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kinvara 12 issue (Read 73 times)

ivanooze2


    hi guys. so i've been running in the brooks adrenaline ever since I was fitted by road runner sports in california and they work great.

    However, I wanted more of a race specific shoe. I went to another great running store and they recommended i go with the Kinvara 12

     

    -I haven't ran much in them (+/- 50 miles), most of the running is on the track as well. I can feel my soleus start to hurt quite a bit after each run with the K12

    -what can be the cause of this? Is it because the K12 has a 4 mm drop and the adrenalines have a 8-10 mm drop?

    -or is it because the adrenalines are a support shoe and the K12s are.. well I don't know what type of shoe they are other than a race shoe.

    -thanks for any help

      That is a big difference in drop. You will be definitely feeling it in the calf area. Some people can cope with a drop that low but 6mm is as low as I can go. Kinvara is a neutral shoe.

      50+ PBs -  

      5k 18.21 Hagley Parkrun  July 21      82.27 % age grade

      10k TT 37.21 may 2nd 2021 strava run 82.51 % age grade

      Half marathon  1.23.30 may 21 80.11 % age grade

      " If you don't use it you lose it,  but if you use it, it wears out.

      Somewhere in between is about right "      

       


      Train SMART

        I would not make a cold turkey switch with these shoes. It is too big of a switch or make transition over 2-3 months gradually.  Keep the adrenalines as your base shoe and mix in the Kinvaras once or twice a week for your faster runs and for races.

        Run Coach. Founder of SMART Approach Training.

          Yeah what everyone else said.

          Another monkey wrench in your soleus might be an increase in speedwork. New shoes tend to do that; inspire you to test your limits. Kinvaras are also a lot lighter, and that will affect your gait.

           

          So far, I've held myself to only one run in a new pair of NB RC Elite, it's taking a lot of self control! I'm just not ready for a big chunk of fast without reactivating my bad achilles. But I'm looking forward to a set of Yasso 800's or 10x1000 like some people look forward to tropical vacations.

           

           

          (my personal opinion; I greatly dislike RRS. Commissioned salesforce, many aren't even runners. Always trying to upsell "custom insoles" and other high profit margin accessories. I would NOT trust them for good shoe advice. However, SOME employees might be trustworthy, I don't want to throw them all under the bus just because I've personally never had a good experience there)

          55-59 age group  -  University of Oregon alumni  -  Irreverent and Annoying

          ivanooze2


            I definitely see your perspective on upselling at RR, they did it to me as well, that’s the retail business. I’m just grateful they got me in the right shoe

             

            Yeah what everyone else said.

            Another monkey wrench in your soleus might be an increase in speedwork. New shoes tend to do that; inspire you to test your limits. Kinvaras are also a lot lighter, and that will affect your gait.

             

            So far, I've held myself to only one run in a new pair of NB RC Elite, it's taking a lot of self control! I'm just not ready for a big chunk of fast without reactivating my bad achilles. But I'm looking forward to a set of Yasso 800's or 10x1000 like some people look forward to tropical vacations.

             

             

            (my personal opinion; I greatly dislike RRS. Commissioned salesforce, many aren't even runners. Always trying to upsell "custom insoles" and other high profit margin accessories. I would NOT trust them for good shoe advice. However, SOME employees might be trustworthy, I don't want to throw them all under the bus just because I've personally never had a good experience there)

            Marky_Mark_17


              As someone who loved every Kinvara that I got, up to and including the 11, the 12 is a very different shoe and I was not a fan.  It's a very firm shoe, I personally didn't have any soleus issues with it but I did feel my quads getting very beat up when I wore them.

              3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)  

              10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

              * Net downhill course

              Last race: Southern Lakes HM, 7 May, 1:12:42 (May-22)

              Up next: Auckland 10km Road Champs, 20 August

              "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

              ivanooze2


                I guess my next question will be… is there a race shoe similar to the brooks adrenaline (support) that won’t destroy my poor little calves

                  New Balance Prism is a moderate support shoe ok for mid-pack runners to race in. Check out video reviews by Believe In The Run and Runners Warehouse.

                   

                  Of course it depends on the distance. Mile? 5k? Marathon? 100 miler?

                   

                  Kinvarra isn't a race shoe, but you could race in it, and it would likely be a lot better than the heavy Adrenalines. The Prism is also a lightweight trainer, like the Kinvarra. If you want a decent race shoe that you can also do some training in, step up to the Saucony Endorphin Speed. But, keep another pair of true training shoes around for your easy, long, and recovery workouts. Wearing one shoe for all your workouts can lead to injury.

                  55-59 age group  -  University of Oregon alumni  -  Irreverent and Annoying

                  ivanooze2


                    10k and under for distances. will be focusing on triathlons and running races this year rather than crit racing.

                    -1st race of the year will be the redondo beach superbowl 10k

                    what's midpack running?

                      "midpack" refers to the people in the middle of the pack, not the winners/fast age group people, and not the people walking. Basically the average participants in a race, about 2/3 of the people. I think the Bell Curve comes into play here!

                       

                      If you're doing 10k and less distances, your training runs aren't going to be much over 10 miles for the "long runs", so a lightweight trainer would be perfect. You could get away with having a daily all-purpose training shoe, and a speedwork/raceday shoe. I personally use the Skechers MaxRoad as my all-purpose and especially Long/EZ/Recovery shoe. I don't race much, and it's scattered; over the last 5 years I have done no distance between a 3k track race and a 50k trail race, but my tempo and time trial workouts take the places of typical roadrace distances. Thus, the shoes I've used for race effort are Skechers GoMeb Speed6 and NB Rebel (long story, but I have access to Skechers high end shoes for kind of cheap, that's why I have so many different pairs). My race effort shoes are dated, and I'm entering the modern world of plated shoes just now.

                       

                      Anyhoo, Ed Budd just posted a review video that might be of interest to you about do-it-all shoes:

                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4YoPV4hMUk

                      55-59 age group  -  University of Oregon alumni  -  Irreverent and Annoying

                      arunnerd


                      Roads Scholar

                        I agree with the idea of rotating shoes of various types for various reasons.  However, the Kinvara (up through 11) has always been my "favorite" go-to shoe.  If I don't have a reason to run in something else, I run in the Kinvara.

                         

                        Recently I took a chance on a Hoka Rincon 2 that I found for a bargain and I have been very happy with it.  It feels a lot like the Kinvara to me and maybe even fits my feet better.

                        I strive towards laconic wit, my wife says I'm halfway there.

                          

                        arunnerd.blogspot.com

                        Marky_Mark_17


                          I agree with the idea of rotating shoes of various types for various reasons.  However, the Kinvara (up through 11) has always been my "favorite" go-to shoe.  If I don't have a reason to run in something else, I run in the Kinvara.

                           

                          Recently I took a chance on a Hoka Rincon 2 that I found for a bargain and I have been very happy with it.  It feels a lot like the Kinvara to me and maybe even fits my feet better.

                           

                          Yeah, I picked up the Rincon as a potential Kinvara replacement too, funnily enough.  Nice and light, compared to the Kinvara they are a little more cushioned and slightly less responsive, but I really like them so far.

                          3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)  

                          10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

                          * Net downhill course

                          Last race: Southern Lakes HM, 7 May, 1:12:42 (May-22)

                          Up next: Auckland 10km Road Champs, 20 August

                          "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

                            Huge Rincon fan here. I ran most of my miles in the Kinvara 1-11 for about a decade.

                             

                            I run a lot less than I used to but most of my miles now are in the Rincon (currently the 3). Agree it's a little more cushy than the Kinvara but a lot of runners would be fine racing in it.

                            Runners run

                            ivanooze2


                              so after doing some more research. I've concluded that I may need a shoe that has an 8-10mm drop.

                              the Kinvaras only provide a 4mm. whereas the adrenalines provide a 12mm drop, huge difference! as you great folks mentioned earlier

                              so now the hunt is on to find a (support?) shoe that has that drop.

                               

                              So far i'm looking at:

                              Nike pegasus (10mm drop)

                              Nike vaporfly zoomx (8mm drop and crazy $$$)

                              asics metaspeed edge (8mm drop)

                              NB prism (6mm drop)

                               

                              -every shoe I listed are considered neutral (except for the prism which is a support)

                               

                              does anyone have any insight on these shoes at all?

                              -does the arch type matter when choosing any of these shoes?

                              ivanooze2


                                *correction* trying to find a shoe that has a smaller drop that wont kill me

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