Goal of sub 20 5k (Read 13664 times)

Yes, it is true.  It takes some time for the mileage increase to show impact.  Since I am training for a half and a full towards the end of the year, for me, yesterday's race is not a goal race so I didn't really do any sort of taper for it.

 

I agree with this.  To use an analogy it's like you were cramming for a test.  I just don't see where a short term, last minute, increase in mileage helps all that much.

I will work on the middle part of my training runs  to do faster stuff from now on t get used to running hard in middle of runs.

This to me seems to be a mental thing.  I too have a hard time maintaining effort in that second mile.  For me I think I need to trust that I am trained enough to hold that effort through 5K.  I know my last race I was really questioning things just before the first mile marker but pushed anyway.  I dropped off a little mile 2 but is was much better than in prior races.

I'm not sure that I would be able to learn this in training, time trials, etc.  I think I just need to race more 5K's.

 

I'm not sure that I would be able to learn this in training, time trials, etc.  I think I just need to race more 5K's.

When I was younger I took swimming lessons a few times.

When they told me to just kick my legs and pump my arms to swim I tried and believed it would work but

I sank to the bottom like a rock. It seems like these swimming lessons were just a 1 hour class of holding a dock and kicking my feet. I was still terrified of drowning as I hated it when water got into my lungs but I liked to play in shallow water.

Anyhow one day I went on vacation to New Jersey and we visited some friends who had an above ground pool about 42 inches deep. I went there every day to play hanging on the rafts and whatnot. It was the 3rd or 4th straight day I was there that all of a sudden I kicked my legs and pumped my arms and lo and behold I was swimming! I am sure the reason I learned to swim was that I was comfortable with my surroundings. I had been there before and the fear was gone. I could see the bottom. It was not that deep so I could stand up if I wanted too.

So I think you are also correct that if you run a bunch of 5ks....preferably the same course over and over you can become familiar with what you can do and where your limits are.

I would call it running what you think is above your ability.

FROM A TRAINING RUN LAST YEAR.

2 WEEKS AFTER THIS RUN I RACED A 19:36.

Despite all the warnings I went out last night and ran a 5k time tria all alone on my made up loop in my neighborhood. It was about 74 degrees but the sun was setting and I was in the midst of my highest mileage week ever so I felt pretty strong. I ran my road loop which is not certified to be certain but its pretty close and i can compare with previous times. It does have one long hill to ascend. It ends near the start but the end is probably about 10 feet higher in elevation than the start. I started comfortably hard and hit half mile in 3:14. I thought wow only 6 of these piece of cake. I got to the mile mark in 6:30 and seriously mulled over giving up. This is the diff between time trials and races. I would never have that thought in a race. But I kept going and went up the steep hill to hit 1.5 miles in 9:52. So the hill had put me behind sub 20 pace...but now I would hit the turnaround and descend that same hill. I thought I better put on a surge to get my time back. I lengthened the stride and barreled down the hill. When I hit the flat and the bottom I continued to run hard in an attempt to get to 2 miles in 13 minutes. I did well as I reached the 2 mile mark in 13:03. I was surprised that I wasn't dead tired at this point for I had put in a hard effort for the last half mile. But I thought only a mile to go...I wanted to hit 2.5 miles in 16:15 or so to keep a 6:30 per mile pace. It is very hard to run what you think is above your ability. But I had no choice. To break 20 and see if I could do it I wanted to attempt it in practice. I ran hard and hit 2.5 miles in 16:17. Wow this is going to be close but now I knew I had a chance to break 20. I ran the next quarter mile in about 96 seconds so my time was around 17:43...then it was uphill to the 3 mile mark. I just wanted to get to the mailbox marking 3 miles in 19:24 or less so I put in a 60 second surge as I knew I would have something left for the final tenth if I had a chance to beat 20. I hit the 3 mile mark in 19:21 and knew I had broken 20. I hadn't really measured the .106 miles past this mailbox exactly so I just ran hard until my watch read 20 minutes then marked the spot where I was. I thought for sure I was well past 3.106 miles but when I paced from the 3 mile mark it measured 3 miles and 586 feet....which is 3.11 miles. Ok so my time for last nights 5k was about 19:59 but who knows if it was 5k or not ?.. I am not counting it as a record or anything...but it does beat my old time trial loop record by 28 seconds I do know I am capable of this now and what it will take. I must keep the sub 20 pace as much of the race as I can. There will be hills where I will fall off the pace. But by throwing in 2-3 minutes surges of what feels like 4k race pace I can get a few seconds back. My half mile splits 3:14 3:16 3:22 (uphill) 3:11 (downhill) 3:14 3:03 0:38 last tenth (hard to believe this was so slow. I thought for sure I could run this in 34 seconds...maybe I used all the energy on the rest of the race)

I would call it running what you think is above your ability.

 

 

I increase my effort (this is not a surge) to maintain the same pace, as such  I don't think it's above my ability.    That holds true, unless I went out at a suicidal pace and that'd be my own stupid fault.

What was your mile 1 split for you 19:36 PR?  6:12 or something like that?  Why not run 6:20 all the way?  That's not beyond your abilities.  In fact, mentally, it's easier than thinking you have to throw down a fast mile 3.

 

 

I increase my effort (this is not a surge) to maintain the same pace, as such  I don't think it's above my ability.    That holds true, unless I went out at a suicidal pace and that'd be my own stupid fault.

 

What was your mile 1 split for you 19:36 PR?  6:12 or something like that?  Why not run 6:20 all the way?  That's not beyond your abilities.  In fact, mentally, it's easier than thinking you have to throw down a fast mile 3.

I ran 6:18, 6:30, 6:13 splits for my PR 5k. I still had the lull in mile 2 but my 1st mile was pretty close to the average for the race. Would you say that your 1st mile in a 5k is fairly easy then? Or comfortably hard? My 1st mile yesterday seemed fairly easy but I definately had to put some effort to earn a 6:24 mile split. The 2nd mile seemed tougher than the 1st mile but I hit a 6:47 split. Maybe I ran the 1st mile too hard. Its something I need to figure out. With few races it is hard to figure these things out I suppose.

Some fun with pacing for me this afternoon. I only looked at my splits after a 3 mile run.

1st half mile =  4:23.00

2nd half mile = 4:22.94

3rd half mile = 4:39.21

4th half mile = 4:39.92

5th half mile = 4:36.25

6th half mile = 4:36.00

For what its worth I was trying for 8:30 miles. I really missed my goal but the final tallies always entertain me.

That is what I have done this year, starting with my second race.  My first race my Garmin reported mile times. They were 6:22, 6:46, 6:39 then :39.  That was in April. My second race, in May, the kilometers were 3:52, 3:53, 4:09, 4:19, and then 4:04. I haven't raced since May, but all summer I have been practicing using my Garmin to run kilometers in four minutes.

Hope you don't mind a suggestion from someone who has no business here, (I'll be lucky if I ever break 22 minutes!).

 

Being Canadian, I set my Garmin in kilometres- now to run 5k in 20 minutes you need 4 minutes per kilometre. Simple to see how you are doing, 4,8,12 etc. Having more "checkpoints" might also be helpful.

 

Obviously won't help you run better but might make the pacing simpler!

Simon.