Beginners and Beyond

12

Serious Question Ya'll (Read 98 times)

FreeSoul87


Runs4Sanity

    And I do mean serious.

    Since as far back as November of last year, it seems that every time I try to start adding lunges and squats to my workouts, the backs and sides of my thighs ache and even hurt (a lot) during runs or just throughout the day. It'll start as early as the next morning after these workouts so I have had to avoid them.

    I don't seem to have issues with donkey kicks, bridges, fire hydrants and even the hip abductor at the gym, just when I try to do squats and lunges.

    What the fuck? Any advice or thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

    *Do It For Yourself, Do It Because They Said It Was Impossible, Do It Because They Said You Were Incapable*

    PRs

    5k - 24:15 (7:49 min/mile pace) 

    10k - 51:47 (8:16 min/mile pace)

    15k -1:18:09 (8:24 min/mile pace)

    13.1 - 1:53:12 (8:39 min/mile pace)

     26:2 - 4:14:55 (9:44 min/mile)

    MarjorieAnn3137


    Run to live; live to run

      My first thought was the other exercises were all open chain (non weight bearing) but you listed bridges which negates that theory. Someone needs to look at your form and see if you are recruiting the wrong muscles, or in the wrong sequence, or using some substitution, or some variant. (Someone that know wtf they are looking at and not a bystander). My only thought is squats and lunges are in upright full weight bearing the others aren't or are open chain.  How our body works in upright is a bit different than laying down. Reaction and recruitment is a bit different. Doing exercise while lying down is needed but doesn't always translate when we start moving upright.

      Marjorie

        Someone needs to look at your form and see if you are recruiting the wrong muscles, or in the wrong sequence, or using some substitution, or some variant.

         

        I second this. I got a free training lesson when I joined my gym and realized I had been doing squats and lunges wrong for years!  Granted,  I hadn't really done them much because my "form" prevented me and they were so painful.

        5k - 25:15 (11/18/12)

        10k - 1:01:51 (2/14/15)

        10mi - 1:33:18 (3/2/14)

        HM - 2:06:12 (3/24/13)

         

        Upcoming Races:

        Benched until further notice. :/

         

        Everything you need is already inside. [[Bill Bowerman]]

        FreeSoul87


        Runs4Sanity

           

          I second this. I got a free training lesson when I joined my gym and realized I had been doing squats and lunges wrong for years!  Granted,  I hadn't really done them much because my "form" prevented me and they were so painful.

           

          I used to do them a lot, a whole lot with no issues whatsoever. But when I started upping my mileage early last year, I had to stop because my legs always seemed worn out during my runs. I figured if I can slowly get back to doing them, my legs could handle it.

          *Do It For Yourself, Do It Because They Said It Was Impossible, Do It Because They Said You Were Incapable*

          PRs

          5k - 24:15 (7:49 min/mile pace) 

          10k - 51:47 (8:16 min/mile pace)

          15k -1:18:09 (8:24 min/mile pace)

          13.1 - 1:53:12 (8:39 min/mile pace)

           26:2 - 4:14:55 (9:44 min/mile)

          MarjorieAnn3137


          Run to live; live to run

             

            I used to do them a lot, a whole lot with no issues whatsoever. But when I started upping my mileage early last year, I had to stop because my legs always seemed worn out during my runs. I figured if I can slowly get back to doing them, my legs could handle it.

             

            But you've also had some tight areas, near injury etc since then. You could be substituting and have no idea that you are or recruiting differently  because of it. It is easy to start to do something differently even slightly and not realize your body is adapting to avoid the tight areas etc.

            Marjorie

            FreeSoul87


            Runs4Sanity

               

              But you've also had some tight areas, near injury etc since then. You could be substituting and have no idea that you are or recruiting differently.

               

              Very true,  it seems that the areas that ache are the same areas that have been tight and near injury over the last couple of months. I wonder if I should instead try the leg curls and leg extensions at the gym, see about strengthening them that way?

              *Do It For Yourself, Do It Because They Said It Was Impossible, Do It Because They Said You Were Incapable*

              PRs

              5k - 24:15 (7:49 min/mile pace) 

              10k - 51:47 (8:16 min/mile pace)

              15k -1:18:09 (8:24 min/mile pace)

              13.1 - 1:53:12 (8:39 min/mile pace)

               26:2 - 4:14:55 (9:44 min/mile)

              MarjorieAnn3137


              Run to live; live to run

                Possibly. But, figuring out what the underlying issue that is causing it so you can fully address it versus throwing stuff at it without knowing the cause is important. You might get the right solution by chance. Or not.

                Marjorie

                Slymoon Runs


                race obsessed

                  My non-professional opinion is that you are likely adding too much for your fitness / legs.

                   

                  ie:  if you are going to do both - cut down on the volume of either or both exercises until you can build up.

                   

                   

                  But of course that comes from a position of *not* being a medical professional or coach as well as not watching to see if there is anything done obviously incorrect.

                  FreeSoul87


                  Runs4Sanity

                    Okay, who do I go to for stuff like this?

                    Last Friday I went ahead and did 3 sets of 12 squats, and stopped there. I was a little achy Saturday morning but I didn't run, Sunday's 8 miler didn't really have any issues at all except for some little soreness. That is definitely an improvement compared to early last month.

                    *Do It For Yourself, Do It Because They Said It Was Impossible, Do It Because They Said You Were Incapable*

                    PRs

                    5k - 24:15 (7:49 min/mile pace) 

                    10k - 51:47 (8:16 min/mile pace)

                    15k -1:18:09 (8:24 min/mile pace)

                    13.1 - 1:53:12 (8:39 min/mile pace)

                     26:2 - 4:14:55 (9:44 min/mile)

                    MarjorieAnn3137


                    Run to live; live to run

                      A good personal trainer that has some clue would work.

                      So would a Physical therapist but I don't think you need to go that high up.

                      Marjorie

                      Cyberic


                        Again, I will go against the current here. If it's hurting me, and I don't have to do it, I would stop. I might not be a strong runner, because of my weak legs, but since lunges were hurting me more and more in the groin area as I kept doing them, I had to stop hockey, and running was next. So I quit the lunges instead. After many months, I am running pain free again.

                        Half Crazy K 2.0


                          Non-professional opinion. Could just be your body adjusting to a new workout. When I started doing strength training workouts, there were times the next day I could barely get up the stairs and getting out of my seat was painful. And this was not heavy weights. Just new workouts.

                           

                          During January, I had been doing a weights & plyo workout for legs. Last Monday, I did a Body Pump-ish workout, so lots of squats & lunges. Like 3 minutes+ of squats without a break and probably similar for lunges. My legs were tight until Thursday.

                          LRB


                            A good personal trainer that has some clue would work.

                            So would a Physical therapist but I don't think you need to go that high up.

                             

                            For what it's worth I pretty much gave up squatting when running became my full time hobby as the two do not play nice wit each other. I do lunges mostly during the off-season (and even rarely then) when my mileage is low and recovery is not paramount.

                             

                            For me below the waist strength is focused on the hips, adductors and abductors. Quad and hamstring strength is not as important as quad and hamstring flexibility but we all have to figure out what is best for us.

                             

                            Your contributions to the group from a physical therapist's point of view is invaluable by the way.

                            MarjorieAnn3137


                            Run to live; live to run

                               

                              For what it's worth I pretty much gave up squatting when running became my full time hobby as the two do not play nice wit each other. I do lunges mostly during the off-season (and even rarely then) when my mileage is low and recovery is not paramount.

                               

                              For me below the waist strength is focused on the hips, adductors and abductors. Quad and hamstring strength is not as important as quad and hamstring flexibility but we all have to figure out what is best for us.

                               

                              Your contributions to the group from a physical therapist's point of view is invaluable by the way.

                               

                              Awww thanks.

                               

                              I  don't do lunges or squats either but some do. Just depends on your overall goals and needs. I have a hard enough time with some of the leg work in Pilates that I won't add extra stuff in. I'm okay with that too. Smile

                              Marjorie

                              scottydawg


                              Barking Mad To Run

                                I second, third, fourth, fifth, etc, all the good advice the good folks above gave you, FreeSoul.   You might have some musculoskeletal limitations.  For example, in my case, I am limited in a lot of "movements" I can do because of my hips and spine and my arthritis.    I am lucky in that I am retired military so I have very good medical care not available to a lot of people.  My physical therapy review was done at a military hospital and the therapist actually went WITH me to the military gym and was VERY specific with me for my exact 'limitations" in what weights I could/could not use, what exercises and stretches I should and should NOT do.   I also get follow-ups and 'flexibility testing"  from the PT annually, to monitor any changes.  VERY helpful!  The military definitely takes care of its own!   Well, maybe not the VA so much , but I think they might be getting better now.  I am thankful, however, that my medical care is done at an actual military hospital.

                                 

                                As others said,  a look at you by a knowledgeable personal trainer and/or physical therapist might be beneficial for you.  Of course, that may cost  a bit of $$.  And as a suggestion, you may first want to get a complete physical by your primary care doc just to rule out there is no underlying issue (ligament problems, muscle tears, arthritic joints [yes, even 20-somethings can get arthritis!], or whatever) and then go from there.   Of course, all this may cost you some $$, especially if some things are not covered by your insurance,  so you definitely have a decision to make in that regard....how far are you willing to go, and how much is your health and the ability to stay active worth to you?    I wish you all the best!

                                "Do what you can, with what you have, where you are." Theodore Roosevelt

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