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800m pacing advice? (Read 247 times)

    My advice would be to shoot for 5:00 for 1600.  Not now, but three years from now.  Find out what you can run by running, not by asking random strangers on some message board.  The people here are well meaning but are mostly experienced runners for whom improvement is a slow process; you're just starting out and should improve faster than most people would predict.  Create a crazy, far off goal for yourself and work towards that, not a week-by-week 2-5 second improvement because those will slow down as you get faster.

     

    After my first 800 as a freshman in high school (2:14), I told myself that I was going to run under 2:00 and win the state championship.  By the time I graduated, I had run 1:59 with two 4x800m state championships.  Running takes a long time to get good.  Decide you're going to get good and work towards that with a long-term view.  Work hard and the improvements will come.

     

    I didn't feel up to running an 800 time trial today but I figured it's been awhile since I tried a 400 so I ran one today.  And I am super super happy about it, because I timed it at 73.9!  Obviously it's not going to be a super accurate time since I was timing myself, but the 78 was timed the same way so I think that's a pretty big improvement!  I was expecting 77 or 76 so I'm pretty happy about this, haha.

     

    So, based on (approximately) 6:50 for 1600m and 74s for 400m, what do you guys think I should aim for now?

    Walker23


      wcrunner: Thanks, I like the look of those times so I hope you're right Smile

       

      Lane:  You definitely have a point, I'm pretty prone to obsessing over the numbers when I should just be

      running more and running harder.  Although it's motivating to think that I could run faster, I don't want to get too complacent with it.

       

      I do have a few goals right now, my long-term goal is to break 6:00 in the mile someday.  For this season my goal is 6:30 or, if I get there, 6:20.  Another goal of mine is to PR for 3 miles at or before XC tryouts next year-- I'm planning on running lot more miles this summer than last summer.  A sort of silly goal of mine is to make the tryout time for every track event (the running ones) next year, since I'm pretty much borderline on those.


      Good Grief!

        wcrunner: Thanks, I like the look of those times so I hope you're right Smile

         

        Lane:  You definitely have a point, I'm pretty prone to obsessing over the numbers when I should just be

        running more and running harder.  Although it's motivating to think that I could run faster, I don't want to get too complacent with it.

         

        I do have a few goals right now, my long-term goal is to break 6:00 in the mile someday.  For this season my goal is 6:30 or, if I get there, 6:20.  Another goal of mine is to PR for 3 miles at or before XC tryouts next year-- I'm planning on running lot more miles this summer than last summer.  A sort of silly goal of mine is to make the tryout time for every track event (the running ones) next year, since I'm pretty much borderline on those.

         

        You should remove that "some day" from your 6:00 in the mile goal. That will come a lot sooner than you might expect, perhaps even this year. The times I mentioned are what I think you can run now under good conditions. While I like the concept of setting high long term goals, they need to be realistic as well. Not every HS boy is going to be able to run sub-2:00 for 800m and not every girl is going to be able to run sub-5:00 for the mile/1600m. As you get to know the other girls on the team and what they ran when they started, you'll get a better idea of the rate and amount of progress you can expect, also depending of course on how much and how hard you want to train.

         

        An aside to Lane: Some of us well meaning, experienced runners for whom improvement is a slow process, may know what we are talking about anyway, since some of us also coached at the HS level.

        2018 Goals: taking suggestions
        2018 Races: NC 24

        Walker23


          wcrunner2: Sorry, I don't really understand, are you saying my goals are too ambitious or not as long term as I thought they were?  It's not that I don't respect your opinion that I could go 6:30, but I wonder if running 6:50 so easily was really reflective of where I am or it was just a crazy fluke.

           

          Also, as a note, as far as improvement goes, if I ever got fast enough then I'd go into the more intense training group, which might help combat the inevitable improvement slowdown.  I'm a long way from that, though, since I can't even keep up with my current group half the time.

            I didn't mean to offend - I wasn't clear.  What I really meant to say was: "Back in my day, we didn't ask strangers on the internet how fast we could run, we just said how fast we were going to run and then did or didn't.  Now turn down that hippy music and get off my lawn"

             

            In all seriousness, I was trying to be respectful but fell short - all of the advice was solid.  I was trying to convey a completely different concept about shooting for lofty goals in the future and focusing on process rather than results in the early stages.

            An aside to Lane: Some of us well meaning, experienced runners for whom improvement is a slow process, may know what we are talking about anyway, since some of us also coached at the HS level.

              I'm a bit late to the party, but I think everyone here was spot-on with the advice.  I focused on the 800m in high school track.  For me, it was go out fast and try to hold on.  I ran a 65 second 400m and a 2:35 800m if memory serves.  I was aiming for provincials in the 800m (2:33 or faster) but sadly I got injured in my last year.

              'No matter how slow you go, you're still lapping everyone on the couch'

               

              "Running is a big question mark that's there each and every day. It asks you, 'Are you going to be a wimp or are you going to be strong today?'"  - Peter Maher

               

              "Running long and hard is an ideal antidepressant, since it's hard to run and feel sorry for yourself at the same time. Also, there are those hours of clearheadedness that follow a long run."  -Monte Davis

                Very good point(s)!   In general, especially for the 800m and most short races, it's best to turn off the governor and see what you can do. Sure, you may crash and burn, but you'll have a better idea next time. When the distance gets much longer, pacing is more important to pay attention to.

                 

                "Back in my day, we didn't ask strangers on the internet how fast we could run, we just said how fast we were going to run and then did or didn't.  Now turn down that hippy music and get off my lawn"

                 


                I've got a fever...

                  Very good point(s)!   In general, especially for the 800m and most short races, it's best to turn off the governor and see what you can do. Sure, you may crash and burn, but you'll have a better idea next time. When the distance gets much longer, pacing is more important to pay attention to.

                   

                   

                  Definitely agree.  There's a lot of trial and error that goes into finding your sweet spot in the 800m.

                   

                  FWIW, I ran my best 800m running even splits.  It was a one-time fluke that I was unable to replicate, but it happened.  My typical race was usually 59-68 or 60-68, but there was one time when I ran 62-62.  The first lap actually felt easy because it  was slower than usual, and I attempted to kick with 300m left like I would in the mile. The last 100m was the most painful homestretch of my entire life, but I was thrilled with the time (and the lead -- it was leadoff leg of the 4x800).

                   

                  Of course the other part about that run that that fluky and that I was unable to replicate was that there was a particular girl in the stands that day...

                  On your deathbed, you won't wish that you'd spent more time at the office.  But you will wish that you'd spent more time running.  Because if you had, you wouldn't be on your deathbed.

                     

                     

                    Of course the other part about that run that that fluky and that I was unable to replicate was that there was a particular girl in the stands that day...

                     

                    You didn't invite her to more races?

                    Walker23


                      At our most recent race I ran 6:34 in the 1600 and 2:50.6 in the 800, so it seems wcrunner is on the right track with their predictions.  It was definitely not properly paced (the pack started off fast and I didn't hang back far enough), so I think 6:30 would be doable as well.  My halves were 3:10 and 3:24 so that can use some work.

                       

                      I'm really happy with those for now, I won't get complacent with it but I exceeded my expectations so I'm happy about that Smile


                      Good Grief!

                        Congratulations. Slightly better pacing will put you under 6:30. 6:15 or even 6:00 is not out of the realm of possibility. I can also see you running sub-2:45 and possibly even 2:40.

                        2018 Goals: taking suggestions
                        2018 Races: NC 24

                        Walker23


                          Update:

                           

                          At our last race I ran all three events, I got 6:30 in the 1600, 2:48 in the 800, and 16:56 in the 3200.  No, that's not a typo, though I wish it was.  It definitely wasn't my best effort, but I didn't really feel like I could pick it as much as I should be able to.  For some reason, running too slowly for more than a few minutes tends to make my legs hurt.  The 800 actually felt like the easiest 800 I've run, so I think getting that time down a little more is doable.

                          tomkim


                            Psychology plays big part as well. Keep visioning yourself finishing the run in x seconds etc.

                            Walker23


                              Good point.  Visualization is definitely a big part of my strategy for races.

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