So would anyone care to explain VO2... (Read 2241 times)

    I think that's the disconnect.
    I'm telling you, the disconnect is far deeper than that. It has much more to do with the effect of coffee on Trent's brain chemistry than scientific semantics.


    A Dance with Monkeys

      Trent, I'm not sure why we don't understand each other, here. Body mass is part of the VO2max calculation. Why wouldn't a change in body mass result in a change in VO2max? That is a lame retort.
      Sure it is a lame retort, but it is a lame reference. Wink Body mass is part of the equation for a VO2max estimate. It is not part of a true VO2 test (or the Fick equation, linked above, and the Cooper test also at that link). Estimates are limited by being, well, estimates and by being based on representative data from individual activities. Those activities may not represent your true potential. The VO2max has to do with our potential maximal oxygen delivery rate. Most of us never realize it at any point in our lives. We are limited by our weight, our training, etc. So our VO2 for a given activity is always lower than what we are capable of. Lose weight, train, get your nutrition and rest, dump your family and job and then train some more and you will maximize your abilities. In doing so, your oxygen delivery rate will improve to the point where it comes closer to your maximal possible VO2 (i.e., your VO2max). But the maximum possible VO2 itself won't change.
      Because Body Mass isn't part of the equation. See my previous posts about the Fick Equation.
      Yessir! Smile
      Trent, you appear to be using the word "VO2max" to refer to some mythical "potential" VO2max for a given individual. I've been referring to VO2max as something that can be measured. I think that's the disconnect.
      Exactly!! The VO2max is, by definition, your MAXIMAL. Most of us do not achieve that. There is the incorrect belief that our VO2max represents our current maximal effort. Nope. It represents our maximal potential effort...
        Give me a call when you start arguing with toilets about plumbers. I have pills for that.
        To make it happen, or stop it? Cuz those could be fun pills, assuming my toilet will be nice to me. Which it might noy. I've done some horrible things to it.
        E-mail: JakeKnight2002@aol.com
        -----------------------------


        A Saucy Wench

          Forget VO2 or VO2Max. I go for VO5. The existence of VO5 proves that VO2 is not a max. (I now return you to the serious part of this thread)
          *snort* - now wiping the coffee off my keyboard carry on

          I have become Death, the destroyer of electronic gadgets

           

          "When I got too tired to run anymore I just pretended I wasnt tired and kept running anyway" - dd, age 7

            To make it happen, or stop it? Cuz those could be fun pills, assuming my toilet will be nice to me. Which it might noy. I've done some horrible things to it.
            Toilets start out nice, gain your confidence, then it's swirly time.


            I've got a fever...

              Phelps wept.

              On your deathbed, you won't wish that you'd spent more time at the office.  But you will wish that you'd spent more time running.  Because if you had, you wouldn't be on your deathbed.

                Phelps wept.
                POD. Easy. I Diet-Coked.
                E-mail: JakeKnight2002@aol.com
                -----------------------------


                Right on Hereford...

                  Body mass is part of the equation for a VO2max estimate. It is not part of a true VO2 test (or the Fick equation, linked above, and the Cooper test also at that link).
                  Trent, as you well know, VO2max can be expressed as an absolute rate or as a relative rate. The relative rate does include body mass. When someone says he has a VO2max of 65, you know exactly what he's talking about, and it's the latter. And by the way, what kind of measurement is NOT an estimate?
                  Estimates are limited by being, well, estimates and by being based on representative data from individual activities. Those activities may not represent your true potential. The VO2max has to do with our potential maximal oxygen delivery rate. Most of us never realize it at any point in our lives. We are limited by our weight, our training, etc. So our VO2 for a given activity is always lower than what we are capable of. Lose weight, train, get your nutrition and rest, dump your family and job and then train some more and you will maximize your abilities. In doing so, your oxygen delivery rate will improve to the point where it comes closer to your maximal possible VO2 (i.e., your VO2max). But the maximum possible VO2 itself won't change. Exactly!! The VO2max is, by definition, your MAXIMAL. Most of us do not achieve that. There is the incorrect belief that our VO2max represents our current maximal effort. Nope. It represents our maximal potential effort...
                  Show me a definition of VO2max (besides your own) that defines it that way. Your way can't possibly be measured, so what's the point?
                    So do you think this thread has made V02 max easily understandable by the original poster? Or do you think she's now as confused as I am? (Insert easy joke here)
                    E-mail: JakeKnight2002@aol.com
                    -----------------------------


                    A Dance with Monkeys

                      You can measure your VO2max through physiologic testing. This is far less an estimate than what most of us use. This does not include a BMI. But most of us just estimate VO2max based on race results. This is like estimating your maximum potential 5kPR based on your last 5k result.
                      C-R


                        So do you think this thread has made V02 max easily understandable by the original poster? Or do you think she's now as confused as I am? (Insert easy joke here)
                        I'm so confused I don't know whether to wind my butt or scratch my watch. Alternately insert toilet/plumber joke. Sadly I have none of these. Question from the peanut gallery - why does anyone give a flying jump at a rolling donut about Vo2max, submax, midmax or anything else. If you are trying to gauge your potential, run, run more and then run again while making it fast, slow and in between. Run races and see the results - compare - do again. You can do the same for a toilet test however for my money nothing neats the old school Standards. The new low water flushers just don't get the job done if you know what I mean.


                        "He conquers who endures" - Persius
                        "Every workout should have a purpose. Every purpose should link back to achieving a training objective." - Spaniel


                        Right on Hereford...

                          You can measure your VO2max through physiologic testing. This is far less an estimate than what most of us use.
                          Right, and I've had real VO2max tests done on several occasions, as a volunteer research subject for the local university.
                          This does not include a BMI.
                          But it does include body mass. Otherwise, where would they get the "KG" in ml/kg/min? Wink
                          The VO2max has to do with our potential maximal oxygen delivery rate.
                          Funny. How can it possibly be measured if it is defined as our "potential" max O2 delivery rate? And where is that definition? I couldn't find it...
                          obsessor


                            in the least Shocked Confused Cry Dead way possible? Thanks!
                            Apparently, no.
                              Apparently, no. Not a chance in Hell.
                              Minor revision.
                              E-mail: JakeKnight2002@aol.com
                              -----------------------------

                                Question from the peanut gallery - why does anyone give a flying jump at a rolling donut about Vo2max, submax, midmax or anything else. If you are trying to gauge your potential, run, run more and then run again while making it fast, slow and in between. Run races and see the results - compare - do again.
                                Yes
                                E-mail: JakeKnight2002@aol.com
                                -----------------------------