Low HR Training

1

New Maf trainee - MAF test, how? (Read 926 times)


Happy

    I lost a post yesterday and another one today - what's wrong? Is this one posting? I want to do a MAF test. My MAF is 131=180-age Should I try to stay as close to 131 as possible during the entire test (after warm up)? How do I decide which HR to do the test at?
    5K, 4/28/07 24:16 PR 10K, 5/5/07 49:23 PR 1/2 M, 12/08/07 1:49:34 PR Marathon, 12/09/06 3:57:37 BQ 50K, 10/04/2009 7:27:00 PB 40M, 4/17/2010 11:20:00 PB
    Shiksa


    Aerobigal! (thx Jimmy!)

      Hi Flower, Yes, your MAF test will be at your MAF Hr as determined by the 180-age +/- 5 (or -10 if you have been ill a lot or had a major illness/injury/surgery) Try warming up for 15-20 minutes (or maybe even a bit longer) staying about MAF-20 (121 based on your data) Good luck!
      Stacy
      I make no apologies for my liberal use of smiley icons. http://stacyruns.wordpress.com/


      Happy

        Hi Shiksa, Thank you for confirming this - actually, I think MAF-20 would be 111 in my case. My MAF is 131. I am not sure if I need to adjust my MAF up or down - I've only been running with the heart rate monitor for about a week now. It is not very difficult to stay below 131; I only have to deliberately slow down while going uphill. I have been running slowly prior to starting to use the heart rate monitor - slowly by feel a la Lydiard, so I am already used to running comfortably slow. Perhaps this is the reason I don't have as much trouble as some of the other novice LHR trainees are reporting on this forum. One week is too little to judge anything. So far, it has not been difficult though. I noticed in the long post (name?) that you have had good success with your MAF training lately - some impressive progress in your Tests. Do you perform the tests every week or every 14 days? I think I will choose an outdoor area to perform my MAF test rather than the treadmill - I have not felt good on the treadmill lately. I can run some loops (circles) similar to a track inside of a new subdivision - it is almost flat but hard top, not soft like a track. I takes approximately 30 minutes to run over there, so that would be my warm up. How many miles of test should I aim for? Is 1 mile enough or is it better to run 4 miles like I have seen you do?
        5K, 4/28/07 24:16 PR 10K, 5/5/07 49:23 PR 1/2 M, 12/08/07 1:49:34 PR Marathon, 12/09/06 3:57:37 BQ 50K, 10/04/2009 7:27:00 PB 40M, 4/17/2010 11:20:00 PB
        Shiksa


        Aerobigal! (thx Jimmy!)

          I'm quite the mathamatician. Yes, 20 beats below is 111, not 121. Silly me! I did MAF training all last year, and only did a MAF test or two the whole year. However, I think I had chosen the wrong MAF, and after the inital base-building phase, I ran too fast, too often, which unraveled much of the progress I had made unfortunately. This year, I am committed to doing MAF tests, but those were really my first two consistent tests. I had intended to do one every 3 weeks, but read here, that they could be done every 2 weeks. I'm going to aim for every 2-3 weeks. I also chose 3 miles because my training currently has me at lower mileage since I am having to slow way down. My long run is only hitting 6-8 miles, and my weekly runs are around 4-5. So, I chose 3 because I know aerobically, my heart is prepared to run that distance and show accurate results. As my mileage increases as I get faster, I may do a 4 or 5 mile test. The Maffetone book that I have suggests only a 1 mile test. 3-5 makes more sense to me because it shows more accurately the fatique over time (each mile getting slower) and how that relates to training.
          Stacy
          I make no apologies for my liberal use of smiley icons. http://stacyruns.wordpress.com/
            Read the following: http://www.rrca.org/resources/articles/slowdown.html That page is pretty much an excerpt from the first Training For Endurance and from the free material Maffetone has at his website (which I recommend signing up --free--you get access to a lot of articles and interviews) Your MAF is your adjusted number. Use that. Warm-up for 15-20 minutes gradually getting to MAF -10. Then take a few minutes to gradually get your HR up to your MAF. Then begin the test. For a zone, I use MAF -1 to MAF +1. Some use MAF-2 to MAF. Just be consistent from test to test. Also: --If I see MAF +1 more than MAF, I slow the speed. If I see anything over MAF +1, I slow immediately. --If I see MAF-2 or lower, I speed up. --drink in small sips. I find that more than a swallow at a time makes my HR spike, and I have to slow the speed. You can also just stop running and sip, then go. This helps. I use the TM, as I can control the temp, incline, wind, and the fate of the world (my TM is a double-secret event controller.). Outside is fine, just do the same course, making note of the temperature, humidity and wind speed and direction. An MAF-test done in 40 degrees will have a different outcome than one done in 70 degrees and wind. An MAF test can be 1-5 miles, some do more. Since you probably put at least a mile in for a warmup, 6+ miles might be too much for some new runnners. So, a 3 mile tes is fine. Like Maffetone says, even a one mile test will give you valuable information. 5 miles, like Stacey writes, will show you more. Maffetone suggests doing tests every 3-4 weeks as to not to become obsessed with progress (like weighing yourself twice a day to see if you've lost weight yet). To him, obsession with anything just causes undo stress, and stress is the enemy of the aerobic system. Some Maffers do every run like an MAF test, running at the MAF number. Do what is most fun. Every two weeks, every week. Just don't expect progress from week to week. Every 4-6 weeks is more like it. Be prepared to see regression in the opening month--might not happen, might. That is temporary, and will turn around and go the other way. Ooops, gotta go run! --Jimmy

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            Happy

              Shiksa and Jimmy, You have both been a big help. I think I now understand the last pieces of the puzzle - I intend to do a MAF test tomorrow; I could do it today but I think I need a rest day or a very short recovery run tonight - did a long one yesterday and I am feeling undue soreness in a couple of places plus it has been about 10 days since I took a day off. This brings up another question that I have had on my mind about the test. Do you try to always do the same kind of workout (time spent running and same effort) the day before the MAF test? It would seem this would have a big impact on the MAF test. I think keeping as many variables constant as possible will give a more accurate way to compare tests. Jimmy, I think keeping my HR only a couple of BPM below MAF will be rather difficult - I might need to give myself a larger zone/range, for example allow MAF-5 to MAF+1 and then immediately slow down if I get on the +side. Judging by feel only and one week experience with this biofeedback I have a hunch that my MAF is lower than 180-age, thus lower than 131. I find that I feel more comfortable, breath more deeply, relax more, and have a greater awareness of my surroundings when I stay below 125; I may just have to adjust my MAF down by 5 points to 126 - I think Phil Maffetone suggests adjusting by 5 points at a time if adjustments need being done, right? This is going to be very exciting - I look forward to the test. Smile
              5K, 4/28/07 24:16 PR 10K, 5/5/07 49:23 PR 1/2 M, 12/08/07 1:49:34 PR Marathon, 12/09/06 3:57:37 BQ 50K, 10/04/2009 7:27:00 PB 40M, 4/17/2010 11:20:00 PB


              Happy

                As my mileage increases as I get faster, I may do a 4 or 5 mile test.
                Shiksa, You seem very confident that this type of training is going to make you faster - I cross my fingers that I will have this experience myself. When you ran at the wrong MAF last year did you still see improvements in your pace? How do you know it was the wrong MAF?
                5K, 4/28/07 24:16 PR 10K, 5/5/07 49:23 PR 1/2 M, 12/08/07 1:49:34 PR Marathon, 12/09/06 3:57:37 BQ 50K, 10/04/2009 7:27:00 PB 40M, 4/17/2010 11:20:00 PB
                lowgear1


                Max McMaffelow Esq.

                  Shiksa and Jimmy, You have both been a big help. I think I now understand the last pieces of the puzzle - I intend to do a MAF test tomorrow; I could do it today but I think I need a rest day or a very short recovery run tonight - did a long one yesterday and I am feeling undue soreness in a couple of places plus it has been about 10 days since I took a day off. This brings up another question that I have had on my mind about the test. Do you try to always do the same kind of workout (time spent running and same effort) the day before the MAF test? It would seem this would have a big impact on the MAF test. I think keeping as many variables constant as possible will give a more accurate way to compare tests. Jimmy, I think keeping my HR only a couple of BPM below MAF will be rather difficult - I might need to give myself a larger zone/range, for example allow MAF-5 to MAF+1 and then immediately slow down if I get on the +side. Judging by feel only and one week experience with this biofeedback I have a hunch that my MAF is lower than 180-age, thus lower than 131. I find that I feel more comfortable, breath more deeply, relax more, and have a greater awareness of my surroundings when I stay below 125; I may just have to adjust my MAF down by 5 points to 126 - I think Phil Maffetone suggests adjusting by 5 points at a time if adjustments need being done, right? This is going to be very exciting - I look forward to the test. Smile
                  flower, I'm not Jimmy, and/or Shiksa....at least to the best of my knowledge. Don't mean to hyjack, either, but you seem to be spot-on. You'll blossom in no time! About all I can say at this juncture is don't sweat the small stuff. I've been doing my version for quite some time, and the only time I perspire is on the eve of Maf exams. Ooops, can't believe I said that.....My bad. No, honestly, sunshine or not, you will do well. I'm conceived. I mean convinced. lg
                  ♪ ♫ Hey, hey, we're Maf Monkees And people say we monkey around. ♪ ♫ (The Monkees)
                  Give me 12:59 in '09, please. I deserve it! (Maf of course)..No more teens! No more teens! (ME! ME! ME!)
                  ♪ ♫ I Thank The Lord For The Night Time...And I Thank The Lord For You ♪ ♫ (Neil Diamond)
                    Shiksa and Jimmy, You have both been a big help. I think I now understand the last pieces of the puzzle - I intend to do a MAF test tomorrow; I could do it today but I think I need a rest day or a very short recovery run tonight - did a long one yesterday and I am feeling undue soreness in a couple of places plus it has been about 10 days since I took a day off. This brings up another question that I have had on my mind about the test. Do you try to always do the same kind of workout (time spent running and same effort) the day before the MAF test? It would seem this would have a big impact on the MAF test. I think keeping as many variables constant as possible will give a more accurate way to compare tests. Jimmy, I think keeping my HR only a couple of BPM below MAF will be rather difficult - I might need to give myself a larger zone/range, for example allow MAF-5 to MAF+1 and then immediately slow down if I get on the +side. Judging by feel only and one week experience with this biofeedback I have a hunch that my MAF is lower than 180-age, thus lower than 131. I find that I feel more comfortable, breath more deeply, relax more, and have a greater awareness of my surroundings when I stay below 125; I may just have to adjust my MAF down by 5 points to 126 - I think Phil Maffetone suggests adjusting by 5 points at a time if adjustments need being done, right? This is going to be very exciting - I look forward to the test. Smile
                    Whatever your MAF ends up being, a proper MAF test is done AT that HR. It' not very difficult to keep it there. I've never had a problem, even when out of shape. That link I posted explains how to make the adjustments and why. You can always keep your MAF for the tests and train below MAF if you wish. Maffetone guggests a zone of MAF to MAF -10 (121-131 for you). You warm-up slowly to the 121, taking 15-30 minutes, then just hold a pace that keeps you in the zone. You can stay at 121, or let the HR drift up to 131. --Jimmy

                    log   prs      Crusted Salt comic #143

                     

                    Shiksa


                    Aerobigal! (thx Jimmy!)

                      Shiksa, You seem very confident that this type of training is going to make you faster - I cross my fingers that I will have this experience myself. When you ran at the wrong MAF last year did you still see improvements in your pace? How do you know it was the wrong MAF?
                      Maybe I'm overly confident. Big grin Last year, I did see improvement by way of having no injuries and very few illnesses despite having 4 little germ carriers around me at all time. (I adore those germ carriers BTW!) However, by the year's end, I was really no faster than when I had been killing myself at every run trying to run faster. Many in this forum definitely were getting faster. Also, I was overly-optomistic about my MAF. I was 35 then, and really resisted subtracting 5 beats for illness. I tried to just keep it at 180-35 which equaled 145 (Do you trust my math? Tongue) I just kept thinking that not subbing the 5 beats would make me faster. Don't ask me why. It was part of the learning process and getting my head ready to slow down. This year, after the marathon, I made a pact with myself to go ahead and subtract the 5 beats and go to 140. I settled on that instead of 139 (180-36-5) simply because I didn't feel the need to adjust for my birthday since Maffetone doesn't think it's necessary to do it every year. Then, to further my progress, I train during the week at ten beats under my MAF HR as much as possible. I figured this would be built-in protection in case I should be at 139. My MAF tests are reflecting progress. So, I'll keep up the work at this HR. I also don't have plans to go out of the base phase until April which will have me base-building for 5 months. Hope that helps!
                      Stacy
                      I make no apologies for my liberal use of smiley icons. http://stacyruns.wordpress.com/


                      Beginner all over again

                        I'm reading older threads and came across a link for the ".....Slow Down" article and it's become a bad link.

                        I found this article at this link though. Perhaps it's a similar article?

                         

                         Want Speed? Slow Down 

                         

                         

                        http://content.bandzoogle.com/users/cippianhotmail/files/Want_Speed_Slow_Down_2007.pdf 


                         

                          I'm reading older threads and came across a link for the ".....Slow Down" article and it's become a bad link.

                          I found this article at this link though. Perhaps it's a similar article?

                           

                           Want Speed? Slow Down 

                           

                           

                          http://content.bandzoogle.com/users/cippianhotmail/files/Want_Speed_Slow_Down_2007.pdf 

                           

                          I remember that old, handy link, it was taken down this year. All that info on that page can be found on Dr. Phil's Sports Page

                           

                           

                          --Jimmy

                          log   prs      Crusted Salt comic #143