I also think the shoes, the pacers, etc., are not determinative.  A huge part if the runner's ability and mental state.  He has shown that he has the qualities of someone capable of doing something like this.  But it's not the shoes or the pacers, etc.  It all helped but without him it wouldn't have been done this year, IMO.

I also think the shoes, the pacers, etc., are not determinative.  A huge part if the runner's ability and mental state.  He has shown that he has the qualities of someone capable of doing something like this.  But it's not the shoes or the pacers, etc.  It all helped but without him it wouldn't have been done this year, IMO.

Well he’s certainly one of the few, but maybe not the only - the top elites all have the same kind of qualities. Bekele came within 2 sec of Kipchoge’s WR. Anyway, considering the shape Kipchoge’s clearly in and the conditions, I’m interested in what he would have done if he just ran Chicago instead.

I am surprised they were able to run that fast on Sunday because the 30mph gusts and the headwind for most of the tough miles on the course was brutal.

Brigid had 2 pacers running in front of her for most of the way, prob shielded the wind

 

Yeah, I still don't know what on earth he is talking about or what got his rambling going. I mean I haven't looked for discussions on this, but apparently he is saying that the shoes both wore during their record-breaking marathons aren't even out on shelves yet and were prototypes. Basically he and others would like to know how on Earth to top marathon athletes were able to shave 2 minutes of their times, I guess it is a lot harder for top athletes to improve more than they already are 

Maybe this will clarify it a little.

 

I just have a hard time believing that shoes/technology can do more work than the body can... like I seriously doubt the shoes either of them wore would help me in any major way 

But then again, I don't really understand shoe technology, I just wear the shoes that the LRS tells me is best for my feet.

Have you ever had one of those Nike's in your hand or on your feet? You can tell immediately that it's a very different shoe. There was significant engineering that went into those shoes. What struck me the most was that the carbon fiber makes it so you can barely torque it with your hands.  Even if they are under 1% more efficient than a regular shoe, the benefit would be over 30 seconds in a 2 hour marathon.

The guy (Magness) is saying that based on (bla bla bla ... everything he said), it is pretty clear the shoes are the reason why we see such jumps in WRs in the past 2 years, and that they should be banned.

I don't see the problem with his argument. Now do I agree with his conclusion? That's another story.

I have never held a nike, I've pretty much just gone for the shoes I've been told to wear or purchase them online.... I never once thought there was a huge amount of difference other than that mine are more for support and stability and I'll never be able to wear a shoe made for fast racers.

In my own experience simply shifting from racing in training shoes to racing in lightweight racing flats made a difference of at least several seconds per mile. These high tech shoes that Kipchoge wore would be even more effective and could easily explain the difference between his WR time and his Breaking2 and INEOS159 times.

Any women on here run in the vaporfly? I thought about jumping on the bandwagon for a racing shoe, but it being technically all men’s sizing makes me nervous