervals are fine maybe until 2 days before or so).

        Anyone could see races, etc. on www.markrice.com/running.

        I believe in HR training: www.markrice.com/running/heart_rate_training.html


        Queen of 3rd Place

          I started reading this thread a few days ago and was intrigued.  I usually run a 9:00 to 9:30 pace and my average HR is typically below 170, maxing in the 170s.  I ran 8x800 intervals yesterday and noticed my HR peaked at around 185 without feeling any distress.  I include this information as a reference because I don't know my formal maximum heart rate.

           

          I planned a two-hour run today and decided to try to keep my HR below 150; I got a few miles out and decided to increase the target to 160 because I can't run much and keep it below 150.  160 kept me to an 11:40 pace and I had to walk occasionally even there.  Does all this indicates that I'm not very fit?

           

          I deny that conclusion!  I reject your reality and substitute my own.  My reality says I can finish a half in two hours on 2/3/13.

           

          You are running your daily, bread-and-butter runs at your predicted HM race pace?

           

          MTA: sorry Heather, I see you've already pointed this out.

          Ex runner

          jicama


          Did we win?

             

            You are running your daily, bread-and-butter runs at your predicted HM race pace?

             

            MTA: sorry Heather, I see you've already pointed this out.

             

            I'll find out in a few weeks if I've been running too fast or if I'm a sandbagger. :-)

            2014 races"

            Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb.8, 2:22

            Umstead Trail Marathon, Raleigh, NC, Mar. 1, 5:48

            Johnston Health Champions 5K, Smithfield, NC, 26:53

            Rattler Trail Half-Marathon, Sanford, NC, 2:52 (wow)

             

            2013 races:

            Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb. 2, 1:56:40 (PR)

            New River Marathon, Todd, NC, May 4, 4:59:32 (PR)

            Triple Lakes Trail Race (40 mile), Greensboro, NC, Oct. 5, DNF after 31 miles in 7:48

            J-L-C


              When I started running I did so with a hrm almost immediately. I found it pretty useless. If I tried to keep it under 80% maxhr I would have ended up walking up even the slightest little hills. Instead I kept on using pace and exertion levels and the hr came down incrementally over the next year. I strongly feel that if I would have tried to stay under a certain % from the beginning as a new runner I would have improved much more slowly. 

               

              On the whole, I still find it useless for training purposes. During a run I don't actually even use it. There's just too much variation. My AM runs will be 5-10 beats higher at an equal or lower speed than my PM runs. Really cold days will cause it to be lower. Hot and/or humid days will cause it to be higher. Days with a dewpoint over 70 will cause it to be really high. During weeks of heavy training my hr will be much lower. If I take a day off then the first run or two back my hr will be much higher. 

               

              None of that has so much to do with my actual running, though. Some days I need to run slowly, much more slowly than the hr would indicate. And some days I am running at a pace that perfectly fits what I need to be doing for that day, but my hr will be much lower than it would be if I were doing that same pace in a taper/rested state. If I were to push hard enough to get my hr up to where it should be then I'd be digging myself a dangerous hole. And during the summer I'll be running easy enough to accomplish what I need to accomplish even though my hrm would be showing me some fairly high numbers.

               

              The only thing I really use hr for over the last year or so is to evaluate cumulative fatigue (consistently lower and lower hrs) and as a comparison to previous months and years (faster speeds at the same or lower hrs).

               

              So all of that is just to say that in my opinion, hr is but one factor that has to be taken into account. And it's one of the least reliable and least important factors when it comes to training.

              jicama


              Did we win?

                I just finished 14.4 miles at an average HR of 153.  It got a little higher in the last few miles, but I was doing pretty well keeping it around 150.  I don't think I could have finished this run if I hadn't used my HR to determine my "easy run" pace" (ave 9:58).

                 

                Thanks, Heart Rate Help thread. Smile

                2014 races"

                Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb.8, 2:22

                Umstead Trail Marathon, Raleigh, NC, Mar. 1, 5:48

                Johnston Health Champions 5K, Smithfield, NC, 26:53

                Rattler Trail Half-Marathon, Sanford, NC, 2:52 (wow)

                 

                2013 races:

                Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb. 2, 1:56:40 (PR)

                New River Marathon, Todd, NC, May 4, 4:59:32 (PR)

                Triple Lakes Trail Race (40 mile), Greensboro, NC, Oct. 5, DNF after 31 miles in 7:48

                jicama


                Did we win?

                   

                  I'll find out in a few weeks if I've been running too fast or if I'm a sandbagger. :-)

                   

                  I finished in 1:56:40; I put some details over here.  I ignored my heart-rate during this race, but I'll pay attention to it in my training runs.

                  2014 races"

                  Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb.8, 2:22

                  Umstead Trail Marathon, Raleigh, NC, Mar. 1, 5:48

                  Johnston Health Champions 5K, Smithfield, NC, 26:53

                  Rattler Trail Half-Marathon, Sanford, NC, 2:52 (wow)

                   

                  2013 races:

                  Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb. 2, 1:56:40 (PR)

                  New River Marathon, Todd, NC, May 4, 4:59:32 (PR)

                  Triple Lakes Trail Race (40 mile), Greensboro, NC, Oct. 5, DNF after 31 miles in 7:48

                  markrice


                  Geezer trying for speed

                     

                    I finished in 1:56:40; I put some details over here.  I ignored my heart-rate during this race, but I'll pay attention to it in my training runs.

                     

                    Big congratulations jicama. I read your more detailed post and it seems like a great first Half Marathon! Congrat's on beating your time goal too!

                    Anyone could see races, etc. on www.markrice.com/running.

                    I believe in HR training: www.markrice.com/running/heart_rate_training.html

                    jicama


                    Did we win?

                      Thanks, markrice.  I think my ever-increasing heart rate during the race says something about my fitness.  Would you say this is expected when ignoring heart rate and just "giving it all I've got"?

                      2014 races"

                      Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb.8, 2:22

                      Umstead Trail Marathon, Raleigh, NC, Mar. 1, 5:48

                      Johnston Health Champions 5K, Smithfield, NC, 26:53

                      Rattler Trail Half-Marathon, Sanford, NC, 2:52 (wow)

                       

                      2013 races:

                      Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb. 2, 1:56:40 (PR)

                      New River Marathon, Todd, NC, May 4, 4:59:32 (PR)

                      Triple Lakes Trail Race (40 mile), Greensboro, NC, Oct. 5, DNF after 31 miles in 7:48

                      markrice


                      Geezer trying for speed

                        Thanks, markrice.  I think my ever-increasing heart rate during the race says something about my fitness.  Would you say this is expected when ignoring heart rate and just "giving it all I've got"?

                         

                        Yes, that would be typical. If someone runs at high effort the entire way, they're likely to see an increasing heart rate. The better the conditioning and execution, the more even the effort would be, and HR would only drift up 6-10 or so BPM on average (more during the blast at the end... but that's not HR drift for similar effort... that's a blast of effort)

                         

                        Congratulations again. Well done.

                        Anyone could see races, etc. on www.markrice.com/running.

                        I believe in HR training: www.markrice.com/running/heart_rate_training.html


                        Dad of a real runner

                           

                          Yes, that would be typical. If someone runs at high effort the entire way, they're likely to see an increasing heart rate. The better the conditioning and execution, the more even the effort would be, and HR would only drift up 6-10 or so BPM on average (more during the blast at the end... but that's not HR drift for similar effort... that's a blast of effort)

                           

                          Congratulations again. Well done.

                          Yep, my recent 10K would confirm this.  I posted some info on another post (http://www.runningahead.com/forums/topic/beb1af826ac245b3ab2e1277ac6321ae/1)

                          but the per mile increase was 144, 150, 150, 153, 154, 155, 157 (last .2) and all of this at roughly even pace.

                          markrice


                          Geezer trying for speed

                            Yep, my recent 10K would confirm this.  I posted some info on another post (http://www.runningahead.com/forums/topic/beb1af826ac245b3ab2e1277ac6321ae/1)

                            but the per mile increase was 144, 150, 150, 153, 154, 155, 157 (last .2) and all of this at roughly even pace.

                             

                            Congratulations to you too Still bluesky... and jicama...

                            Both of you really did well. Great performances!

                            Anyone could see races, etc. on www.markrice.com/running.

                            I believe in HR training: www.markrice.com/running/heart_rate_training.html

                              I amBre and jjcama -- excellent runners for puppets. Hi Markrice! Nice job with the website.

                              jicama


                              Did we win?

                                [...] excellent runners for puppets [...]

                                 

                                What's that mean?  I try to put the best possible construction on the things people say, but this doesn't look constructive.

                                2014 races"

                                Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb.8, 2:22

                                Umstead Trail Marathon, Raleigh, NC, Mar. 1, 5:48

                                Johnston Health Champions 5K, Smithfield, NC, 26:53

                                Rattler Trail Half-Marathon, Sanford, NC, 2:52 (wow)

                                 

                                2013 races:

                                Heart & Sole Half-Marathon,  Goldsboro, NC, Feb. 2, 1:56:40 (PR)

                                New River Marathon, Todd, NC, May 4, 4:59:32 (PR)

                                Triple Lakes Trail Race (40 mile), Greensboro, NC, Oct. 5, DNF after 31 miles in 7:48

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