I picked Hansons over Pfitz for pretty stupid reasons. (1) I did not think I would want to wake up early enough to do 15 miles in the morning before work for midweek MLRs. Although as it turned out I did routinely up to 14 with Hansons tempos including wu/cd. (2) I did not really want to do doubles. The reasons for this one were even dumber. One is my wife would think I'm crazier than she already does - all the running I do is not enough, now some days I have to run twice? The other is the extra laundry. Actually I did read a lot of threads here with people stating pros & cons of each. And the thing that stuck with me most was the benefit of a high % of miles at MP or faster. Which Hansons apparently has more of, although I did not compare them directly to verify this. Anyway, I'm sure anyone would do well with either.
I picked Hansons over Pfitz for pretty stupid reasons.
(1) I did not think I would want to wake up early enough to do 15 miles in the morning before work for midweek MLRs. Although as it turned out I did routinely up to 14 with Hansons tempos including wu/cd.
(2) I did not really want to do doubles. The reasons for this one were even dumber. One is my wife would think I'm crazier than she already does - all the running I do is not enough, now some days I have to run twice? The other is the extra laundry.
Actually I did read a lot of threads here with people stating pros & cons of each. And the thing that stuck with me most was the benefit of a high % of miles at MP or faster. Which Hansons apparently has more of, although I did not compare them directly to verify this.
Anyway, I'm sure anyone would do well with either.
I actually did up to 16 on Thursdays with 3 wu / 10 at MP / 3 cd on Hansons. But for some reason that doesn't seem as daunting as doing 15 easy. Because the MP part of it makes it more interesting, challenging, over more quickly? Something along those lines.
delicate flower
15 easy, I mean at a truly easy effort, sounds like sheer torture.
<3
Yes. Especially in the winter. Probably why Lily ends up running them at MP.
Are you looking at a local coach or online such as McMillan? I'm curious what they would have you do. More miles? Less miles, more quality?
Yes. Especially in the winter. Probably why Lily ends up running them at MP. Are you looking at a local coach or online such as McMillan? I'm curious what they would have you do. More miles? Less miles, more quality?
I'd probably go with someone that I am referred to. I'm pretty plugged in to the local running and triathlon scene so I'm sure I'll get a few names once I put the word out that I'm looking for a coach. I know at least two who'd like to train me but I'm not sure they'd be right for me. One coaches for destination races, and the other follows the "run less, run faster" methodology.
Lurking and thought I'd point out... Pfitz' medium runs are not "easy" (as in slow, steady, distance). He has recommended paces for most long and medium runs but I think most people skip that part and go straight to the schedules. But, most of the runs, (he doesn't say how many) are supposed to be a third at an easy pace, a third @ MP+20%, and a third @ MP+10%. It's definitely not as hard as a weekly MP effort like Hansons, but you're supposed to be pushing the pace a little.
My blog is JT Running DC. It's awesome. Guide to Washington DC Area Running Routes. Guide to the New York City Marathon. Guide to the Boston Marathon. Guide to Running Gear. Guide to Running Clothes.
No, only five months if I want to get in to 2016! Realistically, training through the winter, I can probably pick up a few minutes but 9 sounds like kind of a stretch.
No, only five months if I want to get in to 2016!
Realistically, training through the winter, I can probably pick up a few minutes but 9 sounds like kind of a stretch.
My instinct is always to tell people to go for it, but yeah, 9 minutes in five months does sound like a lot to ask.
Would it be wrong to use elements of both Hansons and Pfitz? Like the medium LR at MP a la Hansons and the speedwork a la Pftiz? I find the rest is very similar anyway... That's probably what I have done for the last 4 years. Is there anything wrong with that?
PRs: Boston Marathon, 3:27, April 15th 2013
Cornwall Half-Marathon, 1:35, April 27th 2013
18 marathons, 18 BQs since 2010
I would think that's fine... I think the key is that Pfitz medium and long runs are supposed to uptempo efforts; not slow, steady, distance. How fast you do them - MP, % of MP, progression - is probably debatable. As someone who has followed Pfitz plans a lot, I just like to point that out in the Hansons vs Pfitz discussions. It's not as much MP work but it's not like it's just those 4 MP efforts. You are running MP+15% (on average) twice a week PLUS a tempo or interval workout. Hardly a walk in the park.
That's a good way to look at it. I was more interested in training ideals and philosophies than any particular structured plan. Or the why as I have come to refer to it.
Same here. I'll probably end up running my first marathon without a canned plan, but following somewhat Daniels' philosophy and paces. I really like to know the why.
It really is the most intelligent approach, there is no doubt. I say that I do not need to know why, but I DO know the why and how. I am just too damn spontaneous to apply what I know to my training all of the time. I like going by feel instead. Our lives are so regulated and boxed in that I make a point to give freedom to my running. As long as the results are not disastrous, of course... But as I said above, like most people here, I am also OCD when it comes to following plans. I just mix workouts from different plans, based on my own personal schedule and liking.
Thanks, Julia! I've also mostly used Pfitz since I started running marathons and he is still my favorite.
Refurbished Hip
You people are weird.
Anyway, I know nothing about marathons and all this training talk, but congrats on the huge PR, Babs! I know you'll continue to kick ass and knock time off and get down to that BQ!
Running is dumb.
You people are weird. Anyway, I know nothing about marathons and all this training talk, but congrats on the huge PR, Babs! I know you'll continue to kick ass and knock time off and get down to that BQ!
What's weird about not liking that, Mandy? I can see myself enjoying a leisurely 15 miler on a Saturday morning, in the woods, but to do the same 15 miler after work, on the streets, at a slow pace, is like mental cruelty. Running it fast isn't easier physically, but mentally, it gives a purpose to the run and makes it easier to focus without losing interest.
I think 2-3 hour runs at a leisurely pace are some of my favorite runs, that's all. In the midst of hard marathon training, I don't know. I've never done it. Sounds like a nice way to spend a summer evening though. Probably not winter, but most winter nights are dark and cold anyway.
When I did Hansons, for an 8:00 mile goal, he had me doing the long runs at an 8:40 pace I believe. MP+10% would be 8:48. MP + 15% would be a 9:12 pace. I don't think I did any of my easy runs slower than that. Unless it was a the day after a hard workout.
Weirdo.