Although Hansons and Pfitz are still very possible, I am considering Daniel’s 4 week cycle program. It is designed to include two Q sessions each week, for three consecutive weeks, followed  by a 4th week of no Q sessions. The non-Q week contains just E running and also peak weekly mileage.

Q1 is usually (it would be for me) on Sunday, and Q2 on Wednesday or Thursday.

The program is 26 weeks long, but I would jump in where there is 18 or 19 weeks left (I have to do the math).

As for pacing, he suggests starting to train at 3 VDOT paces below a recent race result, and increasing  the paces for 1 VDOT value every 8 weeks (for 26 weeks, I’d adapt that for my amount of weeks).

Here is what it would look like for me. My peak mileage to be 65-70 miles/week.

I didn’t feel like writing down the details of Mixed paces workouts  but here are two examples :

2 E + 3T + 3 min rest + 2T + 3 min rest + 5x(3 min H w/2 min jg) + 8x(200R w/200 jg) + 2E

2 E + 6x(1T w/1 min rest) +  4x(200 R w/200 jg) + 2x(1T w/1 min jg) +  4x(400R w/400 jg) + 2E

For paces, I’d start out at VDOT 48 (E=8:13-9:15, M= 7:32, T=7:02), then with 13 weeks to go I’d move up to VDOT 49 (E=8:05-9:06, M= 7:24, T=6:56), and with 7 weeks to go, to 50 (E=7:57-8:58, M= 7:17, T=6:50)

What I do like about this :

The mid-week workout has a lot of variety, and maybe I could train with a local running club on the track on Wednesdays.

What I don’t like :

Jay and a local coach I know here both claim that they do 25-33% of their mileage at MP or faster. I have not done the math, but I don’t think this program has as much mileage at MP or faster.

Anyone care to share their thoughts or give an opinion?

I have the book and the Daniels plan you are considering looks brutal. Conversely, as with any plan, you can adjust it as you go. I suppose any marathon plan will beat you up, but the 2Q plan looks like it will make a good job of it.

+1. I thought about using it myself but I don't think I could survive it without injury (and/or burnout).

But then, I found Hansons to beat me up quite a bit. Maybe you can handle more.

Jack, onemile, it does look hard to me too. I almost added a point to the "What I don't like" section that it looks hard. But when I analyze it in my head, without looking at the table, it seems reasonable:

- One long run or MP run on Sundays. Hard workout, but pretty much all programs have that.

- One mid-week workout. I could follow Daniels' suggestions or do the track workout with the club on wednesdays.

With the rest being Easy running.

The program is not exactly that, but to me, it roughly translates that way. When I look at it that way, it seems reasonable. But I have never went through a MT cycle, thus this tread.

Daniel's plans are tough that's for sure. I haven't done that particular flavour though

Whilst they have gotten my butt into shape and race ready and led to a PR in the half and marathon each of the last few years, I almost always have had to skip one quality day per month, as I simply haven't been able to recover in time to do it.

Does seem to get a little better each year though, so maybe this summer/autumn will be the year I don't skip any.,

There is a lot of LT work in the one I do, and three M paced long runs.

I have not read Daniels, so no input on that (my thought after looking at that chart was "the answer is 42").

 

But if you're interested in bumping up a plan to include the 25-33% MP, I'd sort of spread it out and try not to lump everything onto long runs.

For example, something like the two weeks below would fall in the "meat" of my plans (where the tempo stuff is at the end of the workout).  If the mileage is too high, just scale back using similar percentages.

 

18 with 6 MP	8 easy	10 easy with 2 sets of 5x(2min 5K pace, 2min jog)	15 with 3 MP	6, recovery with 2 HMP	10, easy with 3 prog. MP to 10KP	11, easy with  4 MP	Total: 78 with 21.5 for 27.5% MP or faster
20 with 12 MP	8 recovery	10, easy with 3 MP	8 with 3 HMP	13, easy with 5 MP	10, easy with 3x(1mi 5K pace, 3min jog)	8 easy	Total: 77 with 26 for 34% MP or faster

Lol, yeah Daniels' plans look cryptical if you have not read his book. I forgot about that when I posted.

I had to look up what "the answer is 42" meant. I've learned something today.

Thanks for the input about spreading out the MP miles.

The more I think of it, the more I think I'll go with my own plan. But before making that decision, I'll give the Hansons and Pfitz plans another look. It's been a while since I've looked at them, and although there were things bugging me in both, maybe with a fresher look I'll like one of them, or pick some aspects or workouts to incorporate in my own plan.