Low HR Training

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Knees hurt and lower legs are stiff after low HR training (Read 53 times)

Flying Tiger


    I'm new to the low HR training. I was running faster before. I started long distance running about 2 years ago. So far I have ran 1 half marathon and 8 other shorter distance races. I fastest pace was 6:13 minutes for a 1 mile race. I had under 8 for a 4 mile race and under 9 for my half. All of these races were done 2 years ago. I didn't run for any races last year and this year but I've been running 2 to 3 times a week (sometimes less). My knees were injured twice in the past 2 years.

     

    I found this low HR training information recently and started the training for about 2 weeks. I've been running on a track really slowly 5 to 6 days a week. How I feel now is my legs are getting heavier, my knees are hurting and my lower legs are stiff. I can't pick up my legs higher because that will make me jumping and up my HR.

     

    Did anyone else who has done the training ever experience the same issue? Am I doing anything wrong here? And how can I improve the situation? I don't want my knees get injured again. I seem to always have issues running faster or really slow.

     

    Thanks.

      Hi Flying Tiger,

       

      Welcome to the forum.

      Your story is not unfamiliar. There have been others who have reported soreness that they didn't have when they were running faster at higher HR's. The most logical explanations are that you have changed your stride and you are focusing on slow twitch fibers almost exclusively.

       

      You are used to a normal stride rate (turnover), and when you slow down to a speed you haven't really run before, you end up running a bit differently. That alone can do it. But it also could be that you're unconsciously trying to preserve the same stride rate or length, which can cause over-striding and more heel-striking. Sometimes newbie Maffers need to shorten their stride a bit, which will help you either match your former rate more comfortably, or help you increase your turnover to even faster than before. A faster turnover and shorter stride will also help you land more mid-foot, rather than heel-striking.

       

      When you run under MAF, you'll be exhausting those slow twitchers in a way you haven't before. Like using new muscles in new ways. That can add to soreness some.

       

      I hope this makes some sense and helps a little.

       

      --JimmyCool

       

      p.s. Walking can be very helpful in keeping your HR down---it will help your aerobic system.

      log   prs      Crusted Salt comic #141

       

         

        p.s. Walking can be very helpful in keeping your HR down---it will help your aerobic system.

         

        I saw in another post of yours that you're not ready to report on your walk experiment yet but whenever you're ready for it, I'll be curious if you can also make a post on what kind of effects you experience in terms of it helping the aerobic system. e.g. does it improve HR for running or does it just help with faster recovery, etc.?

          I found this low HR training information recently and started the training for about 2 weeks. I've been running on a track really slowly 5 to 6 days a week. How I feel now is my legs are getting heavier, my knees are hurting and my lower legs are stiff. I can't pick up my legs higher because that will make me jumping and up my HR.

           

           

          jimmyb said a lot of good tips to you but here's another thought; maybe 5-6 days is too much for you now. how about you try adding an extra rest day, running only 4-5 days? or maybe just 4. because you said you only ran 2-3 times a week before starting LHR

          Flying Tiger


            Thank you both for your help!

             

            I think I did change my stride. I used to have bigger stride when I was running faster and now I'm having smaller stride which made me feel a little weird. I don't seem to run naturally any more for the low HR range I set up. I tried to adjust my stride length, height, and rate to run comfortably and feel more naturally. But I just can't unless my HR is higher. And I somehow can't get faster turnovers with shorter strides. My body/legs just don't know how to make it work. If I have shorter strides I'll run slower and vice verse. In other words, I only seem to know to run in a faster pace and don't know how to move my legs faster for a slower pace. As soon as I move a little faster, my HR goes higher. Frustrated!

             

            As for landing, I've been trying to land on mid foot but sometimes I might have landed on heels when I wasn't pay enough attention.

             

            I didn't think running 5 to 6 times a week would be too much for me at the beginning of this low HR training. Because I was running a lot faster than now when I was running only 2 to 3 times a week. So I thought I should be able to handle it. On weekdays, I only ran for about 30 minutes in the morning before I go to work. On weekends, I ran for about 1 hour in the morning.

             

            Another reason I run more frequently is because I want to get a good aerobic base built up sooner so that I can start adding some sorts of non aerobic trainings such as speed works, tempo runs and cross-fit trainings such as weight training and rope jumping. I was hoping that after 8 weeks or sooner I will see improvement.

             

            So will the soreness or stiffness go away soon if it's due to the change of focus on slow twitch muscles? How can I get my stride fixed so that my knees won't be in trouble again? I'll change to run only 4 times a week total 2.5 to 3 hrs. Does 3 hours a week sounds reasonable?

             

            Please let me know your thoughts.

             

            Thanks again!

              I think C's advice was good. You upped your frequency rather drastically. Which means the total duration you're running has increased. You can't force your body into developing an aerobic system quickly. If your former injuries are due to running, then most likely they are because of a training load that you forced on your body before it was ready. Don't try to do the same thing with MAF training. I suggest increasing total duration about 5% per week on average. Same if you prefer to run by mileage.

               

              Also, running all your miles on a track has its pitfalls over time. Running in the same direction all the time can cause imbalances. Running on non-track courses always have a little incline, even if they appear flat. Even on roads and bike trails, you need to switch sides to avoid camber-related imbalances.

               

              Could you please share a typical week for you?

              WIth distance and duration.

               

              EXAMPLE:

              m- 5 miles  1:00:00

              T- 3 miles   36:00

              W-5 miles   1:00:00

              T-3 miles  36:00

              F-7 miles  1:30:00

              S-off

              S: 3 miles 1:00:00

               

              What's your aerobic speed?

              Thanks.

              log   prs      Crusted Salt comic #141

               

                I agree it sounds like a little too much too soon.

                If you can, you might want to add a little easy cycling to help with the maf base building.

                This would let you get a lot of the benefits of maf running while stressing different muscles (hopefully not too much!)

                  Opening up your log will also help those that giving you advice some more insite into whats going on. You can have it open to only groups or to the public, I think.

                   

                  The pain that hurts the worse is the imagined pain. One of the most difficult arts of racing is learning to ignore the imagined pain and just live with the present pain (which is always bearable.) - Jeff

                   

                  2014 Goals:

                   

                  Stay healthy

                  Enjoy life