Shashi, last fall I had an Ulnar Nerve entrapment in my upper back and arm, then started losing the ability to use two of my fingers. I went to Josh Kollman at Carolina Sports Clinic who's an ironman and serious runner. He won't ask you to stop running unless it's absolutely critical to do so. It's hard to get on his schedule so if you need time to do so, I would also recommend his employee Lauren Jetton She's works in a similar style as he does. Good luck I would attack it aggressively. I needed their assistance, ice, heat, stretching and NSAIDS all in combination to get over it. Mine was partly caused by running, but a large contributor was repetitive motion issues sitting at a computer all day.
Lynwood, no race report on your inaugural marathon? Did you even/negative/positive split? How was the last 10K? Any unplanned stops? Was it pouring cold rain at the start? Inquiring minds want to know?
Rob
Lynwood, that's quite a good time for a first time. Now you have a time to target for the next race.
I too am interested in your pacing, how did the first few miles feel compared to the later miles (duh). We never know the pain of the last 6 miles until we run the marathon , and if we go out a bit fast like I did two years ago, the last hour is not fun at all. I think I hit 20 miles in about 3:05 only to finish the downhill 6 miles in over 80 minutes.
Sorry for the late report, as I didn't know anybody was paying much attention. This is probably my one and only race report.
Well, I've never had a burning desire to run a road marathon, but would like to one day qualify for Boston. I didn't expect to do so Saturday, but I do think I have the speed to run it at 3:30 or below after some experience. I ran this one since I've stupidly agreed to run a 50 mile trail race in June. Big Horn Wild and Scenic in Wyoming. I figured it might be wise to run longer than 13.1 miles before attempting that.
Woke up to cold rain and wind, with temps around 48 and about 15 to 20 mph winds. Great. How nice. I was excited. So I got on the bus and rode over in the rain hoping we could tour around a deserted Myrtle Beach for awhile. I like to see motels and hotels in the dark when its cold and raining. My girlfriend said she might ride back to the hotel since she's already run 3 marathons and was only running a half for fun. I didn't blame her. I was depressed at this point.
We were dropped off about 3/4 of a mile from the start and had to dodge puddles all the way to the start line. I was worried about what would happen to my feet if they got soaked for 26.2. Newbie, so I didn't know. We ended up hiding behind the handicap porta-johns that were tall enough to block the wind and rain. We actually warmed up quickly since it wasn't too cold. Drying off too, as the wind was pushing the rain over the top and away from us. I stepped over to the start about 2 minutes early and lo and behold the ran stopped. Just needed me to show up I guess. I decided to run the race as hard as I was capable with no clue how hard that should be. I've read many of the training books and I've seen all the posts on this site.....blah blah... run it easy all the way... run 20 and race the 10k.... I just ran and didn't care.... I realized after 2 miles I was with the 3:35 group. After 6 miles of this, I thought about what I might look like at 20 miles, and the possibility of making the local MB news, and not in a flattering way. Most likely embarrassing. So I used my superior intellect and let them run their own race and nobody even noticed I dropped them. All of the first 6 miles were into the head wind with 30 to 40 mph gusts I was told. At this point, I decided I better run what I thought was comfortable and ended up running a 1:50 first half and 8:28 pace. Another brilliant choice of mine was to run in my worn out Karhu's, as they were the lightest shoes I owned other than 4 cm drop trail shoes. Ok, I should have bought new shoes, as my legs felt trashed at 10 miles. I have to admit I was worried at 10 miles. Nothing like being a cheap but I won't do that again.
So, I re-evaluated again, and decided to slow down a little more, as I didn't think I could hold that pace either, based on how my legs felt and it was only 10 miles in. I figured I better do something, and somewhat control the situation before it got out of my control. I slowly slowed down. Easy choice. I had no major time goal other than being under 4 hours at this point. I figured if I had any race left in me, I could do it in the last 10K or 5K.
I honestly had no racing in me at 20 miles. It was an easy pace to the finish and yes fairly painful. Nothing major, I just had no way to speed up. I tried a few times and would feel things that were worrisome and I couldn't hold the pace. It was still too far to walk, and I didn't see anybody offering rides. The last 10K felt exactly like I was expecting. Hard. I knew I would make it at this point unless some body part went out of commission, and I really was excited to finish the race. I did pick the pace up the last mile, and especially the last half mile. Ended up running a slower second half around 9:35 and a 9:03 race overall for a 3:57:32. My easy pace. Could have done this and probably suffered less. I had to laugh at myself.
After running this, I can see what I need to do to run at my ability, at this distance. I truly understand how far off the calculators are without the proper training at each distance, but I did what I was capable of the last 18 weeks, and have no regrets how I ran. I could have run easy and raced the last 10k and probably done better. I knew that was a smarter first race choice, but that just didn't interest me. It might for the next one. ha
MTA: Shashi, I think the tempo runs at race pace the Hanson Plan calls for will be critical for me to get good at racing this distance. 6 - 10 mile runs. That would be huge. I just couldn't do it this first time around.
Rob: No un-planned stops. I ran the entire distance, but did walk through one water stop to make sure I drank the entire cup of water. All the rest, I just squeezed the top of the cup and keep running and get what I can. I never felt dehydrated or hit any kind of wall.
Lynwood,
nice race report. I'm sure you'll improve on all of your subsequent race reports (since as I said there are many inquiring minds that want to know). Vegas had the odds at 25%-75% that you would go out too fast and lose bodily function control at the end. I guess they got the first part correct although you suspiciously did not post any race/finish line pictures so there still could be a kernel of truth to the latter. Is the 50 mile trial race near where Sheriff Longmire patrols in Absaroka County, WY (adjacent to Montana)? How do you get there btw (plane to some airport 200 miles away and then the last leg by horse?)? In reading between the lines, it seems you followed the "Jeremy plan" regarding the race vs. the "Hansons plan" (going out fast vs. going out at a comfortable pace and pushing the last 10k). I didn't realize he had that much influence? Even though the rain stopped the conditions sounded really bad w/the wind and wet conditions (were your shoes soaked...they must have weighed 10 lbs over the last 10k)? We all want to know, since again you suspiciously left this out, whether in fact your gf came back to watch you finish or did she sleep in?
Lynwood, I don't think many actually speed up the last 6 miles, just holding the pace would need a major ramp up in effort.
if I could change anything in my training, if I run another marathon it would be to run a medium long run midweek, without which the long run is always a struggle. Tried Hanson' plan for a while, just could not hit the paces, don't recover we'll enough from a Tuesday speed and hit a tempo thursday, and then a medium long Sat and long run Sun was just two workouts too many for the week.
Shashi, I struggled with that also trying to just get into 40 plus mileage. I think I could now handle the mileage and the tempo runs but doubt I could also handle the speed work, plus the other two key workouts.
Rob, I would have let Vegas know it was a 100% chance I was going to go out hard. But not so hard I couldn't keep running. The only JLG influence I have is to make sure I don't end up walking. Ha Yes, my gf stuck out the weather and ran a fine half. She might go back to fulls though. We shall see. I somehow avoided most of the water and kept my feet dry. I jumped a few puddles during the race and by the half way point, the course was clear. Lucked out I guess.
The WY trail race is in the Big Horn Mtns and is on the Montana border. Supposedly no bears as we are well east of Yellowstone. There are moose that sometimes chase the runners and I think the year Karl Meltzer won, he got chased and kicked by one. We will fly into Billings MT and drive down about 120 miles into Sheridan WY. If I get a race picture, I'll post something for proof I survived in one piece.
Lynwood, how are you feeling (how sore were you after)? Did JLG bandit this race also? The Montana border to right where Sheriff Longmire patrols. Are you planning to run any races leading up that WY trail race (did you run any halfs or 10 milers prior to this race?)? Are you kidding about moose chasing and possibly kicking people (a moose kick can kill you -- you no doubt have watched Survivorman and/or Dual Survival)?
Will the Charlotte 10 miler morph into the inaugeral Charlotte 10 mile Mud Run this weekend (how bad is the McMullen greenway)?
I'm no expert, but the smart money says MP runs are far more important than speedwork/VO2Max stuff. I'd drop the TUE speed and make sure the THU run was truly MP and not tempo pace. (I think that's how the Hansons week is structured.)
"I want you to pray as if everything depends on it, but I want you to prepare yourself as if everything depends on you."
-- Dick LeBeau
Lynwood, AWESOME RACE!
Good to see you back running Clive.
I have a feeling my nerve issue is being exacerbated by the low drop Kinvara shoes. Ran in Asics Gel Lyte33 last two days and was able to sleep better without the burning in the leg. Although there is not a big difference in the drop for these two shoes, that 2 mm may be the difference. Will see. May go back up the scale to Asics Cumulus to see if that will help more, even if I hate the heavier/more stacked shoes.
What nerve problem?? (I would have said, "What nerve!" but I'm not a woman living in the 1940s.) It may well be some other difference in the shoes besides that 2mm difference in drop. How does the Lyte33 fit you v. the Kinvara (3? 4?)?
Some nerve somewhere in the hip flexor region is causing numbness and burning pain if I either stretch the hip, or sleep on that leg (I sleep on my side). Will be OK during the run but the burn is mostly after a hard run.
My theory is that the lower heel drop may be stretching out the hip region a bit more than it wants to be flexed. Both shoes fit fairly well although the ASICS is looser (more stretchy) in the heel collar (pull tab? but there isn't a pull tab), and is newer. I'd also say the Aiscs is a bit less structured shoe than the Kinvara. Although I might be jumping the gun a bit here, will have to do a few more runs in newer Kinvaras to support my theory, the current shoes are getting up in age.
Lynwood has suggested a physician who helped with his nerve issues, that is my next step if my theory leads nowhere, this has been a nuisance for a while now.
Thanks Cliff. I'm happy I ran a full to be honest. I didn't think I would care that much for some reason.
Rob, I feel good. I ran about 3 miles of my Monday Run as a recovery run. I've walked a lot since, and honestly I think I will be back to normal by this weekend for an easy run. I'll be good to go this weekend and I'm suppose to run Allen Strickland's 5k next weekend. Not sure how fast I can run a 5k 2 weeks after a full, but it's for a good cause. I was sore until Monday night, but after the Monday run it was gone but still some fatigue. JLG I imagine, is saving himself for this weekend. I'm expecting a JLG Cupids Cup Bandit run.
Yep, the same WY/MT border but probably a little east. Very similar terrain. Hope nobody gets murdered. I think he's suppose to be in the Yellowstone area. Good show, and I need to catch up on this season so I know what to expect. I can bring guns. I'm from SC!
I ran the 4 mile trail race at WWC but I didn't do any others. I wasn't too concerned about the outcome. I figured you could laugh at me if I had to walk it in. Not kidding at all about the moose issues. I'll have to check the website again but I am fairly certain it was Karl Meltzer that got chased and kicked. And recently some other girl, so yes it's something to think about. Yes I they can kill you quickly just like a bear so it does have my attention. Just hope I'm running near slower runners if one comes around. hah
Shashi, sounds like you have a back issue (bulging/herniated disc) as that is always the likely cause when one gets leg numbness in addition to that "burning" pain (which is referential). When you sleep your discs will fill up w/fluid and thus if you have any bulging/herniated disc issue it will become much worse at night and when you get up (and then when your standing up gravity is at work so your discs are not as engorged w/fluid). You may experiment by trying to sleep on one side vs. another as most bulges/herniations occur to one side. You would need to run with shoes with more cushion or at least newer shoes (and immediately discard anything old) -- the Kinarva's are flats so your really stressing your back running in those. You want to do core work so that your core can help support your spine/lumbar and cushion the shock/stress (front planks, side planks, stretch your hamstrings as if they are tight they will pull down on your discs, among other exercises). Don't jump!!
Lynwood, I'm sure they sell "Moose spray" and I'm sure its as effective as the "Bear spray", "Lion spray" and "Cheetah spray" they sell at all stores. Or I'm sure when your there you can buy a "Moose call" which will scare the moose off (whatever you do, please make sure your not distracted and buy the "Moose mating call" by mistake or you will then have even bigger problems).